In his fastlane blog, GM Car Czar Maximum Bob Lutz recently whipped-out his jargon generator and "it'll cost X thousand per car more to do this thing everybody wants us to do" excuse to explain why diesel engines ain'tgonnahappen in the American market. At the tail end of the something-less-than-riveting video clip, MB surprised us all, grabbing his lantern and proclaiming "The diesels are coming! The diesels are coming!" According to Bob (not the most reputable source), GM's developing a V6 diesel for passenger cars and a V8 diesel for its SUVs. Autoweek's done the right thing: asking if GM's last foray into diesel-powered passenger cars has killed the concept for all time. Alan Starling, a former chairman of the National Automobile Dealers Association, says he's not worried about GM's dire diesel history. "Those memories are painful for all of us," he says. "But I would rather have that discussion than not see customers at all."
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Autoblog reported GM buying 50% stake in an Italian diesel maker. Apparently thats for consumption in India, China etc.. Also, there is talk about v6 & v8 diesels for NA. Question is why not a four cyl diesel? You dont need more cubic inches for an oil burner especially for midsize vehicles… v6 diesel for midsize vehicles doesnt help as i4 petrol will have less or same ownership costs.
Seth, that is because GM collectively could not find their posteriors with both hands and a flashlight. Petrolheads think solely in the terms of DISPLACEMENT, CYLINDER COUNT, & HORSEPOWER.
Of course, as you stated above, these issues are close to the bottom of the list of importance when it comes to Diesel engines. Logically therefore GM puts them at the top.
I love to ask people while they are riding in my TDI when I’m going very fast: “How much horsepower do you think this engine has?” They usually answer “150, maybe 200” and are shocked when I tell them the truth, which is 90. Yet it pulls like a freight train, and sips fuel through a cocktail straw. My wife drives a Jeep Liberty CRD, blessed with a wonderful Italian 4-cylinder oil-burner. Adding two or four cylinders would only serve to increase fuel consumption and weight… why bother?
Need to pull an oil tanker? Provide power generation measured in MEGAWATTS? Then maybe a 16-Cylinder Turbo Diesel is required for the task. Need to pull a 200-car freight train? Race at Le Mans? Then maybe you need a 10- or 12-cylinder Diesel. Need to pull a multi-ton load on 18 wheels? A 6- or 8-cylinder Diesel will do the trick.
But a Car or SUV? Unless you are towing big loads, a 4 is fine.
Compression Ignition. Think Different.
–chuck
Yet it pulls like a freight train, and sips fuel through a cocktail straw.
When the accelerator is mashed, the VW diesels sold in the US need more than 12 seconds to hit 60 mph. Even a Prius, which is a dog by most measures, can beat the Vee Dub in a straight line. Given all the humble compact cars on American roads that can hit 60 in under 8 seconds, I don’t think that the freight train serves as a good role model.
In any case, GM doesn’t seemed to have learned its lessons. Instead of just doing the obvious — building a mid-size and compact with fantastic styling, great service (including some free maintenance) and a long, easy-to-use warranty that can win back trust and build buzz, they look to electric car concepts that they can’t build and diesels that Americans don’t want.
They need to stop looking for flavors of the month, and instead just build a great product that consumers can love and trust. Consider the new oil burning faux-initiative to be just another nail in a very heavy coffin.
I think this common critique about our collective memory of crappy diesels is way overblown. I’m 41 and I’m too young to have developed any impressions about diesels that came out back in grade school or Jr. High school. Surely the below-40 demographic, except maybe individuals who were total piston-heads as children, lacks any collective memory about diesels from those days.
If you can sell Scions, you can sell diesels.
I suspect there may be a problem though in that people associate diesels with loud, noisy, smelly, foul-polluting semi-tractor truck rigs. That’s the diesels people see.
Kevin, I’m with you – many people were not old enough to be part of the collective memory concerning diesels. And, of the people that were old enough to part of that group, a good-sized portion of them have been reading about the wonderful diesels in Europe for years, and are therefore inoculated against the bad diesel malady.
Diesels are coming en masse to the States (link HERE) and I, for one cannot wait.
More choices = always good.
B Moore – Autosavant.net
Pulls like a freight train is a wonderful analogy. Have you ever seen a loaded freight train pull out? REAL slow to start, and slowly, inorexibly gaining speed. And by the time it tops out on the acceleration, it’s flying.
Sounds like a TDI on the autobahn to me.
Acceleration is overrated anymore. Remember, in the mid-70’s, 12 seconds was considered respectable.
Given all the humble compact cars on American roads that can hit 60 in under 8 seconds, I don’t think that the freight train serves as a good role model.
Freight trains actually are a good role model. Those have painfully slow acceleration too.
judging from the comments above none of the posters must have ever driven, or just been passenger in a modern diesel car. i’d strongly recommend getting a diesel powered rental while traveling across europe, maybe this would help to dispel some of the stubborn stereotypes agianst diesels. the comparison with a freight train seriously is a joke. the often stated ‘sluggish: 0-60 performance is more than adequate under normal driving conditions, and in situations where power really matters, like passing slower vehicles, you’d be surprised how much torque these 4 cyl diesels offer. if that’s not fun enough, your first stop at the pump (after a long distance) will make you smile.
Also missing is mention that a 90hp 150 ft/lbs volkswagen can be made into a 140-150hp 230-250ft/lbs. volkswagen for the princely sum of $500.
injectors and a chip are all you need.
fuel consumption only increases under WOT, most drivers with these upgrades actually report increased mpg (likely due to the ecu reprogramming).
Also missing is mention that a 90hp 150 ft/lbs volkswagen can be made into a 140-150hp 230-250ft/lbs. volkswagen for the princely sum of $500.
You can do that with any turbocharged car. Chipping is a function of manipulating boost characteristics, not whether the car uses diesel or gasoline.
Of course, chipping can be a good way to invalidate a warranty, too. I wouldn’t necessarily recommend it.
Diesel might go over well with a lot of my fellow echo boomers(roughly 18-24 year olds), seeing as diesel power kind of has an anti-establishment, underground vibe to it.
I’ve grown tired of GM bashing. I don’t mean permanently, but just for today I feel like something different. So, I’m going to assume the 6/8 cyl. diesels are a good choice for getting Americans to accept them. I mean, can you really imagine the average SUV buyer feeling comfy with a 4 cyl. ? I mean the buyers of big SUVs of course.
I do agree they need to concentrate on quality build more than anything else, but hey, at least they’re trying something new. The alternative is to be 5 years behind the curve as other manufacturers offer diesel options – and I’m guessing that will be reality very soon.