Well, they would, wouldn't they? In what Spiegel Online calls a "remarkable change of trends," ADAC (the German equivalent of the AAA) says their car-breakdown stats (2m call-outs per year) indicate that VW, BMW and Mercedes are no longer guaranteed to fail. For the past 10 years, Japanese brands have led the ADAC reliability index. In 2003, nine out of ten of the most reliable cars in Germany were Japanese. But in the 2008 rankings, no Toyota made the top ten of least-likely-to-break-down. ADAC attributes the Japanese automaker's fall from grace to their rapid growth. Meanwhile, ADAC says that German carmakers' attention to "quality as reliability" (as opposed to "quality as tight panel gaps") accounts for their "win." Here's the company's rundown of Germany's most reliable machines…
1 – BMW X3
2 – Audi A2
3 – BMW 1-Series
4 – BMW MINI
5 – Mazda 3
6 – Mercedes CLK
7 – Audi A4
8 – BMW 3-Series
9 – Mercedes SLK
10 – Mitsubishi Space Star
As always with stories like these (I’m not criticising TTAC reporting it) it’s all rubbish.
Firstly, GM and Ford have been saying that their reliability is now on par with the Japanese, so where are they in this survey? They still sell cars in Germany, don’t they?
Secondly, pardon my cynicism if I don’t believe a German survey saying that German cars are more reliable than Japanese, when in UK surveys and US ones, German cars are taking a right royal battering over their reliability (Mercedes-Benz, anyone?).
Finally, not only is Toyota not in the top ten of this list, but neither is Honda. Anybody else think this survey might be, shall we say, a little bit uneven….?
Well, if this news is rubbish, then at least we can note that the Germans are better at bribery than they used to be.
I think I understand the psychology of the masses in the three major auto producing countries now:
Japan – “Our cars are the best, as a matter of fact our cars are the only ones you can buy here in any kind of real volume (did we say that our cars are the best?) They also don’t burn any gas or harm the environment”.
Germany – “Our cars are the best. Yes, you can buy a few of those ‘furrin cars’ but – ve have vays to make you rate our autos the vay ve say you should rate dem. Oh, and I-drive is the greatest auto invention of all time, and that little replacement knob part is a steal at $200, that’s quality German plastic, you know”.
United States – “Our cars SUCK! Don’t listen to JD Powers or Consumer Reports (unless they say our cars SUCK!, ’cause then they’re telling the truth. Don’t buy a Buick or Mercury, they SUCK! too, no matter what the surveys say. Please, go and buy an import or transplant. Remember, our cars SUCK!, S-U-C-K !!!”.
windswords I discount JD Powers as I keep my cars longer than 3 years. My current Scion is great after 2 years but then again it better be as well as any other car better be after only 2 years.
Also you can’t pick and choose to use CR when it is convenient. Certainly some, models of american cars are very good but when the stinkers show up then CR is discounted as biased.
Sherman, You need to re-read my post with your sarcasm switch turned on.
KatiePuckrik, if that were rubbish, and if that survey only places German cars highly on reliability, then I suppose you have an explanation for the fact that the same survey had Japanese cars dominating the top-ten for the last 10 years straight…
But I need to read up on that survey and check how they figure in the overall number of cars from a certain maker into that statistic…
I’m just curious as to how this was calculated. If they just added up the absolute number of breakdowns for each model without accounting for the relative market share of those vehicles on the road, then the result wouldn’t be very telling and would naturally favor nameplates that are sold in low volumes.
Also, do any of these manufacturers offer roadside assistance programs that allow owners to get a tow without ADAC knowing about it? If so, that could have an effect as well.
Anyone know if there’s any truth to the rumor that the Japanese cars that the Japanese get are of lower quality than those in the US? And if that’s true, couild something similar be going on in Deutchland? (I doubt it, but…)
I think this once relevant way of gathering reliability statistics no longer works well. This info comes strictly from roadside break-downs. Years ago, when cars were generally less reliable, this made more sense. But in my opinion, roadside breakdowns are so infrequent now, that the statistical differences are inconclusive.
Madcynic,
Actually, I do. In Germany’s home market, they’ve been losing sales and transplants are making inroads. Now, all of a sudden, Japanese cars are losing their reliability and Germans are top dog?
Seems a bit too convient to me…..
As I don’t read German, It is hard for me to assess the credibility of this study. However, a couple of interesting questions to ponder. What were the mean production dates for the cars in the survey? A 2006 BMW may well break down less than 1996 Toyota. On the other hand, did Japanese brands have a high proportion of new design automobiles? Even the new Civic wasn’t immune from first year issues. Also, what constitutes a break down? a flat tire? only a major mechanical failure? Perhaps, the Germans are just offering more run flat tires. Finally, what is the make-up of the ADAC? Perhaps the Germans are just offering better roadside service and thus owners don’t call the ADAC. What can I say…lies, damn lies, and statistics.
Let’s not forget that autos sold overseas and not directly comparable to the ones sold here in the USA. Germans buy more diesels with smaller engines and fewers electonic options such as climate control, hence those autos tend to be more reliable with fewer things that can go wrong. Did you know you can still get a Mercedes in Germany with roll up windows and a manual transmission?
With a name like Space Star I just had to look it up but I’m surprised to find it ended production in 2005. So either they were still selling those leftovers or this survey includes prior model years. If so, it’s even harder to fathom an entire change over of models in the top ten year over year.
The X3 is built in Austria. And our ’04 was definitely not the most reliable German car we have owned.
In response to your manifold questions, I looked into what ADAC has published, and translated some of it. Yes, I know, I should get a life.
Oddly, the most frequent source of breakdowns/call for assistance is a car’s battery. Second most frequent problem is tires… Obviously, not exactly brand-specific matters. Ignition and electric problems follow. Difficulties with the engine amount to about 8%, fuel injection about 7%, cooling and heating 6%, fuel system also about 6%.
90 models from the past 6 years were included in the statistics. Cars could only be included that were manufactured three years in a principally unchanged fashion, and registered sales of at least 10,000 units per year.
What about manufacturer’s roadside assistance programs, as Pch101 asked above? ADAC says that since basically all makers offer these, statistics are not influenced by them.
If anyone says, all this looks mighty flimsy, then I might agree.
On the other hand, the ADAC results are not really counter-intuitive for the greatest part. The losers are the ones I most often see on roadsides, waiting for help: Alfa Romeos, Fiats, Peugeots. On the other hand, the Audi A2 is a car I really miss, since it was both advanced and has a rep for being extremely reliable. Basically, the top ten are pretty well-made cars, except for the Mini: I haven’t the foggiest how that fashion accessory ever got its good rating.
One thing to take into account, at least, is that BMW has developed a more and more efficient roadside assistance service for their customers (at least in Germany). I believe this is at least one of the explanations and goes to show that the Media, when citing statistics, need to become more and more prudent and discerning whilst carrying out additional research before blaring out the conclusions from the authors of the statistics in their headlines…
A real CSI index: How long did the average new car customer KEEP their car. You would have to take out all the lease, repo and fleet vehicles from the list but it certainly could be done.
A real durability index: How many of the cars (percentage wise) are still registered after 15 years.
Everything else is just pure speculation…
Steven Lang: You have a point / points. But with all due respect: even your approaches would include a lot of noise.
Average ownership duration depends very much on incentives and technical progress. If I can get a new car for the same monthly payment as for my present one, and it consumes less fuel, then I’d buy it — even if the present one is just fine.
Durability: people keep cars that are durable — but only if they are inexpensive to repair and service. There are few 20-year old S-class Mercedes on the road over here, but plenty 20-year old VW Golfs. This does not mean the Golfs are more durable — they are only more economical keepers.
And: to base a decision on what car to buy on 15-year-old data sure sounds speculative to my ears.
In the end, we all have to work with incomplete information. We used flawed data, look at anecdotal evidence and rely on trust in a brand when we buy a car.
Another data set that is popular over here in Germany is the 100k / 200k km test. Magazines drive certain models like hell for 12 months. The results, in most cases: Japanese cars are magnificent, French and Italian miserable. And German ones used to be seriously flawed with plenty electronic glitches and minor-but-expensive mechanical failures. But they seem to be improving rapidly. Auto, Motor & Sport just took a Mercedes A-Class to 100k without any unscheduled repair, for example.
Let’s wait and see.
Maybe they put in “Service Due” indicators that require dealer diagnostic equipment to reset.
I’m very interested in finding out how the A4 made it onto the list.