Why isn't GM's OnStar quaking in its e-boots? The proliferation of portable GPS (Global Positioning Satellite) devices has rendered their telemetry system's navigation service the VHS of sat knavery. Speaking to WardsAuto, OnStar's President says pish-posh [paraphrasing], and reveals himself as a fan of John F. Kennedy's "rising tide equals multiple boat lifting" shtick. Chet Huber claims "the boom in portable navigation systems is good for his business too." Yes, but what's the Unique Selling Point? "There is a lot to be said for the aesthetics of a factory-installed system." Meanwhile, OnStar fights back! "OnStar currently offers turn-by-turn navigation to subscribers and for the ’09 model year will make “Destination Download” available to 80% of all GM vehicles. The feature allows subscribers with screen-based navigation systems to download destinations from an OnStar adviser on the fly. Another feature bowing later this year for screen-based users is 'OnStar e-Nav' which allows a subscriber to plan routes at MapQuest.com and then download up to five destinations to his vehicle." Wait! Do you hear it? Sounds like somebody closing the barn door after the horse has bolted.
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I normally hate on GM for being stupid, but after my car was broken into courtesy of the suction cup residue on my windshield, I think he’s got a point. In the future I will pay a premium for factory GPS just so I can stop worrying about someone smashing my window to see whether the suction cup marks indicate that I left my portable unit in the glove box, under the seat, etc.
Aftermarket navigation systems hanging from a suction cup have a distinct advantage: you can pick up a decent one for $200.
brownie: I normally hate on GM for being stupid, but after my car was broken into courtesy of the suction cup residue on my windshield, I think he’s got a point. In the future I will pay a premium for factory GPS just so I can stop worrying about someone smashing my window to see whether the suction cup marks indicate that I left my portable unit in the glove box, under the seat, etc. Sounds like you've got a better handle on the market than Mr. Huber.
What ever happened to the aftermarket navs that sat on top of your dash using a nonskid beanbag? I know that’s a little dated now, but it’s probably a lot quicker to stash than the suction cup version.
The next iPhone is due in a few weeks with rumored 3G and GPS – one device to do it all, maybe. I’m personally hoping that raging demand for the new iPhone will suppress prices of the outgoing model to be able to pick one up on the cheap for jailbreaking.
I don’t like anything on my dash, but newer GPS portables offer better software and more up to date streets. The software in BMW and Honda (the two I know) sucks.
It’s good that OnStar isn’t just about directions. Stolen vehicle recovery, unlocking doors, crash notification, emergency aid, onboard vehicle diagnostics, that thing that makes the car slow down in a police chase, phone calls…It’s more than the average Garmin.
Prices for in-car systems need to come down dramatically. They are still $1500-$2500 options even though hand-helds for come down to the $100-$600 range. Five years ago, the premium for an in-car system was around $500, now it is over $1000.
Thanks RF. There are so many articles arguing the economics of the hybrid/diesel premium…while factory satnavs cost 10X the aftermarket jobs. People will literally pay two thousand dollars for satnav but balk at the same sort of cost bump for fuel economy!?! Would be funny if it wasn’t so sad.
ash78 :
What ever happened to the aftermarket navs that sat on top of your dash using a nonskid beanbag? I know that’s a little dated now, but it’s probably a lot quicker to stash than the suction cup version.
You can still get the beanbags (I got mine at Best Buy). They come with a smooth plastic disk in the center to stick the suction cup to. That way you can just pick up the whole thing and stash it when needed.
I don’t like the factory units. If factory sat-nav was just that, I’d have no problem with it. However, they make you buy upgraded sound systems and combine other controls with the sat-nav (which drives the price up), and then you have to wade through several levels of menus to find whatever you want (all the while hurdling down the road at 65 mph). As long as that’s the way it is, I’ll pass on them and keep my Garmin.
There are positives and negatives to all GPS based navigations systems, and I think I own them all, from built in factory systems in my Lexus, portables like my Garmin Nuvi, OnStar in my Chevy, and iGuidance on my GPS equipped AT&T Tilt.
But it’s hard to beat a good factory system, and Denso OEM’s some of the best for people like Toyota and even GM.
But the worst is probably OnStar. No screen. But if that’s all you have, and you’re lost, it’s pretty good. But I hate OnStar for other reasons – they’ve held back GM from including Bluetooth for years (although it’s finally starting to trickle into GM cars) so they can force you into expensive calling plans (unless you’re a Verizon customer – then you can share minutes).
So many good points to be made for the after market units. One I like is that I keep my cars for 5+ years. Will the auto manufacturer keep updating those old units? Will I want to be using such old technology then anyway? If it breaks in 4 years, will I want to bother having it repaired for big bucks? If my Garmin doesn’t serve my needs anymore I can pick up a new unit and it will probably cost less in a few years (and work better).
Of course built in nav has a few advantages. In some cars they can display other information and control some other car systems. But, not sure if that’s worth it.
I can comfortably sit at my desk and program either of my portable GPS unts while I have the internet, my map programs, and the road atlas at hand. This is a distinct advantage over being in the car.
The newer speaks street names and cost me $150. The older was just updated by Magellan and is equivalent except for the street names. I can buy a lot of portable GPS units for what a built-in unit costs and constantly have the latest features.
Granted, the larger screen is nice, but mine is much more in my line of sight which I consider a safety attribute.
By the way, I have Onstar in my tow vehicle, but I don’t use the nav functions.
Don’t want any device that most of the interior systems rely on – Nav, HVAC, stereo, etc. I have an 11 year old car and it’s getting hard to buy parts for. What do I do if it had one of these screens and at 13 years old it dies? Suddenly I can’t access any of the center stack features. Nope, I’ll take a good DIN sized stereo (easy replacement), a portable NAV (how about a standard socket that all cars come with for these portable nav units to snap in? Would power it and hold it and b/c all cars would have it, who would guess your car has a NAV unit?),and I like the basic HVAC controls in my car (rotary knobs actuating cables and doors).
‘OnStar e-Nav’ which allows a subscriber to plan routes at MapQuest.com and then download up to five destinations to his vehicle.”
Who uses Mapquest anymore? I dropped them years ago when Google Maps started kicking Mapquest’s ass. I love in Google Maps how you can grab your route and drop it on another road. And it exports to Google Earth, blogs, etc, etc.
Buick61:
It’s good that OnStar isn’t just about directions. Stolen vehicle recovery, unlocking doors,… that thing that makes the car slow down in a police chase…It’s more than the average Garmin.
I’ll take a Garmin. Outside of the southern California Bronco driving demographic, don’t most Americans want to speed up when chased by police?
I have to say, I disagree with your assessment of OnStar’s competitiveness a little bit. OnStar, it seems to me, has one unique selling point: you’re talking to a real human, not interacting with a computerized map on a screen. There are a lot of people out there who are techphobic. Not on this blog, so much, but in the real world, for sure. Older people especially. I think there are a ton of people who’d rather get directions from a real live human than from a box, either suctioned to the windshield or on the dashboard. And if newer GM cars have both nav systems and OnStar, then it’s a killer combination. Big Brother issues aside, I think OnStar is something that GM got exactly right.
My trailblazer came with this intrusive crap.
Now, I am stuck with an old analog system that is never activated.
I do have two portable navigations, Novi360 and Magellan 4000.
Both are wonderful with the Garmin the better.
I can take from car to car and touch screans can’t be beat.
Buy a map.
Volvo was ahead of their time when they designed the interior of the 240, as I have cubby holes in which sat-navs or Sirius receivers fit perfectly. Out of site from anyone looking to burgle me.
I’ve had handheld units and three generations of factory installed nav. The handhelds are tinkertoys in comparison. The level of sophistication of the factory installed navs can’t be matched with a handheld device. One second generation system that I still own is over five years old and still works fine. The fourth generation system that I have is amazing. Unfortunately, it’s in a lease vehicle so I won’t own it much longer than another year. After that of course my next vehicle will have to have nav. I can’t go back to a handheld any more than I could go back to dialup internet.
Not interested in more expen$ive factory electronic bling offering opportunities for distraction from the task of actually driving.
My daughter’s solution is a good one. She installs her Garmin on the underside of the sunroof and lets it talk to her. No suction cup telltales, no temptation to look at the thing instead of the road. She will have already reviewed the route ahead of time so the spoken instructions are just a prompt. Works exactly the same way in any car she drives and all to date have had sunroofs…..
ha ha ha
when i read the title (before clicking on the article), i thought that it was referring to sun-screens for your rear-seat windows and rear-windshield….
both screen based systems, and the factory ones don’t have suction cups…
Price is an issue here — I updated my Garmin Nüvi with a download for $69, while a new set of DVDs for my Volvo’s $2000 pop-up Navteq-based GPS costs $200. The built-in has a much bigger screen and good satellite reception, but the data base in the Garmin is more complete and has better search algorithms. Also, the Garmin software has more complete voice prompts, with good pronunciation of street names and destinations. I frequently carry the portable on trips as a supplement, using it as a walking-around aid that remembers where I left the car. Try that with a built-in!
Factory Based systems are nice and neat, I was an installer for ONstar when it first became available, and one of the factory points of mention was the opportunity of Pay as you go leases. Basiclly, if you did not pay your car payment or exceeded your lease miles the car would not start until you called in a payment or updated your contract.
Factory installed navigation systems are very convenient and nice and neat as stated before but costly. You just have to decide if the convenience, safety (from theft) are worth the price. How big is your wallet?
Factory installed navigation systems are very convenient and nice and neat as stated before but costly. You just have to decide if the convenience, safety (from theft) are worth the price. How big is your wallet?
Well, since Chrysler is throwing in their nav systems for free now cost isn’t really a factor. Also, since I’m currently leasing instead of buying even when they weren’t free the increase in the lease payment was insignificant. I think that I’ll stick with the free superior product.
Theodore:
Buy a map.
Or, print one out. Not that I’m any good at reading them – a good road trip for me is about 1 U-turn per day.
This is another feature that will follow the same path as built-in CD players… first very expensive and with 3rd party options to lower cost, but moving to a point where almost all vehicles will have it either as mandatory or as a very low-cost option.
I think we’ll get to a point where the nav, climate control, trip computer stuff, service schedule, TMPS, etc are all housed on a single touch screen in the center console. Personally, I hate all this stuff and I hope that day never comes, but I fear it is just around the corner.
By the way, driving with ANYTHING obstructing the front windscreen or front side windows is illegal in California. Tree-shaped car fresheners hanging from the rear view mirror are forbidden as well as suction cups on the windows. That said, I like portable GPS concept for a few reasons:
* much lower cost
* I can configure from the comfort of my own computer
* I can throw it out and get another one in 3 years and STILL be cheaper than a built-in unit
* I can take it with me on my bicycle, photography expeditions (where it can be matched up with the pictures taken), and on hikes
* I can use it in friends’ vehicles
* there isn’t any of that lawyer stuff where you have to wait for 10 seconds of warnings before using
* there isn’t any of that lawyer stuff where the PASSENGER can’t use it when the vehicle is moving
How can you compare OnStar with aftermarket nav? OnStar is MUCH more than driving directions. Also, it is hard wired and integrated into my car. Also, I could have opted for full blown nav system with touch screen if I wanted to (in addition to Directions and Connections). And if it breaks within the next 4 years I get it repaired for free. I know it is primarily a GM feature and therefore subject to additional scrutiny.
Never really felt the need for the turn-by-turn navigating systems – it would annoy the crap out of me to hear a voice saying “turn left in one mile.”
But it does make me wonder about something: I stopped memorizing phone numbers (except for my own) about the same time I got my first cell phone (which of course stored all my frequently called numbers.) Honestly I can’t remember my girlfriend’s cell phone number right now.
Will sat-nav kill people’s instincts for finding their way around? I know I take great pleasure in knowing where streets go and which routes connect with which other routes – I can’t understand people who sit in traffic jams for hours. I make it a point to know a way around so an alternate route is always available to me. But I also know some people are just not spatially aware and I guess for these people a sat-nav system can be a benefit.
BTW, the best things about my cheapo $180 Magellan “suction cup” GPS are (a) I can move it between my truck, my motorcycle, my bicycle or on foot, (b) cheap to buy, to keep, and to upgrade, (c) has forest service roads, 4wd trails and other things that an in-dash system wouldn’t and (d) will work even if the car/truck/bike doesn’t.
Theodore:
Buy a map.
how 2 dimensional can you get?
HEATHROI :
May 20th, 2008 at 3:47 pm
Theodore:
Buy a map.
how 2 dimensional can you get?
Well, I tried a globe, but the scale was a real bitch. Anyway, there aren’t too many places you can drive a great circle route.
I’ve used all three (W/S mount, factory nav, OnStar). My preference for nav is W/S mount, mainly because it’s “hanging from the windshield”, which, as it happens, is exactly where you are looking most of the time. Looking down at the console to inspect the factory nav systems is more distracting than useful. And, as pointed out here several times, W/S mount is way cheaper.
OnStar is one of those things that is tough to market; you don’t “get it” until you really use it. When you are hanging upside-down from your seatbelt after getting T-boned by a full size SUV, that voice over the phone asking if you are alright and if you need help is priceless. The radio campaign they did with the taped conversations with OnStar advisors was brilliant, really captured that experience.
Turn by turn nav is inferior to W/S or factory nav systems, except for the ability to use a human to find a POI. That is a big benefit.
I was just pondering OEM sat navs while purchasing the IS350 and 350Z. Should a 2008 $30k+ plus car have sat nav standard?
The Lexus sat nav has built in back up camera and can play DVD’s while in park, the Nissan does not.
Conclusion, for premium brands get the OEM sat nav for no premium brands skip it and get a Garmin or TomTom.
Just a short note from deepest, darkest Africa. Down here in the carjacking capital of the world, viz. Johannesburg, the police have issued a warning against programming vehicle satnavs with your home address…
It appears that the thieving, violent scum that prefer to liberate you from your vehicle at the sharp end of a gun in this neck of the woods have cottoned on to the fact that it’s much easier to burgle a home when you have the keys, remotes etc, as well as a handy navigation device to guide you there (by using the “Home”-function).
Moreover, since you have stolen the homeowner’s vehicle, the chances of anyone being home (or, being able to get there fast) are remote.
Consequently, the contents of the home can be removed at leisure and transported from the scene of the crime in the aforementioned stolen vehicle.
Just some food for thought…