When I was a kid, the family car was American. Not just American, but GM– thanks to a lemony Ford Falcon my mother owned in the 60s. My Dad, however, was a fan of foreign metal. So my sister and I got stuffed into the horrendous backseats of a Renault 8, a Honda Civic CVCC and a Datsun 280Z 2+2. Once we hit soccer practice age, those were dumped in favor of a never-ending string of Pontiacs, Buicks and Chevrolets. We never bought German cars (Nazi associations). Actually, more acurately, my mother would never let my father buy a German car. I didn't even know my old man liked German cars until one day, when I was 13 or so, I dragged him to a Porsche/BMW dealer. He sat in a BMW M5 for a good 30 minutes, just day dreaming. On the flip side, people often tell me they'll never buy an American car. Ever. What's your stance on buying American?
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I used to be firmly in the ‘no way never again’ camp, but have softened my stance somewhat. It’s still not in my plans any time soon, next car is definitely one of the next gen priuses. But I’ve cracked the big 3 door a little bit, so it’s up to them. Lets see if one of them can push it open. I won’t just to be patriotic however, they’ll have to earn it.
Burned too many times by all three of the Det2.8 over the past 35 years. Family as well. Never again.
Even if there was still such a thing as a Japanese/American/German car (and if you follow the supply lines, you know that there really isn’t any such thing), I don’t care.
There are a few badges I dislike for image reasons, such as Buick, Lexus, and Lincoln (yes, “old people’s cars”), or that I find staid (Toyota) or overwrought (Scion, Porsche).
But I really don’t care what is the nationality of the brand behind the car. Euopean makes tend to offer a lot more choice of my favorite type of car, the hatchback, but it’s not to say I wouldn’t look elsewhere (such as that hot Lexus hatchback Arii photoshopped the other day, or the Ope…Saturn Astra).
Oh, and isn’t it funny to see that question, when I’ve seen people telling me that Saturn is Japanese, Acura American, and Hummer German (all actual examples)?
I own a 2004 GM product. I’ve owned Ford and Chrysler products in the past.
This is my last domestic.
Quality is one reason, reputation is another. I really don’t think I need to point out the downfalls with each brand at this point. Then there’s the stealerships for each of the three. Experiences have been mediocre to bad.
I’ve owned a Hyundai and my wife owns a Kia Sedona. The dealerships we purchased these from have had spectacular service compared to what I experienced from the domestic dealerships (granted, I realize not all domestic brand dealerships are bad – I’ve just managed to run into more bad ones than good).
My next car will be a Honda, Toyota, or Hyundai. Until I see a good 10 years improvement in the domestic three’s products I’m not buying another.
My missus thought the Saturn Outlook was cool, until we saw the chintzy interior, and the high price. We bought a 3 year old Volvo XC 90 for her instead…
At this moment, I might consider a German-American or an Aussie-American. But among the “true” MexiCanadAmerican cars, there’s not much interesting me at the moment.
Many of them, like Malibu or Fusion, would be 10x as attractive if offered in wagon form.
In a word, no.
Putting aside reliability issues, styling, whether the dealers will screw me or the worries of whether the corporation will exist should I need to claim. My reasons for not buying american is a little more abstract.
1. I don’t like their management or how their company is run: I REALLY like the Ford Focus Cabriolet, but I refuse to buy one because I have always been critical of Mark Fields and believe he should axed. So, the very thought of my money funding his pension, just makes me sick to the bottom of my stomach.
2. Made in the USA: When I was on holiday in Pasadena (I really recommend Pasadena! Lovely town!) I caught sight of the “American Revolution” advert and I didn’t know whether to wet myself laughing or hurl the TV out of the window! What was that saying about “Patriotism being the last bastion of a scoundrel?”. And when I see adverts like that, it puts me off of that company, no matter how good their products are. If Toyota starting bellowing about how “Japanese they are”, then I’d stop buying them, too! The fact they tried to wrap themselves in the American flag, made me think twice…
Let the flaming begin!
But this all begs the question of “What is American,” etc. A U.S. company that assembles the vehicle in the U.S. plus contains a majority of domestic parts content? On the other end, does a Mazda3 count (built in Japan around a Ford-Volvo Europe platform and with Ford owning a controlling share of the company)?
Katie, do you live in the U.K. per chance? So are you considering Ford Europe + Vauxhall / Opel as “American”? For some reason, I doubt that Mark “the Mullet” Fields had much to do with the C-1 Platform Focus.
After the self-destruction of multiple family cars, I’m pretty closed to it until they are better (not just as good as) the alternatives. My 2 Hondas (put together in Ohio) have been fantastic, and I’m not against a car designed, engineered, and assembled by Americans, just the Big 3.
Anyone want to buy up some of these empty plants, and start something up? :)
I would definitely buy American if there were an American car that appealed to me. I tend to be interested in the near luxury performance coupes with RWD.
I wouldn’t use the fact that I’ve seen crap cars or recieved poor treatment from dealers or had way too much knowlege of the f’ed up things that happen in the inner workings of a company to guide all of my future decisions. Companies change drastically over time. People who bought early Japanese cars and swore them off would be mightily suprised if they checked out a recent example just as a Porsche enthusiast would be shocked ecounter that ugly pig SUV they now produce.
I’d buy a Cadillac or Buick, but will likely stick with Lexus and Acura.
I’d consider it if they made the right car, which they won’t. Too much testosterone and macho posing from most American companies (Cadillac, I am looking at you) combined with crap resale values.
Saturn’s seem pretty nice nowadays, but I am sure they will bloat up to be just as American as the rest of the brands.
My 98 Boxster is still ten times better than any car coming out of Detroit today including the XLR.
Well Katie—fair point until you see Toyota wrapping themselves in the American Flag with their made in Kentucky adverts. I wished they didn’t (or any other manufacturer). Sell the car on its merits and an ad campaign that is a little more clever than that.
BTW—I will continue to buy from US Based manufacturers. They have given me better reliability and value for my money than VW or BMW ever have….although it was nice to know my VW and BMW service advisors by name :) If I were to go Japanese however—it would be Honda—or Acura—most likely the TL. Never ever would buy a Hyundai.
Well, I’m not quite ready to buy American, because I care for my money and want to limit the rapid depreciation of american nameplates.
But for the first time in… heck as long as I can remember, there *is* an American car that has me lusting after it:
The 2008 Cadillac CTS.
What an interior! Move over Audi, this is the new standard in design, materials and aesthetics (but not build quality, unfortunately). And that aggressive exterior coupe styling on a sedan with a still-useful backseat. The just-right size, bigger than the shouldn’t-be-called-a-sedan IS350, but more “intimate” than a 5-series.
Did I mention the interior? That center-stack alone is worth the price of admission. Since we spend most of our time *inside* a car, it would be bliss everytime.
…But I’m not ready to *buy* it. Sorry.
detroit1701
I doubt Mark “What am I good for?” Fields had very little to do with the engineering of the car. But the profits from the sale of the car, goes back to Ford Detroit. And someone has to pay Mr Fields….not with my money, they won’t!
Sure – I own two Japanese-branded vehicles now (08 Sienna Limited AWD and 04 Accord EX V6) and bought them because they were the best options in their respective classes at the time. The Accord was chosen instead of an ’04 Grand Prix or Malibu (ugh) and the Sienna was chosen over an Enclave (the Buick was more expensive with fewer features, and couldn’t match the Toyota’s sliding doors).
But I’m most interested now in a Pontiac G8 GT or Cadillac CTS DI to replace the Accord. I really don’t like the current Accord, and I don’t want four more years in such a similar car. Even though my Honda’s been great to me, I’m tired of it and want something more luxurious or faster.
The wild card is the 2009 Honda Fit, which would make a great commuter car, but I’d like the Fit’s handling and gas mileage in a bigger, more luxurious car. And the gas savings would be something like $50 per month over my Accord (assuming 30 mpg instead of 22 mpg).
also to all intersted in this question of the day..and if Jonny doesn’t mind—can we re-frame the question as buy American New OR Used ? By taking the depreciation hit off the table—it may open the discussion a bit more
I have bought several American cars because they can be EXCELLENT VALUES when compared to their Toyonda counterpart. You just have to do your homework, and understand which Big 3 models are underpriced values, and which should be avoided.
I own three American cars now, they all have over 110K and all have had virtually zero problems, except for annoying things like door locks and window motors.
I will be buying American cars in the future as well. We are looking at buying a late model Jeep GC or Commander, preferably a 6-banger, they are really affordable right now.
Writing off an entire country’s products based on a few (or even a lot) past experiences is ridiculous. I own an American car because with my priorities (speed, styling, handling) it was by far the best car I could get in the price range (2006 Corvette). Nothing except the Boxster/Cayman twins even comes close. There aren’t that many other American cars that appeal to me (I’ve always loved Caddys and the new CTS is really nice, so is the G8), but I’m not going to write off the cars of an entire nation because my mom’s old Buick was garbage (it really was). If I were to use that experience and swear off American cars, or GM in general, I would have made the mistake of not considering the perfect car for my needs. It would have been my loss
akatsuki :
There is nothing wrong with testosterone. In nearly every aspect, a Vette is either competitive with, or superior to a Boxster, especially one from 98. The Boxster is more nimble, the Vette is much more powerful. The Boxster has a better gearshift, the Vette will smoke it around most racetracks. The Boxster might have better interior materials, the Vette has a Heads Up Display and G-Meter. It’s pretty much a coin flip between a Vette and Boxster/Cayman-there isn’t nearly as much difference between the two cars as you would make it sound. I know because I spent months trying to decide between the two
I’m not American either, so it’s not like I’m being patriotic or anything
Never have and never will buy an import car. I will always buy American car[unless someone starts a auto company in Canada]. No matter where its built more of my cash stays in North America when I purchase from the American 2.8 companies.
I bought a Ford in the mid 80’s that was a world class POS. Until Ford repays me the money I spent on that car I will never buy another Ford. I have owned Hondas, an Acura and now have three Toyotas and I’ve been very pleased with their products and would buy them again. Chrysler is a dead man walking so they are out of consideration. I owned a VW that I liked but the reliability was the pits. I also have a real problem with Ford and GM executive salaries. Are they paid to drive the companies into the ground? There is all carrot and no stick in their compensation packages. It’s a disgrace and my aversion to contributing to their coffers would stop me from buying.
It depends…my 2003 Accord EX has been a great car, but I’m disappointed in the new version. Too big, the fuel economy is worse according to many testers and some of the styling details are awkward.
The 2010 Ford Fusion will feature an upgraded interior, better engines and a facelift…it debuts in December 2009. Given the current car’s reliability ratings, the revamped version is on my shopping list, depending on how the successful the makeover is. If the makeover doesn’t work, I’ll go with a Honda Civic EX sedan.
Buy a North American made car again? Not in my foreseeable future. I’ve got a hyundai now and my next one is the Mazda RX8. That car really rocks it!
First of all, American or Japanese, I’ve never bought a brand new car, and probably never will. I believe in buying a car that’s 1 or 2 years old and letting some other fool take that initial depreciation hit when the car leaves the lot.
Secondly, is an Australian-sourced Pontiac really an American car? If so, then yes, I may buy [used] American again.
Sure, I’ll be American again… A certified used one with no more than 40k miles, an extended warranty, for less than half of the original sticker. Must also not be more than 3 yrs old.
Ford of Europe is American. Ford is an American company producing products and is doing business in Europe. The profits made in Europe by Ford come back to America and support the company here at home. Just as Toyota does business and builds it’s wares worldwide and brings the profits home to Japan. A BMW built in Spartanburg or South Africa isn’t any less German than one assembled in the Fatherland, it’s all BMW, all German and it all goes back to Germany. Coke, McDonalds, etc are all American and sold wordlwide. It’s pretty cut and dry.
I have an old American beater in my garage along with my new car right now. I’ve had the beater for 10 years and it has nearly 300,000 original miles on it. It’s never needed anything aside from minor repairs and maintence. It’s a 1992 LeSabre and pretty much all of GM’s fullsize 3800 cars last forever and don’t cost much to operate.
My last new car purchase was from GM too. The car is Australian, engineered and assembled in Australia and imported here. The profits from the car stay home here in the US just as the profits GM’s Holden division in Australia come back here to America.
The car is a 2006 GTO and it’s been spectacular in every respect. The trim, the workmanship, body integrity, driving dynamics, design and powertrain are stellar.
It is thrilling to drive, I covet owning it and being bright orange it attracts quite a bit of attention, questions and thumbs up. That’s not something you get from the vast majority of Asian cars sold here, especially ones that you could get new for under $30k.
The dealership I purchased the car from gave me an excellent price under MSRP and has treated me extremely well. I often get it maintained at a different dealership that is no different.
Not all dealerships are the same of course, and that goes for foreign dealerships with less than stellar customer service.
Would I buy another product from an American company again? Absolutely. Sure they have made many completely disposable crap cars but they also have made many excellent cars. No different than companies like Hyundai.
In fact US automakers sell quite a few vehicles right now I would have no second thoughts purchasing from the little Saturn Astra to the big Super Duty F-150 and cool cars like the Dodge Challenger and upcoming Camaro.
ah the world has changed but some of our perceptions remain the same. As a senior member of the “I love cars brigrade,” I can recall when where a car was made really did make a difference. In the 1950’s and 1960’s the German/Swedish cars really were stronger and put to together tighter, the American cars were more powerful, comfortable, fairly reliable and less costly to repair, while the Japanese cars were very cheap and flimsy.
The French and Italian cars were novel and not known for reliability while the British seemed to be only ones making affordable sports cars; the MGA and MGB, the Triumph TRs and the Austin Healey.
All of this began to change in the 1970’s. Today each manufacture plays up the positive aspects of its heritage and people tend to overlook the facts.
Facts: 1.The German/Swedish reliability is no better and often worse than American and Japanese products. Take a look at Consumer Reports or ask the man who owns one.
2. American cars are no longer the most powerful or comfortable. The MB and BMW have some fairly high horsepower engines now and even the Japanese Lexus, Infiniti models have some horsepower that was missing 20 years ago. Comfort seems to be fairly consistent with most all cars now having air conditioning and adjustable seating.
3. The French and Italians are no longer exporting to the US market so any comments are irrelevant.
4. The Japanese cars are now the reliability champs, again see Consumer Reports, and as the other manufacturers began to design and build for better fuel economy styling differences quickly yielded to wind tunnel solutions and the use of lighter materials. The result being that most consumers cannot tell one car from another without the aid of the “BADGE” on the hood or trunk lid.
So while the question of whether or not a country of origin for a car is relevant, the answer is, “it used to be very relevant, but not so much anymore.” Which car you buy today probably has more to do with your buying experience, income and how much you value what others think of you.
The buying experience can be so distasteful that someone making it a pleasant experience will get the business. I think this was what brought so many MB, Cadillac and Lincoln owners to the Lexus showroom in the 1990’s. And as always money talks and snob appeal still exists.
Personally I have purchased one or more of each with the exception of Italian and British. My favorite is either the Citroen DS21 or the Porsche 911. Today I am driving American and Japanese because I still have a child in college. After graduation maybe I will look at the Porsche.
Everyone talks about the domestic “stealerships”.
Maybe it’s all relative, but imports also have “sealerships”.
I saved over $500 by not going to my stealership to get the brakes and struts on my ’03 Odyssey done.
They’re _all_bad_. Possibly we’re talking about degrees of evil here, but I think it needs to be mentioned.
After buying only American cars for the past 35 years, I have bought my last one. Not so much that I don’t like American cars, but after being told that poor build quality, unreliability and my car literally falling apart while under warranty was my fault by one of GM’s regional managers, they don’t want me as a customer. It was a big eye opener what I was missing when I bought my current import car. I couldn’t be happier except for seeing once might American companies unable to turn themselves around.
I wouldn’t mind buying a car with a large enthusiast fanbase – because I know support for such vehicles will always be there in one way or another. I know that there will always be guys who are able to work on Mustangs, even if FoMoCo isn’t around one day to do it.
Also, I think C11 or C7 for these guys doesn’t spell the end of the brand. If anything, many foreign firms would love to pick up pieces of the bruised American brands, and will probably continue to offer servicing.
But that’s all based on a tempered view of things. Consumers are not tempered, they’re impulsive and just the stink of bankruptcy (without even filing) is enough to drive people away in droves. Perception here is what is the killer.
I’d buy a Ford GT in a heartbeat, rusty nuts (the car’s) and all. The Fusion handles like a dream, so I’d consider one them too. An F-150 ‘fer sure. The Mustang GT makes BEAUTIFUL music. So put that on the list. GM, well, I’m betting they it goes tits up. So while the Silverado’s great at what it does (don’t they pay you to buy one these days?) and the CTS-V is a hoot, I don’t want to buy from a car company headed headed for C11. Chrysler X 2. And I can’t think of a single Chrysler product I’d like to buy.
Absolutely, I’d love to buy American, if only to make a politically incorrect statement about accepted Yuppie sensibilities. You know, that whole rebel thing. The problem is they just haven’t come up with the right car yet.
I keep trying to buy a Corvette, but it keeps feeling too big, actual weight and dimensions notwithstanding. The Mustang is appealing (if a bit bulky) on the outside, but it’s hard to imagine spending much time indoors. The CTS coupe looks nice in photos, but the last generation sedan I drove didn’t impress.
I’m keeping an open mind about this one.
I’ll buy whatever appleals to me, whether it’s the old SRT-4 neon’s, an HHR SS, or a Civic Si. My past experience includes two Sables, two Caravans, a Probe, and an Escort, the only one that ever gave me any serious trouble was the Probe.
Not enough for me to hold a grudge, sorry.
Will the question tomorrow be “Will You Buy Japanese?”
Anyway, the answer to your question is “I already do”, but like some previous posters, I’ve only bought used up to this point and my tastes are on the traditional side so that leads me to basically 2wd trucks and full-size American cars, which are both niche vehicles in Canada and getting harder to find by the second.
And, like a previous commenter, I too am not American so the patriotic factor is moot.
I’ll buy the best damned car I can afford – no matter where it comes from.
I have been happy (this may make you laugh) with my 1998 Chrysler Concorde. I like the fact that is has an honest to goodness back seat in which I can fit and a huge trunk. It has had a few electrical issues,but other than that has been reliable. Forget the new Chryslers-Cerberus; I find that the 300 hits the sweet spot by being both ugly and impractical.
I am intrigued by the new Accord (I want a full-size car), and may replace the Concorde with one when it finally gives it up. Alternatively, I like the looks of the 2010 Ford Taurus, especially if it is as spacious as the current Taurus (which seems like a competent sedan, but is kinda ugly).
I cannot bring myself to buy an Avalon. Even if the Concorde is a bit odd looking, at least it doesn’t look as _stale_ as a Toyota does after about 3 years (just my opinion, of course). The Lucerne is too fuel-inefficient for the (lack of) performance.
So sure, I’d buy a Ford.
LOL @ “rusty nuts (the car’s) and all“!
Robert Farago :
“I’d buy a Ford GT in a heartbeat, rusty nuts (the car’s) and all.”
I assume you’re talking about the original Ford GT40? That great American car which was engineered by Lola, Cooper and Lotus?
You know, those BRITISH companies….? ;O)
The number of American cars I’d consider is increasing. Among them would be the CTS (wagon!), Mustang (probably Bullitt), Corvette (of course), maybe G8 or Silverado if I was in the market for a truck.
However, I have to admit that the vast majority of cars I’d consider are still German or Japanese.
Define “American”
All things being equal or reasonably close, sure, in a heartbeat. The problem today is, as SherbornSean asked above, how do you define American? US-headquartered company, even if they really make it in Canada (okay, kinda like US) or Mexico? What if they import it from Korea? Is it still American? What if it’s domestically-made (at least partly) Accord?
Perhaps if there was a reliable indicator of how much of the product value is US-originated, that would help.
I’d buy a car from any country that played the world trade game in a fair fashion. Until recently, that ruled Korean cars out. Certainly, I won’t be buying anything Chinese for quite some time.
And American cars, here in Germany? They are either pathetic (Chrysler), non-existent (Ford US), or they just don’t try hard enough. Anybody interested in a Cadillac here in Europe better get used to the idea that they’ll be paying more, getting less, and be enjoying a worse after-sales experience.
If I was to spend a few months in the US, what I’d buy would be a Panther Ford. I drove a Nova for a few weeks in the 1980s and it was quite unforgettable.
I bought my first brand new car when I was 21 (Ford). Since then I have had six other brand new cars. Three Toyotas, Two Hondas, and one Subaru. I will not consider another American or Japanese built in America auto anytime soon. When I shop around for a new car one of the four things it must be is built 100% in Japan. When America builds an automobile that is of the same quality of a Yota, Subie, or Honda then we can talk. I will demand a five year track record and strong resale value too.
Good Luck Detroit, we all know you need it.
Ryan E
I have worked for one of the big 3 for 30 years and right from the beginning I could never stomach, crawling in and out of a Pinto 500 times a day putting them together with more black tape and putty then hardware so I ended up in a VW. As I advanced through the management chain and watched cars being designed more by accountants then engineers I liked the Big 3 cars less. I started buying 3 year old luxury German cars, letting someone else eat the depreciation and still had a better car than a new US version.
My 1987 Quattro Turbo had express windows and memory seats which I recently saw in an add for a US car as if it was something new. A couple of years ago I couldn’t resist the price my retired father gave me on a 3 year old barely driven, Dodge Grand Caravan, almost a give away. I have never has so much trouble with electronics, brakes, A/C systems, suspension parts and minor nuisances as in driving 30 years of European cars. Never again! Next car based on performance of wife’s Hyundai Elantra and great service experience, a new Sonata or slightly used Audi.
Without being too blunt about it, I think people who refuse to consider an American car, as well as those who refuse to consider an Import are being absolutely idiotic, although for different reasons. My only solace is that these people are really only cheating themselves. I have only been a car owner for 2 years and have already enjoyed the best of what Japan (Lexus GS400) and America (C6 Corvette) has to offer
Robert:
Do you really see GM going bankrupt before Ford? I would have thought it would be the other way around. Their ridiculous # of brands notwithstanding, GM seems to have the more compelling product lineup (Malibu, CTS, Corvette, G8, Lambdas, etc.) while Ford seems to offer little apart from the F-150 and countless versions of the Mustang.
KatiePuckrik :
Does it not get tiring to feel compelled to bash American cars/America endlessly? Often without logical reason for doing so?
thetopdog,
Well, if Jeremy Clarkson can make a career out of it…… :O)
how many people in only 10 years ago said that Hyundia was C-rap and said they would never buy one?
now, they make some of the nicest appliances around…
So, to say: never american again, might be a bit of a stretch – unless you are over 60 years old…
if america can make a competent vehicle for my given needs at the time, i would definitely give it thorough comparison with the ‘foreign’ competition…
for anything under 25k (what I’m most familiar with), the only american car i might consider – depending – would the the saturn astra, or pontiac vibe…
wouldn’t even look at the malibu compared to an accord… (I-4) based on msrp and engine / transmissions offered…
I will look at the various options I have as a consumer and make a rational economic decision based on price, value, expected depreciation, expected maintenance costs, and various personal preferences.
Am I supposed to do something else?
Will I buy American? Probably not.
Would I buy American? I’d consider it.
The American car companies strike me as being a lot like the New England industrial cities I grew up in and around…A huge gap between the haves and the have-nots.
On one hand, the American companies are perfectly capable of designing and building fantastic cars like the Corvette or full-size trucks. In recent years, their family cars have also improved greatly, the Fusion, Charger and Malibu, for example.
However, I’m not in the market for a balls-out sports car like a ‘Vette, or a full-size truck or a family sedan. My next car will be a small-ish, relatively fun-to-drive economical car, and what does Detroit offer me in that regard? The Cobalt? The Focus? The freakin’ Caliber?
I think not.
All three could be reliable, fun-to-drive and economical, but I’d also like a bit of style and those three got none. As it’s been since sometime in the early 1970s, American cars, with a few exceptions, look as if they’ve skipped the design phase…straight to assembly.
Not too long ago I saw an old magazine ad for the K-Car (one of which I owned when I was in college) it was a pic of the car, brown I think and all the ad said was “America isn’t going to be pushed around anymore.”
Right.
-Matt
The short answer is, “No”.
We really liked the Buick Enclave, but bought an Infiniti FX. We have been burned too many times by substandard Detroit-3 quality and unethical customer relations to underwrite the risk inherent in buying domestic.
the ONLY “American” car in the running for any of my consideration is the new Cadillac CTS.
simply because it doesn’t embody anything that screams “AMERICAN CAR” (ie- honky-tonk lazy-revving V8, 4-speed automatic, nauseating body roll, horrible build quality, second-rate interior, etc…although there is nothing like GM air-conditioning units.)
this coming from a guy who was raised in a family who drove nothing but “American” vehicles until about 1999.
1.The German/Swedish reliability is no better and often worse than American and Japanese products. Take a look at Consumer Reports or ask the man who owns one.
Personally, I don’t put much stock in Consumer Reports or J.D. Power and Associates. I think most of the cars being sold today are pretty reliable. I just got an email to do the Consumer Reports automotive reliability survey and the first question about reliability made me laugh. Basically, it asked if I had any serious problems with particular systems on the car. What seems funny to me is that there was no definition of serious. Is a non-working power window serious? What about a blown speaker? I would assume a blown engine is serious, but what about an engine that leaks oil slowly?
One man’s serious problem is another man’s minor irritation.
Having said that, there just aren’t many American cars I like although I do like Ford and Chevy truck products. The Malibu doesn’t look too bad, and I certainly like the G8, at least on paper.
The bottom line is that I prefer RWD cars so the G8 will get a look along with BMW and maybe Mercedes (probably a certified used car on those two).
I like the Ford and Chevy trucks, but the Toyota and Nissan trucks are worth considering as well. In SUVs, I prefer something with some off-road ability, so a Wrangler or an H3 would get a look along with the FJ Cruiser and maybe a certified LR3.
The last time I went car shopping for myself, my criteria was for a stick-shift V6 sport sedan under $15,000 (used). Unfortunately, there just weren’t many (if any) “American” options with that criteria. So, I replaced my Contour SVT with a Maxima 6-speed.
I agree with everybody here that there are some amazing American vehicles right now. I can’t remember the last time I was as in love with a car as the CTS. However, a car that costs that much is not in my future (by choice).
Somebody above said it best, “I’ll buy the best damned car I can afford – no matter where it comes from.”
I’ve only ever owned American cars and am on my first new one (06 Jeep Rubicon). The full-size Blazer I traded for the Jeep had 267,000 miles on it and was in fantastic condition. It was a pity to see it go.
I have no objection to foreign brands. Right now, I’d love a Subaru, Mazda or a Volvo as an additional vehicle. I would not be interested in a Toyota, the Korean manufacturers, or most German cars. BMW’s are attractive for the most part, but a bit too high-brow for my tastes.
America still has its share of good products and the list is growing except for Chrysler, which has lost focus. Ford and GM pick-ups are top-notch, the Ford Ranger stands out as a great little compact truck in a sea of mid-sized mediocrity. The Mustang does what it does well, and both Ford and GM have respectable sedans-Fusion and Malibu.
America only produces two true performance vehicles, the Chevrolet Corvette and the Jeep Wrangler, but both of these are right at the top of their classes.
The only one of the big 3 I have had luck with are Fords (Ranger/T-Bird/Taurus).
My experience with GM has left me with less than favorable things to say about them, whether it be Pontiac (Grand-Prix/Fiero), GMC(Jimmy), or Chevrolet(Impala/Blazer/Suburban/Malibu). I will never, NEVER, purchase another GM vehicle again.
I would consider a Dodge Truck, or Jeep Wrangler, but have never owned a Chrysler brand.
The best experiences have been Isuzu and Subaru. Trooper with over 200,000 miles when sold and my Rodeo currently has 193,000 miles on it and not even a leak, just uses about a quart of oil between changes. Rodeo was built in Indiana under the Subaru/Isuzu partnership there. Old Subaru Justy had 245,000 miles when I sold it with a shot clutch for $500. And the A/C still worked as good as the day it was purchased new for $6,800.
I am looking to trade the wife’s Taurus for a Mazda 3 Hatchback in the next few months. After test driving small cars in the past couple of months the 3 blows them all away save for the Civic. But the 4 door Civic is ugly and they are about 3 to 4 grand more for a comparably equipped one compared to the 3.
I think GM and Ford need to offer bumper-to-bumper 10 year/100,000 mile warranties. I think that because Hyundai did that, and proved that the cars were actually reliable gave people the freedom to give them a try. I know a lot of people who would give an American car a try again if there was no “risk” in reliability to them.
I will buy a new, American car again. I am a bit perturbed about car executive salaries. I guess what annoys me is the lack of tie in to their performance.
The wife and I have had 2 VWs, 2 Plymouths, and 1 Jeep. The only disappointment has come from owning the latest VW.
Growing up, my family has had VWs, Toyotas, Mazdas, Dodges, Chevys, an Oldsmobile, and Fords. I much prefer the American cars and have not seen the terrible reliability of the Americans a lot of people speak about.
The lack of a stick shift V6 in most American cars is definitely a bummer. I prefer stick, but would consider a decent auto with the sequential shift gate. You can’t even get that in the Fusion. It’s ridiculous for a car marketed as being fun to drive.
While we’re on transmissions, I don’t know why people are so transfixed by six-speed automatics. GM has been making four speed autos for ages and they’re arguably the best part of any GM car. Drive one and you’ll wonder why companies feel the need to have five, six or seven-speed autoboxes.
-Matt
Depends on the car. Right now we own two of the most durable, reliable vehicles sold in the United States – a Toyota Corolla and a Mercury Grand Marquis.
For durability, longevity, and cost of ownership, they are both among the best, regardless of nationality.
That being said, I think each generation of Toyota’s get worse, and the Mercury is going away someday – at least Ford keeps trying to kill it.
To be honest, new cars are so overstuffed with useless electronics and crappy features, I might just buy used Grand Marquis for myself as long as possible, though a small station wagon is our next purchase as a family around-town car.
The choices are getting more and more limited every year.
I would, and will, continue to buy American. My family has owned several Ford products, a few GM products, a few Mercedes products, and 1 Honda product. All have performed flawlessly, except the GM…but it was a company car, so no real money lost there.
My current Ford is a Mazda 3 wagon…gem of a vehicle. However it’s trump card over Ford-badged Fords is that it’s made in Japan.
It really comes down to what is offered for what my needs are, Honda didn’t offer a 5-door sport wagon (they did have a 3-door Civic Si though) and their styling and driving dynamics have gone downhill a bit.
I don’t buy a vehicle based on the image I hope to project by driving it or that it’s capabilities will suddenly make my life more awesome. Yeah, I’d like a Mustang GT but besides the sound and acceleration, it would become a PITA as a daily (for a multitude of reasons), forget about a camping trip with bikes and 2 people. A truck or BOF SUV would be nice sometimes, but as a daily driver it’s completely unneccessary. And I’m not really going to be fording rivers. A sport wagon fullfills every need I have, but with a 2.3l 4 it’s not the quickest or most “manly” vehicle out there.
Maybe an Alfa wagon would be nice…are Italian cars any better than they used to be? At least as good as Americans?
Yes, I’ll buy American. Probably something made in Ohio, with the letter H on the front.
Ford of Europe is American. Ford is an American company producing products and is doing business in Europe. The profits made in Europe by Ford come back to America and support the company here at home. Just as Toyota does business and builds it’s wares worldwide and brings the profits home to Japan. A BMW built in Spartanburg or South Africa isn’t any less German than one assembled in the Fatherland, it’s all BMW, all German and it all goes back to Germany. Coke, McDonalds, etc are all American and sold wordlwide. It’s pretty cut and dry.
To take your view a step further, if you live in Missouri you should refuse to buy 2.8 cars because the profits go back to Detroit.
Does it really matter where the profits go? Honda and Toyota apparently put much of the profit back into the product, which means more sales, and therefore jobs here in the USA.
I would submit that a BMW built in Spartanburg is both more American and less German than one built in the Fatherland. Those are Americans working in that factory. Those are Americans working for the American parts suppliers. Those are Americans trucking those Bimmers to the dealers. Those are American salesmen, and mechanics, and prep guys, and parts men who work at those dealerships.
I’ll buy a car assembled in this country, and these days, that’s as American as it’s going to get.
There are certain brands I won’t buy (Toyota, Honda, Lexus, Kia, VW), but other than that I will buy based on the car I like the most. Case in point, I just bought a C30. I didn’t set out to buy a Volvo, but I looked through some car magazines that highlight the new cars, picked out my 10 favorite (5 of which I could actually afford), and test drove them. This wasn’t strictly one nationality of car, and I think people who say they “won’t buy (blank) country’s cars may be short changing themselves from some really great models.
With me the question is, “Will you buy foreign?”
The only foreign car I’ve owned was a shitty 1987 Nissan Sentra that was in every way inferior to my 1987 Pontiac 6000.
My daughter and one of my sisters both say Honda is crap.Having worked on both Hondas, I agree.
Another sister had good luck with Hyundai, but the Honda hater is having big headaches with her present KIA.
I do like my kid’s 2006 Scion xB and the looks of the Nissan Cube.
I could go for either of those ,but nothing else foreign appeals.
I’d be an American car that gave me the performance, handling, and fuel economy I want, provided it had a history of reliability. The last time I bought American–93 Saturn–I was burned by a cheap junk engine that had to be replaced after 60k.
As several people have said, define American. Is it the Fusion built in Mexico or the Accord built in Ohio?
I have no qualms about buying any car based on its national origin (okay, I wouldn’t buy a Chinese car even if I had the option, but I don’t like to buy anything Chinese unless it’s at a restaurant.) I grew up with Fords and my father finds the idea that I’d consider anything else appalling – but I’m going to buy the car that fits my needs and my budget, no matter what it is or where it comes from.
That said, it’s probably going to be another Ford. I’m driving a ’94 Mustang convertible borrowed from my parents’ fleet while my aged T-Bird awaits heavy repairs (it’s destined to become a project car), and I’d forgotten how much fun top-down motoring can be. Rear drive, two doors, roof optional, cheap to own and operate – yup, there’s a Ford in my future.
I switched from Detroit iron 25 years ago because it was built like crap and supported worse. A few years later, I shunned VW for the same reason. Now I buy Asian, had much better experiences, and it’ll be hard to get me back.
I would still consider an American car. But not if it was “just as good” as a Japanese or Korean one. Dollar for dollar and fender for fender, it would have to be better. That’s not impossible to do. I’d buy a CTS except the console whacks my right knee. I’d buy a Malibu LTZ except the doors feel cheap and the back seat hasn’t got it.
But to me, no “excepts” are accepted. As they say in boxing, if you want to unseat the champion, you’ve got to win by a knockout.
I’ve worked in GM and Honda service departments.
I’ve worked at GM proper (corporate). I have friends at Toyota, Honda and Nissan (all internal, not dealer-level), and of course those who still remain at GM.
I witnessed more imploding GM products in one of my months at the GM service drive than all of the major problem cars combined during my year at Honda.
The GM cars were generally just an endless stream of stupid problems originating from poor engineering or lack of attention to detail. Sunroof sliders were loose, necessitating the deconstruction of the entire interior to tighten, thereby creating endless rattles and electrical issues. Stuff like that. Plenty of blown transmissions, failed A/C compressors, failed head gaskets (with low miles!), broken window regulators, cooling system failures, endless wheel bearings, ignition tumblers, etc., as well.
I came away from GM service with the impression of cars designed by incompetent people with no care for longevity, then assembled by people with no care for detail or thoroughness (sorry Mikey, never dealt with Oshawa cars). Even cars just a few years old felt tired, loose, and “used.” Slop in the steering, loose trim pieces, lots of squeaks and rattles.
At Honda there were also problems, of course, but they were different. The vast majority of the cars were there for routine maintenance, not OMGWTF repairs. We had countless cars with more than 300,000 miles coming in on a regular basis for maintenance that were being used for daily drivers. One guy had a ’91 Accord with 640,000 miles that was still his primary vehicle. Out of curiosity I pulled up his (many) service records on the computer and the car only needed one steering rack and one A/C compressor, in addition to scheduled maintenance, over its many miles. The car still felt tight! Besides the natural wear from that much driving, everything felt good, everything worked, and the car felt like it had a lot of life left in it.
I was at Honda during the era of the famous detonating Accord/Odyssey/TL transmission debacle, but even then I saw less trans failures than at the GM shop. I came away from Honda feeling the majority of their products were designed by people that loved to drive, engineered by those who considered longevity, and assembled by people as if they were going to be stuck with that very unit for the next ten years. The need for repairs in most cases was caused by a unique defect in a part, not a systemic lack of engineering, care, and assembly as I saw at GM. Ten-year-old Hondas still felt solid.
GM corporate was a whole other ball of wax. The complex systems in place preventing anything productive from happening were mind-boggling. GM has some of the brightest people on the planet under their roofs, but they’re all so burned out from the BS that the end result is garbage.
I remember I picked up a Chevy Venture from a validation yard once to haul some rather proprietary stuff to another GM facility. This van had one (1) mile on the odometer; I had to peel all the plastic protective crap off it just to drive it. Brand new. As I left the facility I had to go over some railroad tracks and when I did, the entire giant molded plastic interior cover on the rear passenger side of the van just fell off. Collapsed. I had a powertrain engineer with me and he told me that nobody could get approval during development of that platform for the extra cost of screws as opposed to the (now failed) plastic clips. My god, $0.45 worth of screws would have prevented a $300 warranty job. This theme continued for the duration of my employment there.
I’ve had Japanese cars ever since I’ve left GM. All of my former GM coworkers (our program was cancelled) now drive Toyotas, Hondas, and Infinitis.
I’ll stick with my Asian-branded cars for the near to medium term.
What was that saying about “Patriotism being the last bastion of a scoundrel?”. And when I see adverts like that, it puts me off of that company, no matter how good their products are. If Toyota starting bellowing about how “Japanese they are”, then I’d stop buying them, too! The fact they tried to wrap themselves in the American flag, made me think twice…
Exactly. I don’t want to hear why I should “Buy American”, I want to hear why GM/Ford/Chrysler deserves my hard-earned money and what’s in it for me. From what I’ve experienced from them, poor quality and poor service is what is in it for me.
John
ABSOLUTELY!!*
*As long as it’s a somebody else’s made/concept with a Detroit badge:
Chevrolet Malibu = Opel
Saturn Astra = Opel
Pontiac G8 = Holden Commodore
Pontiac Vibe = Toyota Matrix
GEO Prizm = Toyota Corolla
Too bad Ford doesn’t import the Euro-Focus and the Mondeo…
I can think of some American cars that I would consider buying or would recommend to others:
-Acura TL
-Chevy pickups
-Corvette
-Ford Mustang V-8
-Honda Accord
-Hyundai Sonata
-Pontiac Vibe
-Toyota Camry
-Toyota Corolla
If the experience with the best of the Asians teaches us anything, it’s that the company building the vehicles counts for far more than the place of manufacture.
The workers themselves have very little to do with product quality; design, engineering, the assembly process, and the quality of labor relations count for much more. A plant that is well run can be built just about anywhere.
The profits made in Europe by Ford come back to America and support the company here at home.
Not true. The profits support the company whereever it is that they do business.
These companies are multinationals. If you buy Big 2.8 products, odds are good that the proceeds will be reinvested in a plant in Mexico or a joint venture in China. Not long ago, the money was being spent on acquiring English, Swedish and Korean car companies. Not many Americans benefit from these activities.
Profits are fungible. Some of them go to shareholders; a lot of the rest will go into plant and equipment.
Profits are also a tiny proportion of the income statement. An automaker with above-average profits would have net income of about 10% of revenues. That means nine times more money is being used to pay expenses than goes to servicing profits.
If you care about domestic employment, buy cars that are made in the country in which you reside, no matter who builds them. Most of a company’s expenses are generated from parts and labor. If the parts are local and the assembly is local, most of the money necessarily stays local.
When the Big 2.8 can get around to building cars that ARE reliable and are well built (and have actually sustained a reputation for it), then I might consider them. I’ve bought 1 new American car (2006 Jeep Wrangler) and while it’s reliable, the build quality looks like they just slap crap together in Toledo. My parents drive American stuff exclusively and their stories of problems are never-ending. I’m on my 3rd CPO German car (2006 BMW) and I’d never touch an American car…for at least a decade.
I buy the car that best fits my needs. That includes a large number of criteria from appearance to fuel efficiency, including historic reliability, and when it’s a totally new vehicle that means the manufacturer’s historic reliability. I’ll look at and consider Fords and Chevies, but I’ll also consider Mazda, Honda, Toyota, and Nissan. (Well not so much Toyota and Honda, but that’s due to the type of vehicle they are offering not the company itself.)
I’d buy domestic, but choose carefully. I like the Fusion manual, but I’m so anal about driving position and seating that I’d probably drop $1k on an after-market seat.
I buy based on reliability record (not reputation), excellence in design and whether the company has a vehicle that fits my need.
Next family vehicle- Minivan. Domestics? What domestics?
Personal transport-Small, fun, 4 seat, real world well over 30mpg. Heck, the Fit may be the only car period in this category.
I am open to the domestics and Ford has made progress.
Just gotta’ deliver guys.
Bunter
No.
Yes. So long as I make a profit from it, and the buyer is delighted with the purchase, I really don’t care what it is.
As for daily drivers? 2 Benzes, a Honda, a Pontiac, and a Subaru. They’re all good cars.
If you buy an American car its American content will still be greater than that of a U.S. built transplant.
I would buy a Corvette. That’s about it.
The missus is thinking of an Acura MDX when our daughter arrives. I’m not sure if it’s an American car.
My wife’s next vehicle will definitely be a CTS and mine will be a CTS wagon, maybe. Anyway, I will buy American every time if I can find what I want.
My wife and I own two late-model Ford products both built in Michigan. While it will be awhile before we replace these two trouble-free vehicles, we will definately shop Ford first.
The world’s charismatic cars are mostly American or Italian. Germany and Japan have nothing engaging in this respect, though China — like the US — will build some charismatic cars eventually.
I’ve driven over a dozen bought-new Detroit 3 US-built cars into six figures on the odometer since 1983. Each was completely reliable, durable, interesting, with eminently reasonable operating costs. Further, I chose my dealers carefully and have had an unbroken string of responsive, careful dealers in four major metropolitan areas on two coasts in that time.
My garage has two Cadillacs now. They will have American successors. But there is an Italian car in my future, as well.
Phil
I bought a new Saturn L100 back when you could buy such a thing. A mid size car with a 4 cyl engine that got better gas mileage than a 4 cyl Camry.
I never had a problem out of that car until a soccer mom clipped me while driving her Toyota Sequoia with one hand on the wheel and one hand on a cell phone when literally all she had to do was turn the wheel 1 degree to the left any time in the several seconds before she hit me while I’m sitting at a complete stop wondering when she would turn the wheel.
Anyway back when I bought it I considered the Prius (the old one that looks more like a rounded off K car or whatever the Chevy equivalent to a K car was) but it was new and the FUD about battery replacement scared me off. I did think what the heck my first brand new car should be American made somewhere along the way.
If I knew then what I know now I would have bought the Prius instead. Not because of any problem I ever had out of the Saturns I’ve owned (one new, one used which never gave me a problem worth mentioning here) but because I think I would have come out ahead on buying that 2001 Prius in terms of TCO.
As was I liked the old SL2 and L100 from the early Saturn attempts. They had their downsides but I found them to be functional enough and the lower initial cost was enough to make me consider them when initial cost was a bigger priority.
Since then Saturn products have never kept up in the fuel efficiency or emissions categories and fuel prices have more than tripled so I’ve stopped considering them.
If GM or Ford ever got on top of the efficiency/emissions ball without being more expensive than a Toyota or Honda I’d consider them but it’s all about the merits of the vehicle specs and that includes initial cost as well as TCO. Putting an American flag on anything that costs me more than a really good hamburger isn’t going to buy my vote…
This topic is so telling. I havent read through but 2 pages and the NO’s far outweigh the “GM and Ford make one car I like” responses. Sort of confirms my belief that TTAC caters to its audience a little. Anyway, I guess I shouldnt be too hard on TTAC or its members, I just find the heavy slant in some of the articles and most of the comments somewhat disturbing. I have never owned a Domestic vehicle and swore them off after the problems my parents had with theirs.
However, I really like what I am seeing at GM and Ford. Much moreso that what I am seeing at Toyota and Honda. I really dont have any brand loyalty so I think GM and Ford have as good a chance as the foreign makes at getting my business in the future.
Never buy foreign. Never have. Never will.
I’m confused by this. My Acura was built in Ontario, and I once had a GTi hecho en Mexico.
The X5 I considered was built in South Carolina, and the SRX I considered, Ohio, the same place my brother’s Acura was built.
I’d buy an American Built car, sure, but probably not from Ford, GM or Cerebus
I won’t say NO absolutely… but there are very few American models that I would even put on my shopping list. And those would be at the bottom. And I certainly would never risk buying a new one (been there… got screwed by Dodge).
In other words, it would have to a particular model and year with a proven track record of reliability combined with a damn good price.
My family has had good luck with the rebranded Japanese made US cars. (And I consider Geo to be a Japanese rebadge, although technically it is not. They look, feel, drive, and last like Japanese.) I had a Mazda 323 rebranded as a Ford… great little car.
As an analogy, I’d like to compare the car buying experience to the computer buying experience. I love Dell’s and have always had great reliability and service. They have never failed me, and the handful of times I’ve needed help, they have rocked. However, I meet people all the time who hate Dell and have nothing but problems.
The difference, when I investigate, is that I only buy Dell’s expensive, rock-solid, a bit boring, business-class computers. The people with problems buy the cheap consumer grade models, and then wonder why they don’t get the reliability and service I get.
My point is: You get what you pay for. Just like I can’t paint Dell with a broad brush cause their low-end, zero profit systems suck. I can’t dismiss GM or Ford just cause some of their makes and models suck. You have to narrow your focus when making such decisions.
when my family first move here to the US, we had nothing but Dodge and Chrysler. It was in the early 90’s that my dad was expose to toyota by one of my cousin, we’ve been driving toyota/honda/acura ever since…..today if one was giving to me for free, yeah i’ll take it and use it as a daily commute.
http://info.detnews.com/video/index.cfm?id=1189
Will I buy a car from GM, Ford, or Chrysler? I don’t know. Would I like to buy a car from them? Yes, of course, but none offer a car comparable to a well-equipped Audi A6 or an Infiniti M35 or M45, my two current top choices. The Cadillac CTS comes close, but lacks desirable features found on its competitors. I steadfastly bought American cars in the 1980s, such as my 1983 Citation X11, 1986 Chevy Celebrity, 1984 Pontiac 6000 STE sedans, 1987 Jeep Cherokee, and finally a 1989 Ford Taurus SHO. All were mediocre and the final two were abysmally unreliable. I then bought a used 1992 Subaru SVX, which was a joy to own and drive. Since then I’ve Chevy, Dodge, and Ford work trucks, but no American-label cars. Now my wife and I each drive a 2007 Subaru, which have pleased us and have been trouble-free.
Yes I will buy “American” again, as long as it is assembled on the North American Continent. I have owned (and still own) vehicles built by the Detroit 3 and have never been burned by any of them. The worst by far vehicle I ever owned was a ’70s Toyota (unreliable, rustbucket) The most fun vehicle I owned was English, an MG Midget. The best truck I’ve owned was a 1986 Nissan Hardbody PU. I have owned more MOPAR vehicles than the rest combined because up until now they offered what I wanted at the time in a better package than the competition. The absolute Best vehicle I have ever owned was a ’98 Dodge Neon R/T, totally reliable, good on gas (32+mpg) never had a problem of any kind with it. My son still drives it.
I will Also consider Honda, Nissan, Mazda, Subaru or Hundai if they are marketing a pkg I am looking for at the time I am looking. Toyota is not on my list.
Dynamic88,
As an American who owns stock in Honda, I thank you for your continued purchases of American-built Hondas.
Personally, I only buy Native American built cars. I don’t want anything that was built by the descendents of immigrants from some other hemisphere.
I think there’s also a problem with our perceptions…. for example, I have never owned a domestic – my only memories are from what my parents drove around 15 years ago. So at the time, obviously their experiences with them steered me towards imports – and I haven’t looked back. Have domestics changed? I’m guessing there’s high likelihood.
For example – take Apple Computers: 15 years ago (heck, even 10 years), the Mac was expensive, tough to find software for, nearly incompatible with what the rest of the world uses, etc.
Now they run Windows faster and more reliably than a PC runs Windows.
I’m not saying there’s the exact same parity between imports and domestics now, but I be that they’re far closer than they used to be, and maybe in some cases even superior.
I buy based on reliability record (not reputation), excellence in design and whether the company has a vehicle that fits my need.
Bunter,
Where would you get that reliability information? TrueDelta is a good start, but there isn’t much history there.
Hell to the freaking no! Buying a GM when there are so many better cars on the market is idiotic. Unless you buy used. In which case, the depreciation makes it worth it.
Barely.
Doubtful. Thirteen years ago we decided to try a larger North American car for the first time – a Mercury Sable wagon. Three head gaskets later (plus many other troubles) we junked the car for a Mazda3 which has been perfect for four years and 110,000 km. Our other car, a Mercury Mystique has also been troublesome.
In addition to a history of poor reliability, none of the 2.8 make a decent fuel efficient small car which will likely replace the Mystique.
I drove and owned American cars for the first 25 years I had a drivers license. I also spent a significant portion of that 25 years repairing, waiting for repairs to be completed, waiting for warranty work to be completed (often times repeatedly), and waiting for tow-trucks to show up to take in whatever POS I was driving to be repaired. I’m guessing it’s close to a year of my life I’m not getting back. Granted, my ’70 Olds Cutlass was an absolute cast-iron solid workhouse that I put 216,000 miles on it AFTER I bought it off my mom with 90,000 miles on it when I was in college-never any problems. Other than that it’s been a seemingly endless parade of one POS after another. GM, Ford, Chrysler….I’ve owned at least one example from each of them. In my garage as of now-2007 Acura TL Type-S, 2005 Honda Odyssey, 2006 Honda S2000. Enough said.
I think that the Big 2.8 are finally getting it, deep down inside I hope they make it. However, it’s going to be a long time before I take the plunge with GM or Ford. I’ve written Chrysler off completely until they hire design staff with eyesight. The dealers will have to make exponential improvement in how they treat customers also. Sadly, I’m not sure the big 2.8 are not first-and-10 from their own 5-yard line with no time-outs and 1:30 on the clock…….and no deep passing threat. It really is a shame…
Easy one. Unless my financial situation changes drastically, (read up OR down), it’ll be a Honda or Toyota. Does the question encompass anything assembled by them in the US or Canada as “American”?
If you mean the “US manufacturers” (how ARE those Mexican assembly plants anyway?), then no, I’ve had my fill of those over the last 35 years.
My GMs are slowly being replaced by the competiton, I have one left (a 2003), when it’s gone, they’re done.
American Brands have poor resale value. So NO. Sorry.
I’m assuming by American, you guys mean the Big 3, with some exceptions for brands. I wouldn’t consider Mazda American, and ditto for Volvo. Saab used to be foreign, but has been assimilated too much into GM to be considered non-American.
American (Big 3 brands only) cars that, if given to me for free, I would drive daily over my Mazda3: (in order of preference)
Ford GT
Corvette
CTS (new, not old)
Dodge Viper
SRT-4 (old, not new)
Pontiac G8 (not really American)
Solstice GXP/Sky Redline
Cadillac XLR(-V) (never driven it, but it can’t be THAT bad for a free ride, right?)
As for those that I would actually spend money on, that’s a lot harder…
The CTS is a maybe. I haven’t driven the new one, but I really hated the old one. They need to make a big step forward with this one. I wouldn’t spend the extra for a -V, either. At that point, I’d buy something else.
Pontiac G8 also a maybe. I actually drove one a few days ago, and it was pretty good, but I would wait for the manual transmission. My Mazda is an auto, so I’m not stick-shift snob. The auto in the G8 hunts for gears forever and a day, and then the engine takes forever to spin up. The sound is glorious, though muted, and very impressive overall.
If I actually needed the utility, I would buy a Chevy Silverado/Tahoe/Suburban in a second. It’s sad to see such a great entry languish in the industry’s worst segment.
All that said, I’m pretty picky.. I’m currently looking at options to replace my Mazda3, or to put it better, seeing if there’s anything out there worth replacing my car. The G37 was impressive, but not $40,000 (or 4X my car’s worth) impressive. I think I’ll be holding off for a bit. Maybe an E36 M3, if I can find a lightly-driven clean one.
Edit: Eggpainter,
Now [Macs] run Windows faster and more reliably than a PC runs Windows.
Not if you know what you’re doing. A good PC will run Windows faster and with less problems for WAY less money. Mac has some of the most overpriced hardware in computers. You buy a Mac for the style and OSX. Throw in the pretentious air of superiority, too.
Let see, my 2006 Corvette broke on the way home from buying it, GM finally replaced it a month later, my 2002 Lincoln LS has no resale value and the two Jeeps (thank God they were leased) were junk. I now have an Acura and wished I had bought one sooner.
American bah, you mean an American managed/assembled brand. I was almost sold on the Solstice until I saw one in the flesh. If that car couldnt do it I dont have any hope that a future product will. I’ve never owned a big 3, likey that I never will.
Excellent topic.
For me, nothing from classic Detroit. Unions, mgt. pay, defective by design, ugly, they obviously assume I am stupid, etc. No F way.
I used to work on cars and yes Detroit is the worst sold in USA these last 40 years. I don’t care about Malibu or why pushrods have validity. Detroit exudes evil vibes for those that are tuned in. Very bad karma in Detroit. Look at Detroit Actual. Their home town.
I am waiting for Mazda2 trapped in Ford Fiesta clothing. I don’t think of this as Detroit product. But I will want to see it up close and make sure its really a Mazda under the Ford badge. And I am mad Ford vetos Mazda2 in USA. Obvious why. Dont blame them but I hate them for it. More bad vibes.
OK, Detroit has huge negative brand equity. They earned it the old fashioned way, by fardeking up for decades.
Ford can have some profit on a transaction with a sullen hostile suspicious customer, but only if its really a Mazda that I buy, and maybe not even at that. Bad breath Ford salesman who is ignorant of Fiesta brand in world history, its his second week on the job and I have to listen to him.
Then I go buy 2009 Mazda3 and relax in the happy sunshine parked next to my Miata. Good vibes. Ahhh. Deep breath, it was a close call.
And yes I would love a Corvette if I were not desiring to keep my license. And yes I love cars.
Probably not. If only because its seems like the Big 2.8 are intent on depriving its NA customers of the manual transmission. But then again, this could be said of most all auto manufacturers nowadays.
That, and nothing much they make shows up on my radar. The new CTS is a great looking car, but having not driven it or the prior generation, I’m hesitant. If the transmission is anything like the 2003 GTO I test drove for a bit (LS1 or 2 + T56), I’d pass on it in a heartbeat. I’d like the Corvette, but I just don’t like the interior’s design, never mind all the criticisms of the interior quality, etc. Hated the shifter feel in the Mustang, so that’s out. And absolutely nothing from Chrysler even shows up on my radar. Solstice is ugly, Sky is better looking, but both are cramped, and the roof folding arrangement is unfortunate.
One manufacturer that I would absolutely LOVE to buy a car from is Alfa Romeo. Their cars are so achingly gorgeous, that I think I would be able to overlook the FWD and unknown reliability.
I’m doing well with my first American car, a Saturn ION, so I will likely buy another. My first thoughts are for a nice old person Buick or a Saturn VUE.
I would buy most any brand, but since 1963 I have had 14 GM cars and trucks. Some new some used. Every one was a good vehicle. No engine or trany problems. All were full size, rwd, pushrod v8. I now have 04 Grand Marquis which I expect good service, but I wish it were a pushrod engine. IMO you just dont need ohc engine to cruise down the interstate or go to the grocery store. Indy 500? sure.
I have owned “American” vehicle and German and Japanese vehicles. Quality of build on all were acceptable. The US vehicles probably had fewer reasons to go back to the dealer, all told. Resale is a problem, but you probably get more value in US cars when new. Mind you, I’m not buying small US vehicles; 4 G Cherokees, 1994 Continental, 1998 STS, 2008 C300. For a “practical” car today I’d probably go for a Honda Accord in the quality/price/mileage tradeoffs or an AWD 535 BMW if I was going to lease.
My 95 saturn, perhaps the best in class american car made at the time, every bit the equal of a Civic, and at 150k miles, still going strong.
My 2004 Mazda6 hatch, proudly made by UAW labor in Michigan.
But my next car will be a Fit or a Prius. I don’t care who makes it, I care how well its made.
I drive a 1998 Volvo S90 with 90,000 miles on the clock, so I won’t need to answer this question for another ten years.
Probably not. I’ll probably buy a car with a Japanese or Korean nameplate. (Who knows where it might actually be made?) I like the looks of the Pontiac Vibe, but it’s really a Toyota made in California. I used to like the looks of the Ford Focus wagon, but then they quit making it.
I can’t really think of anything else. I like the looks of some European cars, but with the dollar being so devalued in comparison to European currencies I don’t suppose I’ll ever be able to afford European.
One of the problems with American is that there’s not much you can get with a clutch, outside of the super high performance cars like the CTS and the ‘Vette. If I had to get a general purpose car tomorrow, I’d probably look at the Civic, the Mazda3, the Accord, and the WRX (all used). I might look at the Fusion if I couild get it with a stick. If I were going to get a sporty car, I’d look at a Miata and a Boxster/Cayman.
Yes, I will buy American. GM and Ford yes, but never ever EVER Chrysler. I have always owned American vehicles, and with a couple of exceptions, all have been pretty good to me. Even those exceptions weren’t total nighmares.
People complain about the low resale value of American cars, but that works in my favor because I always buy used. Can’t afford a new car anyway. My next car will be a used Crown Victoria or Grand Marquis, although I may rethink that if gas prices get too high.
Something I see over and over again are complaints about interior materials and workmanship being inferior in American cars, as if interior quality is the be all and end all of the quality of the car as a whole. It isn’t!
I’m not opposed to the notion of owning a Japanese car, but realistically I just can’t see myself in one. Most are bland “anonymobiles” or outright ugly like the current Camry. I feel the same way about Korean cars. Now, there is no way in hell I would ever own a European car. They’re overpriced and most of them just don’t appeal to me. Plus, I have my doubts as to their reliability based on what I’ve researched.
Absolutely will buy American. Why?
I can pick them up dirt cheap at the auctions. Like a disposable lighter you get the best you can out of them and throw them away when they need major work.
I had a new Japanese vehicle which gave me 260,000 trouble free km. I sold it for $13K and was still short $30K from new cost.
Never have bought from the Detroit 3; my first car was a Swedish-built Volvo, and both of my daily drivers I’ve paid my own money for were Mazdas built in Japan, one before the Ford takeover, one after. The two Toyotas we own were both built in US transplant factories.
My experience to D3 products: I was working with a temp agency and got assigned mid-90’s Cavaliers. That was a shock coming from the Volvo 740. Oh, and the almost yearly rental Caravan/T&C.
Next car? The wife calls the shots on that one, she’s been a lifelong Toyota driver, likely going to be a Canadian built Corolla in the next year or three.
I have just started car buyin’ (2 years ago) but so no problems with the STi (24k miles in 3 years) or the 2000 neon (first year after the infamous headgasket problems).
Both have been pretty reliable, although the neon has needed more repairs (40k miles on an older car vs 24 on a newer one).
The lack of standard transmission on alot of american vehicles is bothersome. Even worse is that even when it is available, it is hard to find (around here — chicago) on a dealer lot.
Next car will most likely be a auto tranny econobox for the wife (although I prefer manual, she can’t drive manuals so well). This is only if I don’t get her proficient on stick before purchase time. I have been thinking of sticking her in the STi driver seat in a parking lot, but when she tried to drive a friends hyundai accent a year ago or so she made the wheels chirp by giving them too much gas…..
Her in an STi right now is a slightly scary thought.
Someone didn’t like the JD Powers and Consumer Reports information. I found this a few years ago, just after I was so disgusted with the Detroit 3 that I finally gave up entirely on them for life.
This is from the CAA (Canadian equivalent of AAA) and reflects overall real-world reliability.
CAA study of automotive reliability, averaged corporate scores, February 2003
Manufacturer Reliability “score”
TOYOTA +14.0
NISSAN +6.8
SUBARU +6.7
HONDA/ACURA +5.4
MAZDA +3.2
“Average” 0
GM -1.9
VOLKSWAGEN -3.3
FORD -4.2
CHRYSLER/JEEP -5.3
Since the time of this study, Hyundai and Honda have both improved a lot and somewhat respectively, and Toyota has slipped a bit, while Ford reliability has apparently improved a bit. GM, Chrysler and Volkswagen continue to be in the pits, apparently (from all of the various different sources of information that I’ve read).
This is also rather illuminating.
http://www.autooninfo.net/ReliabilityPercentrankAverages.htm
I swore I would never buy a BMW, as I thought they represented poor value for the money. Yet I bought a 325 wagon in 2001 which I found I really enjoyed; they drive like nothing else on the market (although Infiniti, Lexus and Cadillac are all pushing), they are reasonably luxurious and for me the 3-series represents a perfect compromise of 4 passenger capability with small car maneuverability. I have no illusions that the long term reliability will match a Honda, Toyota or Infiniti, but the Japanese manufacturers haven’t quite matched the 3-series.
If Detroit built a car which matched my desires of the moment, I’d certainly look at it. The CTS appears to be a pretty decent car, but it only comes at the size of a 5-series, and I just don’t need a car that large. Several years ago I was tempted by the Lincoln LS and hoped to put it on my list after they had spent some time making refinements to an excellent design. Alas, Ford let it languish and now it is gone.
Were I in the market for a very fast sports car, the Corvette would be high on my list. I’m still unsure why I need a 435 hp car for a daily driver, since my 240 hp S2000 only gets blown out when it goes to the track.
Never needed a truck, but if I did, I’d opt for something smaller than the standard Ford or Chevy, again to avoid the hassle and poor fuel mileage of the large-footprint “standard” pickup.
Finally, with Bob Nardelli at the helm, I won’t enter a Chrysler showroom, period.
After being burned time after time by nissan and totally screwed by toy motors, I will never depart from Chevies and Buicks again!
American ? Maybe, probably a Ford might be looked at in the future. Chrysler? I can’t see any product in the near or far future that would appeal to me. GM? Never, cutting out the long story, they screwed half my family over royally in one fell swoop after dealing with them for many years. I believe between 2 businesses , and multiple households they lost a total of 12 business leases, and 7 cars were traded in immediately after what they did.
The cars themselves are one thing, the dealer experience is another. I have had an awesome experience with our Mazda at the dealer. After being treated the way we have been , we will definitely look there first.
Not if you know what you’re doing. A good PC will run Windows faster and with less problems for WAY less money. Mac has some of the most overpriced hardware in computers. You buy a Mac for the style and OSX. Throw in the pretentious air of superiority, too.
Apple hardware is not overpriced. I switched in August of last year and I compared prices with Dell, HP, and others. The 24″ iMac I bought was about the same price and, in some cases, cheaper than an equivalent PC.
I didn’t buy a Mac for the style but I did buy it for OS X. It is a much better OS; more stable, no viruses (don’t believe everything you read-a Trojan horse is not a virus), and everything just works. I have an 8 year old scanner that required a driver reinstall every two months on XP. With the iMac, I plugged it in and it has worked since with no other software needed.
Back to the subject, many people mention the poor resale value of American cars which is true. However, since most American cars are sold at deep discounts, doesn’t this help offset that poor resale value? I realize that those discounts have helped create that poor resale value, but it still makes a difference.
Most resale value comparisons I see are based on the sticker price, not the actual transaction price.
seoultrain:
Not to get off topic, but you’re illustrating my case in point:
I am not talking about building a PC “from scratch”, just the same way we are not talking about building a car “from scratch”.
Off the shelf (read: off the dealership floor), a MacBook Pro and an IBM/Lenovo laptop with the exact same specs (except video card) pitted head-to head (they sit on my desk) and the MBP clobbers the Lenovo every time.
Rest assured: it has zero to do with “if I know what I’m doing”, along the same lines as a quality car has little to do with how good the driver is.
I’m sorry, my analogy isn’t any clearer, and so I’ll drop it. Like computers, people’s passion for vehicles is generally fueled by gut feeling, unsubstantiated evidence and FUD for what might be better/cheaper/faster than what we know.
Maybe cars is like religion then… no… that can’t be it…
Or maybe like politics? Nah…
I know a Volvo S80 owner that has had nearly every major component on his car replaced over the past five years. Does he care? Only if you ask him. What will his next car be, when the S80 implodes? Another Volvo.
Will I buy American? Absolutely yes. Thanks to poor resale, domestic brands are a used-car buyer’s dream these days, and most of them are built well enough to run way past 100,000 miles with little more than routine maintenance and replacement of normal wear items. The Ford products have been the best of the lot for me, though I’ve also had good luck with several GM car lines. I even took a gamble on a used Dodge Caravan last year when I found that a comparable Sienna or Odyssey would have cost nearly twice as much to buy. The Dodge is pleasant to drive and has been reliable so far.
If I were buying new, I’d consider Ford in preference to any of the Japanese brands. I tend to keep a car for at least 8 years or 100,000 miles, so resale value at the three-year point is not terribly important to me. I put more weight on the lower initial cost of a domestic car, the (often) lower cost of insurance, and the lower cost of maintenance and repairs.
GM did their best to drive me away with the ’67 Grand Prix and ’75 Vega and ’78 Monza I used to drive–especially the Monza. Ford gave my Dad a biodegradable ’72 Galaxie (it decomposed into iron oxide in a matter of months) and my sister a ’86 EXP with an electrical system that would have made John Lucas look good. Chrysler . . . we won’t go there.
That said, I test-drove an ’07 Cobalt SS Supercharge and liked it. I’m favorably impressed with the quality (if not the design) of recent Fords. I’d buy American next time I’m buying if they offered what I wanted and I could trust the thing not to fall apart on me.
As used car values, the depreciation makes many domestics a great buy. As for buying new, I consider all vehicles that appeal to me in the class that I am interested in. Sometimes the end result is American, sometimes it is not. But if the question is will you consider a domestic? Absolutely. There are plenty of imports that have worse reliability then the Americans. That dealer network really needs some help though. Being dismissed by service writers that don’t know what the difference is between a map sensor and a sparkplug annoys the crap out of me.