The 6.0-liter G8 is a wonderful car. But I was curious about the V6. Supposedly, the smaller engined variant will account for the majority of sales. And RF's been bugging me for a review of the "entry level" G8 ever since the Aussie-built sedan first hit the showroom floor. Getting a G8 V6 via the GM press fleet is as about as realistic as dividing by zero. So I hit up NY-area dealerships. Two weeks, no joy. A regular check of Pontiac.com eventually revealed two G8 V6s at Cunningham Buick Pontiac GMC in Bayside, NY. Upon arrrival, I discovered they had no G8s or any kind, sort or description. "But give us your number, and we'll call you this Friday when we get several more delivered– including a V6." Great. On Saturday morning, a salesperson called. "The V6 G8 is here!" When I got there in the early afternoon… no G8 V6. "Oh, we must have sold it this morning." Yes, in the course of a morning, a G8 V6 was arrived by a truck, found a buyer, got prepped and left. In four hours. All without the salesman's knowledge. The G8, in eight-cylinder form at least, is a kick ass car and a great deal. But with dealerships plying the ole' bait and switch, product excellence doesn't matter. [NB: this is not the first report of this c'mon down oops no V6 we've heard. Has anyone even seen one?]
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Slightly OT but does anyone know why the G8 is so much cheaper in the us than Australia? The aussie dollar has been consistently trading well over 90 us cents.
The V6 starts at about 35k here while pontiac sells the v8 for under 30k?
hokuto:
Slightly OT but does anyone know why the G8 is so much cheaper in the us than Australia? The aussie dollar has been consistently trading well over 90 us cents.
The V6 starts at about 35k here while pontiac sells the v8 for under 30k?
Not OT at all. At least when it comes to the V6, maybe the reason Pontiac can sell it so cheaply in the States is because they don’t. Sell it, I mean.
As for the G8 V8, well, there’s no way GM’s making a dime on this thing. The original plan unveiled by GM Car Czar Bob Lutz: “test the waters” with the Australian version, then build the G8 stateside.
I assume the plan was mooted to soothe the UAW; Maximum Bob’s deal was set before the automotive press before the last union contract was negotiated and, after The Mother of All Bribes (a.k.a. health care VEBA), ratified.
Keep in mind that the UAW stipulated how many Aussie-built GTOs GM could import. In that case, it turned-out that the UAW saved GM millions. In this case, I haven’t heard the Aussie G8 as a warm-up for the US G8 idea ONCE since the union contract was ratified.
Anyway, Pontiac dealers, famous amongst enthusiasts for bilking pistonhads on the early Solstii, seem to be keeping to the bend over and smile retail philosophy.
I have yet to see any variant of the G8 on the streets. And I don’t drive by any Pontiac dealerships routinely so I can’t say I’ve seen any at those hell-holes either, but they may be there–collecting dust.
B-Rad:
And I don’t drive by any Pontiac dealerships routinely so I can’t say I’ve seen any at those hell-holes either, but they may be there–collecting dust.
Point of information. They’re not “Pontiac dealers” any more. They’re BuickPontiacGMC (BPG) dealers, selling your choice of three Buicks, seven Pontiacs and seven GMCs. Plus performance and hybrid variants.
hokuto;
I suspect the G8 is more expensive in Aus. for the same reason it’s also more expensive in Can. That is, profit margin. The US market has always been a vibrant one to compete in as consumers will mortgage their mothers to get the upgraded ICE, so it is potentially much more lucrative than other markets.
That manufacturers are willing to sacrifice their profit margin to compete in the US is illustrated by the fact that the fallen greenback should have caused a steep increase in the price of import vehicles but it hasn’t. Instead, importers are allowing their bottom line to take a hit, as reported earlier on TTAC;
A LOT of dealers are sleazy like this.
EG, when my sister was looking to buy her Fit, and wanted a testdrive, we called around for dealers that had a manual.
One said they did, a good 20 miles away. We went there only to find that they only had automatics, with a sleazy salesman saying “See, paddle shifters, thats a manual” and me pointing to the sticker and going “NO BITCH!”
Needless to say, we tesdrode at a different dealer, and she did NOT buy from the inital dealer either.
So its I don’t think an uncommon tactic.
I’ve seen a G8 V6. The thing that struck me most about it was how negligible the difference was in price between it and the V8 version, something around $2k, IIRC. Since the mpg penalty is minimal, as well, under normal circumstances, I would think it’d be quite difficult for Pontiac to unload the G8 V6 on anyone. But with the current high price of gas, even one mpg better than the V8 is reason enough for many people to forego the V8 and take the V6 instead.
Then someone bought it. Then they prepped it. Then the person took delivery. In four hours.
It hypothetically could happen… A mechanic friend of mine said they could PDI? a Nissan or Kia in 20 minutes, and the mechanic who did it the quickest on average each month got a $300 cash tax-free spiff for doing so. I know he would win every other month because he’d take us drinking when the money came through.
I have not seen a G8 of any kind in my GM town… I’ve starting to see more Malibus, but at least half been rentals. I drove by the Trailblazin’ factory parking lot 4 times this week… could count the number of employee cars there on one hand. Where are the AA axles for the hot sellin’ TB, SAAB 97, Envoy?
Robert Farago:
They’re not “Pontiac dealers” any more. They’re BuickPontiacGMC (BPG) dealers, selling your choice of three Buicks, seven Pontiacs and seven GMCs.
Well, not all of them. The dealership where my dad works is just BP. Apparently they’ve had negotiations to buy out a local GMC franchise (or get bought out by them), but it’s never come to fruition.
Oh, and their site says that they have three V6 G8s on the lot right now. Not sure how accurate that is.
I imagine that GM dealers are pretty desperate for a sale, ANY sale, these days and will stoop to anything to score. These guys have a lot full of metal to move and bills to pay. And while the dealers are stuck with their specific inventory, the consumer can buy a car/truck from just about anywhere in the world. So the dealer feels the need to play games and get the customer on the lot at all costs.
It’s precisely these sleazy dealer tactics that cause so much long term damage in perception with the consumer/customer. But short term, it just might work, so…
I’m not sure about big-town dealerships, but in my city of +/- 106,000 folks, even the best dealers (Toyota and Honda) take about 3 days to prep their cars completely.
Maybe because there’s no rush in a small town like this, but even a great deal can sit on the lot (right off of the highway) for weeks.
Completely off-topic, but does it bother anyone else that the dealerships take off all of the protective wrappings on a car’s interior for test-drives?? Those special checklist sheets that the major manufacturers require to hang on the rearview mirror? I’ve never been walked through. I’ve been a part of 4 new car purchases in 3 years, yet no dealership has explained squat about the vehicles sold (even though they are “required to” – I found one of the lists in the trunk of my car a day after purchasing, everything checked and signed by the seller). You sign the paperwork, they give you the keys and walk away…
Dealer preparation is just a scam, they hardly do anything except wash the Vehicle, put a few gallons in the Tank and “Bob’s your Uncle” they charge the customer a lot for nothing imho!
Dealer by me (upstate NY) has 4 of them. I’ll go drive one and post a review if TTAC lets me drive the Cayenne GTS. :)
rpenna:
Please contact me for the writers’ guidelines: robert.farago@thetruthaboutcars.com
George Labrador: “Dealer preparation is just a scam, they hardly do anything except wash the Vehicle, put a few gallons in the Tank and “Bob’s your Uncle” they charge the customer a lot for nothing imho!”
It’s a scam if they charge for it, but as another poster pointed out, to entirely take all the protective material off does take a little time. I think in most cases there’s actually two dealer preps performed, a ‘lot prep’ then the ‘customer prep’. If the vehicle in question is currently in high enough demand (the 2008 Challenger SRT-8 probably fits) where people are waiting at the dealership when the transporter arrives, they’ll probably be waiting longer for their car to be completely prepped, too.
The initial prep is done right after the vehicle comes off the carrier which removes the majority of the coverings (hell, there are even covers on the wheels) and preps the car for the lot. Then the car gets another prep immediately before customer delivery.
Regardless, there’s no excuse for using ‘bait and switch’ to get someone in the showroom. Apparently, some auto salesmen (mainly domestic vehicles) have been at it long enough to feel that the old practice of pissing off nineteen customers by lying to them to get them in the showroom is worth it in order to get the twentieth one to buy something they hadn’t intended in the first place.
I saw two (V8’S) last month at Wright Pontiac/GMC (no Buick) in Wexford, PA.
I was actually looking at the 2009 Vibe; but I ended up buying my Elantra from Wright Hyundai down the street.
A little OT also:
I took a day off work (Monday, March 24th); I saw a manual tranny Elantra SE on their website ($2K Rebate); went to the dealer, hooked up with a newbie salesman, telling him I needed to buy the car “today”. They found the car at the back of the lot, I test drove it with all of the interior and exterior plastic in place.
When they told me that they would give me more money for my trade than I had already decided as the “minimum”; I told them to prep that car, and I’d be back in the afternoon with a check from my credit union.
I was in the dealer @ 11:00 AM, and drove out with a freshly washed and waxed Elantra by 2:30PM. (And a full tank of gas!)
So, I was happy that I could tell all of my co-workers that I “bought my Hyundai on a Monday”.
Much of the profit in selling cars these days is in the options. For any given model, dealers will only stock one or two strippos, just to put the lowball in the ad and get showroom traffic.
That being said, I’ve found GM dealers to be as notoriously skanky as their cars.
Four on the lot at Noonan Pontiac in Sterling Hts, MI
The sleaze factor is definitely not a domestic/import issue at all. In the late 1990’s, it was widely believed that Toyota dealers were the sleaziest ones in the Southeast region.
A lot of it had to do with the pseudo-Toyoguard package that bumped up the price of nearly every decent selling Toyota in the Southeast by about $600. Other than a cheap stainguard spray and some VIN#’s on windows, it was worthless. But if you wanted to buy a Camry in the Southeast, it was part of the price. May of them also would put in faux wood treatments that worth, maybe $100, and bump up the price another $1000.
Another far nastier issue over the years has been the documentation fees and the other related bogus fees. I know a fellow who charges $799 on top of what he will finance (usually a $2500 to $3500 car that he bought for $700 to $1200). When you throw in 28% interest on the deal and 90+% cash payments, you end up with one amazing profit margin.
The sleaze begins and ends with the dealer. The brand does not matter a lick.
Did a quick scan through the Pontiac site for NH dealers – there are 6 V6s and 8 V8s in the state (nice symmetry!)
I did a quick check at the local BPG + Caddy and Chevy dealer in Concord NH (the same group also has a Saab franchise down the street – how lucky!) The locater says they have 2 V8s, but I only found one on the lot – a “1 of 888” model that stickered for 32K IIRC.
The car was sitting a bit forlorn over on the far side of the building, 180 degrees away from the sales entrance, right next to a new 2007 Silverado with a “Special Deal – Buy Now!” sign on it. Ah to be a GM dealer…
The majority of 2008 G8 production was V6 models, something like 70%. The majority of the V6s are still out there while the V8s are almost gone.
For 2009 Holden is going to ship over a majority of V8s this time around to feed the need. Like any muscle car, the V8 model is the draw and the one people want.
““Bob’s your Uncle” they charge the customer”
Add on dealer prep fees are a thing of the past, at least in our area. The factory pays it to the dealer.
I saw my first G8 on the road on Thursday. From the back an rear three quarter view it was gorgeous. I’m not sure I’m in the market fora RWD sedan right now, but if I was I’d look closer at one of these, V6 or otherwise. It looked that good.
…”Dealer preparation is just a scam…”
Franchised new car dealerships are paid by their manufacturer a set fee to perform “dealer prep” on new vehicles before delivery. (Some call it Pre-Delivery or PDI (pre-delivery inspection)).
So, whether they take 5 minutes or an hour, if a dealer charges the customer anything it’s a ripoff inasmuch as they’ve already been paid by their OEM for the same work.
I’ve actually seen TWO G8 V6’s. Both black on black. They only had 1 GT, red on red/black. I chose to test drive the V8, and liked it a lot. The automatic transmission was unbearable, so I’d wait for the 2009 model when a manual is available.
The dealer I dealt with was very agreeable. I called beforehand to ask if they had any G8’s (yes) and if they were available for test drive (yes). I got there and the salesman i talked on the phone met me. One of the black V6’s was in the showroom, then the other black V6 outside along with the red V8 GT. After the test drive, the salesman admitted he didn’t know much about the car, so he got another person who had went through a GM training on the car. He was very knowledgeable and we talked cars for a while, very little pressure. With the G8 being so new, they’re not budging from MSRP, but no markup either. He also said the manual should be in around Christmas.
Edit: this was a BPG in Everett, WA
Steven Lang: “The sleaze factor is definitely not a domestic/import issue at all. In the late 1990’s, it was widely believed that Toyota dealers were the sleaziest ones in the Southeast region.”
Toyota’s actually gotten pretty damn slick about it. I’m talking about the ‘carpeted floor mats’ that are on every last Toyota Monroney sticker. Although it might look like something that has to be included, it’s not a factory option. It’s a ‘dealer added accessory’ that’s really just a little added bonus Toyota (or someone) puts on the sticker so every dealership can pad the total with some half-ass floor mats that the dealership got for a fraction of what’s on the sticker.
On my next Toyota purchase, I’m going to tell them to stuff those floor mats – I’ll buy my own for a whole lot less.
I had similar things happen when searching for Altima and Maxima 6MTs a few years ago when the Maxima was still offered with a manual. Ditto with the Accord 6MT. I believe I also had it happen to me once looking to drive a Civic Si Sedan.
Had I actually been able to find a Maxima 6MT on a dealer lot in my area, I would probably be driving one now.
I talked to my friend today… their incentive to get the PDI done so quickly was because they were paid a set amount of labor hours per car for prep, inspection. A certain Nissan might pay 2.5 hours on PDI on one car @ a reduced labor rate, so the quicker they got it done, the more money they would make. Later in his career, he got a percentage of the extra payable time when doing stuff a lot quicker than specified (when there wasn’t a high number of “bringbacks”).
So basically the inspection was looking for obvious flaws, making sure power accessories worked, and flooring it to 95mph and seating the brakes and such…. repeatedly. I guess he got into trouble for flatspotting Sentra tires on a regular basis.
hokuto :
Slightly OT but does anyone know why the G8 is so much cheaper in the us than Australia? The aussie dollar has been consistently trading well over 90 us cents.
The V6 starts at about 35k here while pontiac sells the v8 for under 30k?
I believe it may have a lot to do with tax credits…
The Aussie Car Manufacturers are very heavily protected via import tarrifs…
I believe (I have been told) Holden will get a credit for each export dollar they earn…thus allowing Holden to pay far less import tax on those cars they import (which is everything that isnt a Commodore)…
I can’t even lay my eyes on a G8. When I check dealer inventory, it shows 6 of them at area dealers. When I’ve taken the time to visit them to check them out, I’m told they just sold their last one but they expect 4 more in stock the following Friday.
I’m starting to wonder if this car really exists.
The sleaze factor is definitely not a domestic/import issue at all. In the late 1990’s, it was widely believed that Toyota dealers were the sleaziest ones in the Southeast region.
This is probably true.
I know, having been to several Albuquerque, New Mexico dealerships, that a lot of dealerships are really bad, even Toyota and Nissan ones.
I’ve been to a Toyota dealer where I asked to see a base 4 x 4 Tacoma 4-cyl. The dealer comes back with keys to a fully-loaded V-6 extended cab with automatic. My mom said it was one of the cheapest looking cars she’d ever seen on the inside (hahahaha) but wanted to come back because the dealership was so big it was almost awe-inspiring to all of us. I’ll never want to go back after having the bait and switch put on me.
Our local Nissan dealerships were mixed. One was great, and the salesman was good and showed us the cars (Nissan Frontier XE) we wanted to see. The other (on the west side) was crap (we were looking for same car). Salesman calls me thirty minutes after we left. Not going back.
On the other hand, I’ve been to a Jeep dealer where a salesman literally stepped behind our car as we entered their parking lot and wouldn’t step back so we could leave (we didn’t even exit the car, he scared us so bad). I will never set foot into that dealership again.
Our Ford dealers are generally OK, but they did talk my mom into buying a 2007 Escape at full price. On the other hand, when the battery went out within a week of purchase they towed it for free, so I guess you get what you pay for.
Our Isuzu and GM dealers were pretty good, the Isuzu dealer made me want to buy a car from him (couldn’t afford it) and the GM ones were nothing special.
It’s interesting that I haven’t really had a “bait-and-switch” pulled on any of my family members. A dealer once talked my mom into buying an F-150 over an Explorer, but the F-150 turned out to be the better buy, and my mom grew to like it. I don’t know if that counts or not.
These are some interesting stories on this topic here.
I’ve seen a G8 GT privately owned on the street, in addition to at least one on the lot in one dealership and three on the lot at another dealership. The first shipment was preordered by GM in certain specific packages, with no choice in options by the dealership. At least at the dealership nearest me, the option for a customer ordered and then delivered G8 was not in place yet. The assignment of the number of G8s per dealership was based on the number of new cars the dealers were able to sell, such that lower volume dealers didn’t get any. I’m told by my friends at GM that the G8 was supposed to break even when they first planned it, but the weakness of the U.S. dollar has lead to a loss, even though the prices were hedged against such an occurrence.
The G8 is cheaper in the U.S. than Australia because car prices in the U.S. have not risen as the U.S. dollar has fallen. The car was approved when the Aussie dollar was worth about 70 U.S. cents.
Auto makers have been hoping that if they stick it out long enough the U.S. dollar will bounce back. But at some point prices will have to adjust, and then there’s going to be a world of pain.
The Pontiac dealer (yes – solo Pontiac dealer) by me in Delray Beach had more than a few G8 V6s…I was perusing the lot Sunday (because…I love pain?).
$27,945 on the sticker of most of them. I didn’t drive them (because I was in a hurry), but they looked to be a huge improvement over the old FWD offerings in styling, fit, and finish.
That might be damning it with faint praise, though.
rudiger :
But with the current high price of gas, even one mpg better than the V8 is reason enough for many people to forego the V8 and take the V6 instead.
Or even an I4 Camry/Accord/Altima, another “mission accomplished” by GM.
We were in Colorado Springs a few weeks ago and Mike Shaw Pontiac Buick GMC had a couple of the V6s on the lot. The V8 was out front for all to see.
We went to the dealership after hours. No salespeople. My ‘out’ at a dealership is that I work for a leasing company (which I do) and we only buy fleet. The sales people will then leave you alone.
“But give us your number, and we’ll call you this Friday when we get several more delivered– including a V6.” Great. On Saturday morning, a salesperson called. “The V6 G8 is here!” When I got there in the early afternoon… no G8 V6. “Oh, we must have sold it this morning.” Yes, in the course of a morning, a G8 V6 was arrived by a truck, found a buyer, got prepped and left.”
Car probably arrived sometime on Friday. Car is hot. Probably sold and delivered. I don’t think it’s fair to slam the dealer for doing his job. All before you could waste their time by writing a review for TTAC.