Not that you'd know it from reading Jamie Lareau's lead in Automotive News [sub]: "As General Motors works on its corporate turnaround, a smaller version is under way at its Saturn brand." To use a phrase popular back when Saturn was GM's import fighter (as opposed to its import provider), gag me with a spoon. So how does Lareau justify his faith in Saturn's future? Not very well. "Customers have yet to arrive in a huge numbers. Through March, Saturn's U.S. sales totaled 48,306 units, down 15.3 percent from 2007." Ain't that the truth. Apparently it's not the whole truth; Lareau feels obliged to dredge-up a two-month old quote from GM CEO Rick Wagoner re: Saturn's recovery: 'We knew what we were doing, which is to change the profile of the kinds of products that we sell at Saturn from basically low-priced cars to cars that compete on the basis of being great cars, European influence, et cetera. It's fair to say that's not an easy assignment.'" Et cetera? Anyway, is it also fair to say Saturn's failed, considering the brand's shot its proverbial new product wad and still managed to under-perform a declining U.S. new car market? Of course not. Lareau gives the last word to Saturn's recently-snubbed brand manager Jill Lajdziak. "There's no question we have to continue to build the awareness of our new products. That doesn't happen overnight. You don't just walk into a segment. You have to earn your way into the segment."
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Shame too, cause they are nice looking cars for once, and if they preserved the Opel dynamics, I would consider one if I was in the market for that sort of car.
I looked, briefly, at the Astra. For some incomprehensible reason, the two-door is not available in base trim. The base 4-door hatch looks like a Nissan Versa clone and is priced about $2k more.
Saturn’s decision to basically become American Opel is backfiring in a major way and it isn’t really Saturn’s fault. I don’t believe anyone could have predicted the drop in the dollar, which is what’s making Saturn’s pricing out of line.
There aren’t that many Saturn dealers around to begin with. The product is kind of pricey for what you get and the gas mileage of the Astra is disappointing.
The Saturn dealers around here are the “one price” variety, not to mention they load all their vehicles with dealer add-on’s.
That being said, my sister just bought a loaded Saturn Outlook XR with 1,300 miles on it – that one they were willing to negotiate on due to it not being “new”.
It is a fine vehicle, but the other Saturns have issues – the new VUE is a gas hog, the Ion has a goofy dashboard, and the Aura is unknown, and I can buy a Malibu from dealers that are willing to negotiate.
I did drive a rental Ion in California for 10 days – it drove and rode well, and returned fine fuel economy. If the price was right, it wouldn’t bother me to drive one, but I’d cross shop a Cobalt for the same reasons as the above Malibu.
I’m not a Saturn hater. I believe their philosophy is a good one: focus on customer service at all cost. They honestly do do this at Saturn. Every dealership I have ever been in has been pleasant, kind, no pressure, actually kinda fun place.
However, I hate to say, I think they gotta go. Why? Because there isn’t anything at Saturn they couldn’t have at one of the other gazillion GM brands (some of which also need to go).
The VUE is an EXCELLENT little rig. Only downer is the weight and resulting low-for-the-class MPG. Otherwise it is a great little SUV. Nicely done inside and out. It shoulda been a Chevy. Instead nobody knows about this great ride because nobody pays attention to Saturn.
Aura? Again, good car. The Malibu beats it hands down. Gone.
Outlook? GMC Acadia is better looking. The Chevy Traverse is likely to be cheaper. Gone.
Sky? Should be a Pontiac. Kill the Solstice. Sky. Gone.
Astra? Why shouldn’t this be a Chevy too?
I know GM believes they can’t compete with import buyers with Chevrolet. To this I call BS. I believe with enough focus on excellent product, “import buyers” would eventually shop Chevy. Not overnight, but within 10 years of excellent product and consistent marketing, I believe so. I’m not so convinced most Saturn buyers are “import buyers” anyway….
While we’re at it, GMC should be killed except for heavy duty trucks. Pontiac I believe can live, but just a a small, niche brand. Though CAFE regs might put that idea to rest. Buick COULD stay, but I’d probably bag em too. If they got small and focused on quiet and soft and comfort… Cadillac should be enough (though where to sell the Enclave…not so sure that’d be a good Cadillac). SAAB….jesus these guys shoulda been executed a decade ago. And HUMMER? Yeah, its gotta stay. While the market will shrink, they gotta a great brand image that rivals Jeep for legendary off-road ability. It will get smaller, but I believe is a good brand.
There ya go. Just wasted a lot of typing :)
eggsalad, You’re being way too forgiving. How could the dollar do anything but fall, given our balance of trade and the fact that we’re in debt up to our eyeballs?
GM shoulda’ seen it coming.
The Astra is a nice car, and I might have tested one, but I couldn’t get comfortable in it. I’m pretty average size, so I don’t know what was going on. The dealer suggested a leftover Ion instead. I told him I was only interested in the Astra because it was an Opel and not a Saturn. I got the feeling I wasn’t the first person to tell him that.
GM stopped building Ions over a year ago – leftover, indeed.
I guess I’m still just disgruntled over this: Saturn started out well–the practical person’s sporty car, made in USA (all else equal, I’d buy the American car, as I did in ’93 and kept it 11 yrs), and we’re going to concentrate on making it better and better, quality-wise, instead of changing the styling. And the single style, the SLx, sold nearly 300,000 copies in ’94 or ’95, a rate that’s 50% higher than what is it four models are now selling at? And in 1996, the general goes and d pulls it back into the mother company–how dumb was that???!–totally losing their focus, and they’re still fumbling around, and it’s no wonder. I recently drove a generation 1 that a friend who doesn’t have much cash recently bought. Still like the thing. Nice firm suspension, only 2450 lbs. If they had kept that thing basically the same, just improving it, like with a decent engine and a more supple suspension, I very well might have bought another! But, no thanks, the stuff they’re selling now has none of the personality of the original.
I have yet to see a single Astra around Austin. I can count the number of Opel VUEs I’ve seen on one hand. I’ve seen a few more Auras, but not many.
An incredible shock for GM: how can Saturn Aura, Car of the Year, have such low sales?
It’s deeply troubling.
The massive spending and complete overhaul of the Saturn line-up has achieved nothing at all.
What a waste of precious resources.
I’ll tell you what keeps me out of a Saturn dealership even though I like the product: no haggle pricing. It sounds all nice and easy, but what it ultimately means is paying what they want you to pay, with no chance of a better bargain. It’s like what Apple would do if they sold cars (and I’m willing to shop Apple that way, but not for a car costing 20-30 times as much).
Customers’ New Car Check List:
1. Four cylinders, maybe six. Prefer four.
2. Spacious, but don’t need a lounge.
3. Fuel efficient.
4. Fuel efficient.
5. Is the parent company healthy, or suffering?
6. Fuel efficient.
Saturns have never been sporty.
Cheap, yes. Maybe they aren’t so cheap right now.
What is sad, here we can clearly see, how GM is trying to save face with weird math. if Those opels were sold as German opels not Saturn, it would go into German DAX index, and german production. yet now, rebadging Astra Gm can count that into her pie chart. The same with daewoo. ironically, it doesn`t create a single job for American families, or help them to feed their children. the last patriots wither.
I really, really wanted to like the Astra. But, the somewhat anemic engine, the funky center stack, the foisted-on-the-customer On-Star instead of an Aux jack or satellite radio, and the cramped-feeling driver’s perch all worked against it. Still, it’s a fine car (for GM), but @ 18,500 (for the well-equipped 3-Door), and “no haggle”, it was a bit too little for a bit too much.
To sum up Saturn:
–finally, great products
–great dealers (if there is such a thing)
–absolutely no marketing support
How can this be? After all these years to have excellent cars but nobody knows about them?
Another reason why GM must trim another brand or two.
Go back to 1998-99, and read the articles touting Oldsmobile’s recovery, complete with upbeat quotes from GM PR people.
As Yogi Berra would say, it’s deja vu all over again.
I’ve kind of said it all along. Saturn has not made a penny (i.e. has lost money for GM) since its inception.
Why on earth keep it around? Other than the fact that GM probably cannot afford to pay off the Saturn dealers to close them down, as it did Oldsmobile.
Perhaps starving it of product….
GM could do that “for” Pontiac, GMC and Buick, too (which also need to disappear).
Saturn: The Astra only. In small quantities, with high prices due to the Euro/Dollar exchange rate.
Pontiac: The Vibe only. At least it has something resembling Toyota quality (because it IS a Toyota under the skin).
GMC: Heavy duty trucks only.
Buick: One luxo-barge, sedan, only. For the geriatric set. Keep the brand in China, where it actually has cachet (God only knows why…)
Actually, it could be surmised that because the wealthy pre-communist Chinese seemed to like Buicks, the name still has some magic to them? Any Chinese-Americans out there with the facts to back this theory up?
Have a look at this model, available from a Chinese manufacturer. It is interestingly enough, listed with “Court” automobiles
http://www.pandora-model.com/index.php?gOo=goods_details.dwt&goodsid=146&productname=
Private Collection 1913 Buick25 court special-1932 Puyi court special- Wanrong
The 1932 “Puyi” could be a knock-off of the Buick of the same era (Puyi – Buick – sound similar? kind of like Rover and Roewe now? – plus the fact that the Chinese did a knock-off of a car? I guess it must just be in their genes). At least the Japanese are original. The Prius, for example, is certainly not a copy of anything else.
I have no emperical evidence to support this but I’m guessing that GM wants Saturn to survive because the demographics of those purchasing their vehicles today is MUCH better than it was five years ago. That demographic probably shows higher incomes in some of the same age brackets as before. With the Aura and the Astra they are definately targeting a different level of buyer and a more discerning buyer (whether you think the vehicles are better or not is beside the point with them). The Outlook targets a market they have never played in frankly so that applies also. The Vue, while relatively attractive is the biggest mistake due primarily to it’s weight. Yes, for me the Astra is a disappointment from a powertrain, and primarily transmission standpoint…but let’s face it, average buyer doesn’t care about many of the things that we, on Autoblog, care about.
I think GM looked at the changes they were making with Saturn and for a change decided it would take time. Many people in the auto industry, as it relates to sales figures and earnings, look at the world from month to month, quarter to quarter, and year to year (I believe this is what gets the GM’s of the world in trouble). I think Saturn’s “turnaround” if it happens, will need to be looked at from a long term standpoint (maybe 5-10 years). And for a change I think that is how GM is looking at Saturn and the drop in sales is part of the process…once again, I have no evidence to prove that, it’s just a thought.
I pretty much hate GM and can’t see myself in any of their vehicles (although the new Opel Insignia in a wagon version would be very tempting) so I write this from that perspective.
Now back to work…
I agree with SCMTB — any turnaround is a 5 to 10 year proposition, here starting in 2005/06. Reputation is something that is earned — look at the 20 years of CamCord/Civic/Corolla. No mass-market car appears out of the blue and dominates a segment.
Saturn is transitioning, but the product portfolio in 2009/10 will be even better:
(1) Saturn Aura / Insignia (will be beautiful)
(2) Saturn Vue probably lightened and with new powertrains
(3) US-built Delta platform Astra
(4) Sky update
(5) DITCH THE OUTLOOOK SATURN!!!
I can agree with many of the writers on here… I too was an co-owner of a 1991 Saturn SL2 manual. It was a loaded car, first model year. The engine was almost unbearably loud, which they modified in it’s second year. But, the car never went back to the dealer once for a warranty claim and even better: We needed to get rid of it after a year and a half to facilitate a move to Seattle where we would only need one car. The demand was high enough that we sold the car for $9750 after paying $11500. That was 25K miles later. Pretty good! Lately we were offered the Ion as a rental. It’s interior is laughable! I have some storage containers that have better plastic finishes. The ride? MUSHY. Brakes? Already warped at 2400 miles. Seats? I find better seats in budget airlines. I mean seriously the car was slapped together with all the care of a cheap plastic toy. Ouch!
What happened to Saturn? Exactly what happens to all of the brands that GM manages. Saturn needed a mid-sized car. What to do? Rebadge the old frankly foul Opel Vectra, but give it uglier styling. It flopped. Imagine that? Now all Saturns are badge engineered just like everything else at GM. I understand the economics of the issue, but GM should have thought about it. They had a unique brand that they could have nurtured into something great. Instead they brought it under the GM umbrella and killed it in a matter of a year!
Now, the Aura. Good car. I have driven it. I actually like it’s styling much better than the Malibu. Astra? Good Euro styling, but they are almost ready to launch a new one in the EU. Again, Americans are relegated to the old platforms. Let’s see, the Outlook? Why buy one over it’s platform-mates? At Saturn you cannot negotiate. I think that they should dump that RIGHT AWAY. It does not make sense any more!
Saturn is transitioning into the failed Saab approach – rebadge GMs and Opels and charge higher premiums.
Saturn was known for cheap reliable transportation with the one price strategy (many girls I know bought Saturns b/c they didn’t want to haggle or have their Dad come with to negotiate with the sales people b/c they were literally scared). After reading posts here I’m not sure where people got the idea that Saturn was about European styling, looks, luxury or performance in any regards. Fact is the brand was about painless affordable car buying experience (mainly to women). The vehicles and approach was conceived to compete with the Civrolla or Camcord and their dealers who were getting MSRP and markups.
bodayguy :
Saturns have never been sporty.
If a powerful engine is necessary for sporty, that’s true. But the original Saturns steered very precisely, and cornered flat. I was pulled over by a cop once because I went around a corner a lot faster than he liked. But he couldn’t ticket me. hadn’t broken the speed limit. I just didn’t bother to slow down for the almost 90 degree turn off the main drag. A friend who was a former race driver used to love driving my saturn, and insisted on taking it around the track at Summit Point.
Plus, they looked sporty. The first time I saw one, I knew exactly what it was, without ever having seen any ads. The first time I saw the second gen, I didn’t know if it was a hyundai, a tercel, or an olds.
If I really want a moderate price European style car I can just buy the real thing, a VW. At least you can find a VW dealer and negotiate a decent price.
And, anyone who thinks the Saturn Outlook or Solstice reflect a European design sensibility is a fool.
Saturn, A Dumb Idea For A Car Company, always was, always will be.
“No mass-market car appears out of the blue and dominates a segment.”
Not true. The original Taurus did just that. The original Mustang outsold the entire Saturn brand right from the start. The Chrysler minivan came out of nowhere and created a huge new segment.
It has been decades now and Saturn has never proved it’s business case. The rest of Roger Smith’s crazy ideas where long ago tossed overboard and Saturn needs to go as well. Without the Aura distraction the new Malibu could have come out a year earlier. Volume GM family cars belong in the Chevrolet showroom. The idea that GM needed an entire new division to compete with imports was stupid from the start and remains so.
love the Sky, the rest is bland. i wanted to reiterate a point that was made earlier, about the cost of Saturn for GM. Saturn has not made a profit since its birth. how long is GM going to wait for this brand to come into the black?
i really see this brand as very promising, but honestly, it’s very unknown. if GM would only advertise more efficiently, and have a healthy dealer network (maybe combine Saturn with another brand instead of stand-alone dealerships?) then that would be a start.
It has been decades now and Saturn has never proved it’s business case. The rest of Roger Smith’s crazy ideas where long ago tossed overboard and Saturn needs to go as well. Without the Aura distraction the new Malibu could have come out a year earlier. Volume GM family cars belong in the Chevrolet showroom. The idea that GM needed an entire new division to compete with imports was stupid from the start and remains so.
I disagree strongly. 300,000 SLx’s in a year for one basic model was terrific sales. And it was potentially a very good car (although the engines on generation one were pretty bad, many of them used a lot of oil). If they’d kept the focus, and improved the quality, they would have a lot of loyal repeat customers. Including me.
I REALLY wanted to like the Astra. Then I sat in one. Then I looked at the sticker. Then I talked to the least enthusiatic car saleswoman I’ve ever encountered. Then I picked up a gasket for my SW2. And then, finally, I left and went to test drive a Mazda 3 and Civic si.
The Astra (and ever other new Saturn, other than possibly the redesigned Vue) is a total sales dud.
Sales figures so far:
Feb 08: 757
Mar 08: 720
Total: 1,477
Toyota sells more Corollas in a day than Saturn sells Astras in a month.
Saturn has never made fiscal sense. It didn’t make sense when all they sold was Corolla-clones, and it doesn’t make sense now they are trying (and failing) to go upscale, especially if they stick with their no-haggle policy and sell stuff that other GM dealers that do haggle sell clones of. It’s a giant black hole that sucks up the contents of GM’s bank accounts.
David Holzman :
Even in the days of selling 300,000 Corolla-clones, Saturn was losing buckets of money. It didn’t make fiscal sense to set up an entire dealer network to sell one car, no matter how good the car is (and the original Saturns did compete fairly well with Civics and Corollas of the era). But the problem is that now everybody thinks “Corolla-clone” when they think of Saturn, so they can’t add upscale products to the mix, especially if they stick with their no-haggle pricing policy, and if they no longer actually sell a Corolla-clone (the Astra is an overpriced, sporty hatchback, not a fuel-sipping commuter sedan like the original Saturn was).
Welcome to the new GM superstore!!!
Kill off the duplicates, sell every GM at every dealer. No need for 5 versions of the same stuff.
People, I don’t want to buy a car – good or average – froma company that makes dumb decisions, with an out of date business plan, assembled by unhappy workers under a management corp who thinks they can put one over on me.
I’d rather buy a quality car from a company that has enthusiastic workers, lean management that represent the best of their breed with a long term plan.
The Opel, -er, Saturn Astra remains on my short list until I get to drive one and feel differently about it. I FINALLY saw my first Aura last weekend on the highway and aside from funky curves on the trunk lid I thought it was alot better looking than anything Saturn has ever sold in a four door sedan and even a bit better than the rest of the working guy sedans that GM currently sells.
I still might buy us an Astra 3-door and then slap the proper Opel badges on it and make people scratch their heads and ask what the heck is it. Then I’ll tell ’em they can buy one today. Except – I’ll buy a used Astra if there is such a thing b/c I’m a working guy and can’t let go of that much cash.
Oh yeah, that’s right – economy stinks and I plan to get another 50K miles out of our 150K mile Honda and VW.
Hang on Saturn, I’ll be with you in about 5 more years.