After reading Wilkinson's GT-R review, I sent him an email expressing how much I enjoyed his take on Godzilla. And how I'm humbled by his wordsmithery. More importantly, I agree with his impression of the baddest ever Nissan. Are we driving cars or driving computers? Several of TTAC's Best and Brightest (however) highlight the fact that the ex-Car and Driver editor didn't grow up playing video games. He can't possibly "get" the car. (Which is a polite way of calling him old.) One commenter asked to hear Stephan's 28-year-old daughter's take on the car, assuming her age would make her take more relevant. While I'm older than his daughter, I'm in the demo that came of age with a joystick in hand [Ee: so to speak] First of all, what kind of a car is only enjoyed by a single age range? A bad one. Look– a friend of mine in his late 50s says that selling his '65 GTO was the dumbest thing he's ever done, I get it. I get it, big time. Just like he gets my WRX– although he thinks it looks stupid. But you know something? It does look stupid. It's a station wagon with a spoiler– it's supposed to look stupid. Oh right, the question. Do certain cars only work for certain age groups?
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Maybe certain cars only appeal to certain age groups, who knows. I’m in my mid 20s and would rather drive a purely mechanical and simple sports car or American muscle car than a GTR which sounds cold and soulless to me despite it’s blazing performance. I think there’s more to a car than nav screens, magazine numbers and how many processors govern it’s brakes and wheels.
Yes. You will never see a senior behind the wheel of a uglified (ie winged, with a coffe can exhaust and fifteen tons of stickers) Honda Civic or Dodge Neon.
Also, Buicks kinda have their own demographic.
Well, I’m 31 years old and an avid videogame player, so I fall into the “young” category. That said, what I want in a car is:
– responsive handling
– sporty suspension, yet not too harsh
– peppy engine
– seats accommodating my 6″2′ frame
I’m willing to see a computer under the hood to assist with ABS and airbag deployment, but idrive and the prius computer screen are just abhorrent to me.
Why? Because I like driving! If I want to play videogames, I’ll sit on my couch, thank you very much.
However, I know my 20-year old sisters-in-law couldn’t care less about how the car handles, but love satellite radio, nav systems, and “snow” button (that’s the button that dumbs the car down for those who can’t drive themselves).
That leads me to think that the real predictor of how people want their cars to behave is not game consoles, but cell phones.
I want a cell phone to call people, and a car to drive.
My sisters-in-law want cellphones to call, text, surf the web, take pictures, listen to music,…
And a car to call, text, listen to music and, oh yeah, drive.
Point being? It’s not so much about being old or young, it’s about being focussed on one thing or multi-taking (generally poorly).
I don’t know if I make much sense…
Sure.. there always should be. I believe lots of our complaints of many modern cars being boring is in the fact that car companies try to make them have broad appeal. Yet its the cars that we outright hate that we secretly have some respect for how they pull off their “thing”.
I think that we’re now so far from the purely mechanical cars of the 50’s – 70’s that hardly any of the current generation have ever driven a well tuned one. They have no frame of reference to compare to other than 0-60 times.
It’s impossible to explain the tactle sensation of being a participant in the driving process with a car that really needs you make it work right. I know I greatly prefer to drive an older car that demands you know it’s quirks and rewards such knowledge.
I don’t know if it’s age groups, or just different cultures. I’m a _HUGE_ computer nerd and an even bigger statistics nerd (I wrote software to monitor the temperature in each room of my house and log it every second so I can make plots of temperature variations). So I love cars that will give me every gauge known to man, I think it’s great that the GT-R gives me customizable stuff. So while I do love driving my ’76 CJ-5 without any electronics, I understand and would love a car like the GT-R that drowns me in information. Likewise, I love the CJ with an unsyncronized (well at least the syncros are worn out) manual transmission, I understand that the software guys out there (I’m one of them) can make an automatic (well, DSG) that does everything better than me, including launch control.
A similar QOTD might be “At what age does the car enthusiast realize that it’s a lot more fun to drive a slow car fast than a fast car slow”?
Clearly certain cars appeal to different age groups, but rules are made to have exceptions, you can find young people with late 60’s muscle cars and you can find old people driving hopped up civics.
However, I contend that age has nothing to do with who likes the GT-R. (For the record, I’m 28 and sort of indifferent towards it). It’s such a niche product anyway, that trying to find a common demographic amongst GT-R lovers will basically boil down to “they’re all male.”
Here’s the thing — I write software, and I’m constantly tickled in my life by the cool things you can do in software. Drive by wire makes my imagination go wild, because I start thinking about all the things you can program the car to do better than the driver. I love fuel injection, electronic boost control, all sorts of fancy engine management options. Infinitely variable valve timing, ABS and ESC, pnuematic valves. All of these technologies are great, because of the power they give the software developers to really kick ass. And I firmly believe that from a raw performance standpoint, cars the like GT-R prove this point. Give over control to the electronic wizards, and you’ll see amazing things happen, the same way aircraft changed once electronics and computers started kicking ass.
From the perspective of a software engineer, I love the GT-R. I imagine that if I was intent on driving around tracks as fast as possible, without regard to how fun it was, I would also love the GT-R from that perspective.
But in the real world of car ownership, I don’t much care about being the fastest at anything. I don’t want to pay a lot of money for stuff that can and will break, and I want the car to do what I tell it to, regardless of what I’m telling it is the best way to do things. Drive by wire, electric steering, and complicated computer controlled AWD systems all get in the way of that. I don’t think these feelings are tied to age. That’s all.
Has it got wheels? I like it. Sometimes more, sometimes less.
I’ve felt that way since about age 4.
Oh yes, there’s a generational gap when it comes to cars. That notwithstanding, as a 26 year old who has grown up playing anything from Pole Position to Gran Turismo 5 Prologue, I felt that Sir Stephan was spot on. I play video games to vicariously drive cars, not the other way around.
Absolutely.
Know what a Buick customer calls a 60 year old sales person?
“Sonny-Boy.”
I look at the GT-R as a true engineering marvel…It has everything that EVERYONE could ever want in a car…and I think therein lies the problem with the GT-R. Nissan has developed one heck of car, but at the end of the day, its just a car. It won’t inspire any nostalgia, it won’t become an icon of an era…nothing. Just another fast car. It doesn’t do anything to stir the emotions. Saturday afternoon drives will be about as exciting as the video game from your couch. Now, I’ve never driven one, being a 21-yr-old engineering student, but from what I’ve read and heard, even with the gobs of power, precision steering, and road holding like no other…it’ll put you asleep behind the wheel. Wasn’t the return of ‘Godzilla’ suppose to get all the supercar owners shaking in there boots? I can’t see Nissan reaching out and stealing customers away from the likes of Ferrari, Aston, Corvette, Porsche, or even BMW. These cars are coveted not only for their high performance abilities, but also because they are drivers’ cars! The driver is part of the experience. The Nissan may be able to beat most cars to 60, or even 100…but thats about it. Real drivers won’t want it. I think Nissan tried to appeal to too many people with the return of their flagship beast. Instead, they have built themselves a superhighperformance luxury car you’ll see at the local grocery store.
Do certain cars only work for certain age groups?
Only in a broad sense. While Buick dealers are apparently prohibited by Fedral Law from selling to anyone under 40 and the Scion brand is marketed to the Abercrombie generation, there are exceptions to every rule. We saw older generations take to the Xb and there are a lot of younger folks who recognize that Ford Panthers are cool (albeit only if it is an ex-cop car.)
The list could go on and on, but I don’t think that there is really one car out there that is set exclusively toward one generation.
There is some older guy rockin’ a mid-nineties civic in Uxbridge, MA. Whatever floats your boat i guess.
Absolutely.
And, although the GT-R is fast and tossable, it firmly stabs its flagpole in ground that will appeal to someone much younger than me. It does this successfully, and I believe, intentionally.
Some of the “mistakes” made by other manufacturers intended to appeal to 20-somethings include the original xB and the Element. These cars were snapped up by just as many 40- and 50-somethings (split between those who wanted function and those who wanted to look “cool”). I believe the buyer age groups surprised Toyota and Honda, and if it wasn’t for the cash, they might have been displeased by the skewed demographics. If they aren’t successfully selling the cars primarily to their target, but are still selling, would thay call that “success” or a “mistake?”
Could Buick really sell the Invicta ot Riviera concepts to even 30-somethings? Is much of the resistance to BMW’s iDrive simply because Us Old Folk don’t want to fuss with technology as much as Whippersnappers easily can?
Subaru (WRX), Mistu (EVO) and now Nissan, can successfully sell performance cars to a younger age group, and they “get it.”
Crap. I’m old.
Let’s use Scion as an example–how often does one see an oldster behind the wheel of a supposedly youth-oriented Scion? Toyota aimed for the youth demographic and whiffed, but hit dead on the no-frills, cheap, reliable transportation market. Figure out how that happened, and you have the answer to the QOD.
Discussions of technology are a distraction – what matters is if the car does what it’s supposed to do. If a company can build a car without electronics that gets around the ‘ring in 7:29 and still be docile enough in traffic to be a daily driver then I applaud their effort. If they use electronics to achieve the same thing then I still applaud their efforts.
I don’t think that Wilkinson stating that the driving experience is somwhat remote is controversial, nor should that be blamed on the electronics. But when he complains that he didn’t get enough bystander attention or that he thought that that the GT-R is a “nerdy, twin-turbo, electronics-laden technological curiosity” then that just isn’t a valid criticism of the car but at best a sign of a generation gap and at worst car snobbery of the worst kind – particularly since the Porsche turbo is also not only turbo charged but also laden with electronics.
I teach computer networking by day, so I think I qualify for the “geeky” sector, but when comes to cars, I believe in “less is more”. I don’t want computers isolating me from driving, i*anything, and no programmable on-screen menus, thanks.
Yes there sure is! With age, usually comes financial stability, which allows one more flexibility in what they drive.
I started with used sports cars when I had nothing else to put money into for gas and repairs. Then when married with first house, needed safe, reliable, low maintenance, great mpg cars. Then now, I can afford vehicles I want within reason, and even an extra weekend toy! My next step will be to upgrade further, gas prices be damned!
I don’t think Stephans criticism of the car is a reslult of his age. The GT-R simply DOES NOT have the sex appeal of a Ferrari or Lambo, or DB9, or… whatever. While not ugly, it has a certain lack of desirability. To those with no taste of course, that’s not an issue. :)
As for the rough ride due to the rubber band tires, well, that was nitpicking. What race car DOESN’T ride rough on rubber band tires? Is there one?
i* and programmable dash menus aren’t inherently bad, as some have implied. They just suck because their interfaces aren’t good enough and so we don’t like them. What if (and I hate this example because I’m not an apple fanboy and don’t own any of their products, but…) Apple made a new in car OS. It would go down like the iPod vs. old mp3 players, iPhone vs. average cellphones, mac osX vs. windows – suddenly the Apple iDrive system would be easy to use, heralded by reviewers, and scooped up by consumers everywhere.
Basically, you can fault these cars for the quality of their electronics. But I believe complaining about electronics in cars in general is snobbishness or just fear of change.
My job is to design user interfaces for software, web sites, and gadgets – but to me simpler is always better. I don’t mind electronic wizardry in a car (or anywhere else) as long as it stays out of the way and doesn’t compete for my attention.
Here’s how I wish the future will look:
We’ll have computer-driven cars for commuting, because, let’s face it, commuting is rarely fun, and I trust computers more than people to take rational, objective decisions, instead of thinking with their reptilian brains and make matters worse (lane hoppers, anyone?). By then, we’ll also all or almost all be wealthy enough (given current trends) to afford a week-end toy, that could be a no-frills car with no or little electronics, for tossing it around on back roads or tracks.
So many people say they’d never drive a computer-controlled car, yet it’s what they’re doing on a daily basis, and pay so little attention to driving that a computer is just the next logical step.
I am a male who is the same age as Stephan’s daughter. I notice a big difference in likes/dislikes in automobiles between my uncle and I (he is barely 15 years older). He is enamored by Dodge Viper’s and the new Challenger. I on the other hand, laugh at a 6.1 liter V8 “Hemi” (who cares) that puts out 425 hp. 69-70 hp per liter out of a performance car? Excuse me for not being impressed, AT ALL. My Uncle makes fun of me because I lust over the Honda S2000 and the Subaru WRX STI. Yes, I know the Subie hisses with 300 turbo charged hp but it is still only a 2.5 liter four cylinder. Honda’s S2000 is a 2.2 liter four cylinder with 237 hp. I guess it boils down to perspective. To each his/her own.
I’m in the ‘of an age’ catagory and grew up with manual everything with double-clutching required. That being said I played GT 2&3 and love idrive. I am also of an age where I can afford most cars within reason. The GT-R simply doesn’t appeal to me as a driver. Perhaps too impersonal. One issue that hasn’t been discussed and will bring out the snob comments is: I want the very best in customer service when I spend 70k or so on a vehicle. I do not want to be in line with the Maxima or Sentra customer for shop time. Read into this what you wish, but you buy more than the car. You buy the experience. I see a generation gap of ‘generalizations’ for sure, but to the hard-core automobile enthusiast age is just a number.
lprocter1982 :
May 8th, 2008 at 12:46 pm
Yes. You will never see a senior behind the wheel of a uglified (ie winged, with a coffe can exhaust and fifteen tons of stickers) Honda Civic or Dodge Neon.
Also, Buicks kinda have their own demographic.
Strangely enough, I saw an obviously senior male driving an EVO earlier this week. No stickers plasterd across the sides and windows, though.
I think some cars appeal more to some demographics (duh!), but I don’t think that there is necessarily an automotive generation gap. I’m in my 30’s but I still talk with other guys (and gals) in there late teens through 60’s about cars. If I see a car that I’m really interested in and the driver is there, I’ll go up and ask him about it. I have had young and old people ask me about my various cars through the years. I used to use my ’58 Chevy as a daily driver and I got more thumbs up and hollers from teens than from “old farts.” A love of cars spans the genrations, and each generation has a mixture of people that have different tastes in automotive machinery as well as a majority that don’t really understand cars.
By the way, I also enjoyed playing Need 4 Speed Underground 1 and 2, including modifying the apearance of my car in the game. There’s a kid down the block with an S2000 with plenty of artistic changes to the sheet metal that look absolutely gorgeous in my opinion as well as that of my 30 something wife. He did it right. It’s when they do it wrong that I have to laugh, and that has nothing to do with my age.
as a senior member of the Baby Boom generation and a “car nut” I can testify that age makes very little difference if any at all in ones choice of a car.
the factors that determine one’s like or dislike of any specific car has much more to do with personality, income and family status.
How did I know Scion would come up in this?
I am an officically-documented Scion Nerd (2005 Gen 1 xB!), and I’ve looked at every driver in an xA and first-gen xB (you know…the real one) for the last four years.
The xA is kind of a wild card, but the xB appealed to only two markets: kids young enough to be hip, and people too old to give a damn. IT wasn’t just “older people,” it’s like 65 and up. I could count the number of people in the 30-55 age range (that’s you, Boomers!) on one hand.
On the other hand, the NEW xB has been accepted by no one more than the Me Generation (that’s you again, Boomers! I know how much you like to talk about yourselves!). I’ve seen exactly one person UNDER the age of 40, and believe me, I’ve been looking. Predictably, this has been the Death of Cool for the Scion xB, as the only people I know who like it are…let’s face it, old.
After the utter failure of the redesign, I think the tC is the only reason Scion’s retained its hold on the highly-sought-after “youngest demographic” market.
And I found the GT-R totally uninteresting also.
Jonny, seriously? In marketing land, age is a supremo demo designator. Other than income, there is absolutely no better way to slice, dice and define demo/psychographics.
When it comes to concepting, designing, and marketing a vehicle, the age of the consumer for which it is being created for is (or at least should be) in the forefront in the mind of every person involved.
So yeah. Buicks = Last Time Buyers.
Scion = First Time New Buyers.
And an age difference of about 60 years. Seriously. Really.
The number of automotive examples (and tedious power point presentations attempting to explain them) is endless.
I could bore you to tears with them, but I won’t.
Suffice it to say, it’s more fun to experience the generation gap, and each generations’ taste, firsthand.
My daughter (21) and her friends (guys and girls) love to talk up cars with me, as I’m known as an old guy who still gets passionate about 4-wheeled transpo (a rarity, they presume).
A Corvette to them is a relic. Any vintage. Just doesn’t register, really. Sure, a few of the guys will maybe look up from their laptop at Starbucks if a Z06 passes…then, whatever. Corvettes are mostly for old guys with hair-holes and beer bellies.
But if a 10-year old Acura Integra riding on 22s with a coffeecan muffler and a faux carbon hood pulls up, they’re all over it.
Were the guys to pick between the GT-R and a Porsche 911 Turbo, the UberBeetle would get nod of respect, but the line would form behind the Nissan. It’s new. It’s hip. It’s THE car on Grand Theft Auto for cryin’ out loud.
American anything, unless it’s a lifted 4×4 truck, a Viper, 4-door Wrangler with the top down, or a Shelby GT500, doesn’t do a thing for any of ’em. Guys or girls.
My daughter’s 3-year old Ford Focus is nothing more than a necessary evil — cheap on gas and insurance. “Why can’t we trade it in on a Honda…c’mon! A Civic or Accord coupe. Or even a used Scion! Ford sucks. I look like a tool in this.”
“What about a Cobalt.”
“You can’t be serious. Nobody would even ride with me.”
“Good.”
“I can’t wait till I’m done with college and can get whatever I want…like a Nissan Z.”
“Neither can I. Neither can I.”
i vote yes: there’s a ‘generational gap’ but there’s also lots of other ‘gaps’ and demographics that have nothing to do with age…
though, as others have put it, age and income are two of the largest…
also, with the sub 25 crowd (not necessarily car enthusiast), lots want basic, safe, reliable transportation (with GREAT gas mileage) – no desire for the frivolousness of any sort of ‘bling’, big wheels, 6 cylinders, etc… – 30 mpg is NOT impressive – show me 40-50+… without a hybrid system…
Absolutely – the age of a person makes a difference in what cars they are attracted to and purchase.
That said, I think that the new Nissan isn’t suffering from “ageism” or any such thing. They had an opportunity to make something that was art instead of just a car. It’s what distinguishes the original Olds Tornado from the later (boring) versions.
The GT-R is a really fast car. There’s lots of those. There aren’t a lot of cars that ooze sex appeal or take automotive design to a higher level. Sad, really.
@Domestic Hearse:
Were the guys to pick between the GT-R and a Porsche 911 Turbo, the UberBeetle would get nod of respect, but the line would form behind the Nissan. It’s new. It’s hip. It’s THE car on Grand Theft Auto for cryin’ out loud.
Not Gran Theft Auto, Gran Turismo
;-)
But congrats on the dialogue, that was hysterical.
An interesting trans-generational point is that the majority of people, either older or younger, have NO clue about cars, at all.
No idea that Infiniti is a division of Nissan.
What FWD/RWD even is.
What ABS does (“well, it helps to brake, duh!” “How?” “IT HELPS!!”)
That 4WD helps only when accelerating
That a 160hp engine is more than enough to propel a 1.5 ton vehicle above legal speeds
And so on.
Most people, regardless of age, fall for coolness and marketing.
The difference is that the “cliched” older people lust after vinyl roofs and corvettes, while the “cliched” young crows lusts after big rims and GT-Rs.
0.3 seconds slower than a Veyron to 60.
Costs … $1,500,000/$73,000 = 20.54
Here’s something any generation can understand. I’ll take 20 GT-Rs over 1 Veyron any day.
AKM:
well put!!!
I think there is as much disparity within similar age demographics as there is between differing demographics. In the car business, there used to be a saying: there’s an ass for every seat!
I also agree that a lot of people really don’t have a lot of knowledge relating to vehicles, and base there ‘likes and dislikes’ on a certain look or even a whim. Obviously though, certain cars, like Buick, who may have special appeal to the ‘geriatric’ segment, may be an exception to the above.
Dave
I think that gadget taste is more about a person’s personality and past experience than a factor of age alone.
I’m 75. I designed computer equipment at IBM starting in the 1950s. I built my own PC in the 70s and I had an IBM PC on my desk before the PC was ever announced to the public. I was also once a fighter pilot, so I enjoy cars that perform well. I bet I would like the glass cockpit in the current planes.
I love my GPS and all of the information I can pull up on the display in the instrument cluster. How much diesel did it take to tow the Airstream up that mountain, and is it better in the current terrain to turn on tow-haul or take advantage of 6th gear? What lane should I be in because a turn is coming up? How many minutes to the next rest stop or fuel?
These things aren’t distracting like a cell phone. They take only an instant to display. I think they keep me alert and in tune with my truck.
By the way, I own a 2006 Azera Limited and a 2007 Silverado Duramax/Allison LTZ.
Consider the import scene(Civic + muffler); younger crowd.
Pahaska,
Wandering off topic, I know, but what did you fly?
Let me start by saying that I’m 46, I have a 10 year old son and we have spent many nights on the PS2 playing GT4, TIR, Need for Speed, etc. That said, I think there is a definite generation gap when it comes to cars. For example, I totally do not “get” the rod culture of my father’s generation in the 50’s and I’m getting more and more out of tune with the muscle cars of the ’60’s (before my time diving-wise). Give me electronic ignition, disc brakes, ECU’s, a decent suspension, a screaming engine and big, fat radial tires and I’m good. I worked my way through college as a mechanic and I got my driver’s license in the Era of Crap Cars (1978).
That’s not to say I don’t appreciate a well maintained and well turned out older classic. I just have no desire to devote hours of my life to restoring/maintaining/fixing one of them. Well, maybe a Series I E-type. My son is into the RSX’s, Civic Si’s, Supras, S2000’s, etc. And there are some very good reasons for that. First, even without $4.00/gallon gas, most of the big thumping V-8 cars that many of us grew up around are simply out of reach financially for a 16 year old today (and of course the car of my 10yr old’s dreams is a 911 GT3). Secondly, there is a lack of CONTEXT to most young kids when it comes to those cars. Look around the classic car auctions and tell me what the median age is. I would bet real money that it is at least 5 years older than I am. That’s because those are the cars those guys grew up with, the cars they fantasized about when they were 16, or 24 with a wife and kid and not a lot of extra cash. Now they are at a point in their lives where they can make up for lost time. How many 24 year olds get jacked up about a ’67 427 ‘Vette? How many 24 year olds want to/ have the wherewithal to pay six figures for a ’68 Camaro? Not many, especially after they dust one off with their slammed Supra out at the track. I see it almost every Friday night out at the local drag strip and on the streets.
At some point in time the cars we get off on are going to be considered “old-guy” stuff. Just like a ’50 Merc with a flathead Ford is to me. Hey, if they look nice and if you enjoy it, great! It just does nothing for me. No offense intended!
Yes. Scions are for kids. Wait, no, that’s lesbians in their 50’s. Make that kids AND lesbians in their 50’s.
JuniorMint on the original xB: IT wasn’t just “older people,” it’s like 65 and up. I could count the number of people in the 30-55 age range (that’s you, Boomers!) on one hand.
Me and my boomer friends love the original xB. Go read Paul Niedermeyer’s paean to the xB, which is somewhere on this site.
I don’t do FWD or big stupid wings or obnoxious thumping stereos or flatulent exhausts or what I perceive as excessive electronics, by which I mean anything more than a CD player and cruise control (and I’m still not sold on digital dashboards.) But then, I grew up in the country, have never owned a video game console, and my grandfather was one of the founders of what is today the National Corvette Restorers Society. So even though I turned 28 today, I may not be the most typical example of my generation.
A car is many things to me – transportation, a work of art, an office, freedom, personal history, a rolling window to the world. It may be an entertainment system, but if it is, it’s a mechanical one, not an electronic one. It is not a four-wheeled computer. It’s a car.
Can’t afford a Corvette, Grandpa, but that Miata down the street is looking better all the time.
I don’t know how the whole age/car preference thing works.
I _hate_ imported sticker-over-run/22″ bling rims/coffee can exhaust/aftermarket crazy wings or anything goofy like that….yet I own an STI. The reason I bought it was because it is 1) fast and 2) functional.
It’s bone stock & it will stay that way most likely until I get rid of it (might be a while as I’m averaging a tad over 8k miles per year….).
In the same vein, I love my suzuki gsx-r600 sportbike. I also love my wifes dodge neon.
Summer Speed = bike
Winter speed = STi
everyday long/distance car “2-up”: Neon.
In general I love to see stuff work it’s way down from the top (F1, not nascar). Unfortunately I think alot of people don’t appreciate that as alot of people don’t read about inventions in F1….
I also love to use something for it’s intended purpose….I find pleasure in having the “right tool for the job”
Your footwear will more than likely have a greater impact on your life, than the type of car you drive.
Which brings us to the question… what brand has attracted the most owners who care deeply about their footwear?
The final exam begins…. now.
Answer in 24 hours…
I noticed my footwear was very important and use comfortable shoes now. The Hell with Nike.
I’m leaning towards easy to live with cars. Nice interior materials, comfy and enjoyable to play with. I love the older E34 BMW. I wish it had a nicer interior though and looked a little more like extravagant and flamboyant. Drives great though.
All cars have interesting sides to them, but without a practical inclination its literally a pain in the butt to pursue owing them to much for me. So Muscle cars, Rice Rockets, Exotics and Numb Luxury are dumb relative to my inclinations. A generation gap looks like an education gap, some folks just get some things more than others I guess.
its not about the gtr.
Yes. Young people (mass market as a group) have no history of cars. They have history of pickup trucks and SUVs, with cars a strange third thing, lingering from their parents’ past. They have no idea of a vehicle designed to be driven on roads. Certainly no idea of minimalist, fun to drive sports car.
So combine electronic bling with bus-like vehicle dynamics expectations for average young, and you see where we are.
This will change, fast now. 6,000 lb, 12 mpg personal vehicles will reduce to a lunatic fringe from the gum chewing public at large. New young will grow up without riding in tahoes, and will experience 2,400-3,200 lb mass market cars instead. Some of which will be nice, all competent.
Bling will not go away, it will keep increasing.
# Theodore :
Wandering off topic, I know, but what did you fly?
I was a T-33 and F-86D instructor back in the Korea era and during the Berlin crisis. Later, I flew C-119 and C-123 in the Reserves.
The F-86D was the first single-pilot interceptor with radar, electronic fuel control, etc. An intercept mission at near Mach 1 could burn the fuel load in 30 minutes. That taught me to be constantly aware of what the instruments were telling me. That habit has stayed with me ever since.
Pahaska,
And there were a lot of instruments and switches in that cockpit! No wonder you like your gadgets.
I’m 27 – and I absolutely hate modern cars. My favorite cars of all time include my 1991 Miata, my 1993 RX-7 turbo, my 1988 Porsche 944 turbo, and the Porsche 964 (the unloved stepchild of the Carreras).
Why?
Modern setups in terms of independent suspensions and good power output, but with no traction control, computers, other handling nannies and hell, NO CUP HOLDERS!
Yeah there is a generation gap. A friend told me the most interesting thing about his old car (Corvair convertible) to his grandkids were the manual crank windows. They kept rolling them up and down, up and down.
I think we as a society have had some many creature comforts for so long than the youth think they would die without power accesories and all the technology in their lives.
Meanwhile at 38 I’m rolling backwards thinking all I need is a decent 60s vintage car with A/C and manual everything else. FWIW I work with technology everyday at work and most days a little at home.
Getting tired of the technology bloat in my daily life. Not that I am losing my facination with it or that I’m unhappy with my career – just that the more “modern” appliances become, the less technology I want involved in keeping them useful or keeping them in working condition.