Press releases aren't supposed to be funny, but occasionally, one comes out that you can't help but laugh at, either for the product it's promoting, the way it attempts to make it sound unique, or both. Case in point: Toyota's release describing the "Design Ins and Outs of the 2009 Toyota Venza." Having seen pictures of this bastard child of a Camry and an Aztek, I think it would be better described as the "Design Do's and Don'ts," with emphasis on the don'ts. They struggle to find a way to describe it, settling on "not an SUV, not a wagon, not a coupe and not a sedan." So what the Hell is it? They say it "incorporates SUV utility and roominess, while maintaining passenger car essentials, such as ease of ingress/egress, performance, a lower, sleek
side profile with aerodynamic lines." Uh… doesn't that pretty much describe a station wagon? Anyway, the design incorporates "Toyota's design philosophy, ‘Vibrant Clarity'" (which sounds like a Honda FCX with a tire out of balance) to produce "look-at-me" styling. Inside, it has a "floating…60/60 center dashboard" that makes spatially-challenged drivers and passengers "feel as if 60 percent of the space is in their personal zone." There's more, but I'll let you read it for yourself.
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Looks like a Camry Wagon to me. I would like to see manufacturers would simply call a spade a spade and refer to many of their cross-overs as wagons. The SUV styling is confusing and these cars have none of the performance qualities of an SUV. Crossovers would be called wagons and styled like wagons if Americans didn’t have such an irrational fear of the word “wagon.”
If “shooting brake” is good enough for Audi and most of the British Harris Tweed and plus fours set, why is “station wagon” such an abhorrent description in America?
Wagons are grandpa’s cars!
Duh.
Personally I’d like to see GM revive the Woody. I’d buy it out of sheer contrariness.
Make a hybrid, sell it for under $30k and make Ford cry on top of their lot of Flexs.
Sure it looks like “Design by Blender” – but its a Toyota – who will care.
“‘Vibrant Clarity\'” (which sounds like a Honda FCX with a tire out of balance)”
Awesome line!
Seriously…another crossover from Toyota of all companies? If people need to upgrade from a RAV4 they can get a Highlander or from there to a Sequoia. The space between the RAV4 and Highlander is so razor thin, that the money spent to bring this wagon to market should’ve been spent on bringing the company back to the affordable sports car territory that Toyota was so dominant in during the ’90s.
Call me crazy (…waiting…) but I think in order for a car to be called a station wagon it should be nothing more than a wagon version of an existing car such as a Country Squire was a wagon version of a full size Ford, such as a Galaxy.
Oh, and question: are they gonna give one of these to the best goalie in the NHL next year?
We used to have a word for these things…
hatchback
I particularly like the (ahem) “wood” on the centre console – they probably found it floating in a Martian river.
Kudos also to the designer for inventing the 120% dashboard.
I actually find this car, looking at that picture, rather nice. Much better than many other Toyotas.
They should have named this the Highlander Sport, like the Range Rover and Range Rover Sport. It’d be like an even more urban friendly CUV or something that’s sleeker and whatnot. Then you could combine the sales numbers of these two models as one, like the Corolla and Matrix, Camry and the Solara. Too many CUV models!!
I don’t call it a wagon unless the 3rd rear window is as long as the other rear windows.
Don’t know why the so called Marketing Experts are so afraid to sell “wagons”. Code words for “wagon”: Sports, Touring, Estate, Crossover….some have 4wd some don’t, they are still WAGONS people!!
well it sure beats the hell out of the last camry wagon. remember when car and driver called it a hearse? and hey, this thing looks like a very comfortable, safe and utilitarian vehicle that is nothing near as ugly as an Aztek. this is a tough crowd!
I actually don’t mind its looks, but I am bugged by the way they market it. It’s really an updated, Toyota-badged version of the RX350, but instead of acknowledging that it’s basically the identical formula that the Ford Edge, Nissan Murano et al have taken, Toyota is trying to claim as if they invented a new segment with the Venza that has existed for years.
When I asked them about whether the Venza would cannibalize RX sales, I was told that Toyota and Lexus shoppers are completely different, but if it gives you literally everything the RX gives you, plus a newer style you won’t see at every mall (at least not yet), wouldn’t there be some cross-shopping?
@Ralph SS: Good one!
If nothing else, the asymmetrical center stack is unique.
As for wagons being grandpa cars: I would take an A4 Avant in a heartbeat. Wagon or not, that car is hot.
Another manufacturer searching for that “Perfect Form Factor”; not an SUV, not a “Wagon”.
Maybe it’s about the “tween” seat height — if you lose that “commanding” position, you feel more vulnerable, as the roads are still a sea of tractor-trailers and huge SUV’s — “early adopters” of the new “low riders” need to pave the way.
There’s a sales graveyard full of Pacificas, Magnums, soon to be filled with Taurus X and Flex bones; will the Journey and Venza join them?
This thing will sell very well in Suburbia
It’s not as ugly as the rest of the Toyota line up, which isn’t saying much, but still it doesn’t make me want to puke when I look at it. It looks pretty practical if stilla little to high off the ground. I’m just scratching my head about the interior I don’t know what to say about it yet, probably so see it in person before I lay judgement.
I wish more true wagons were offered, competitors to the V70 and Outback, the Audi Avant is slick but too pricey. I would be happy with just a handful more of the wagons they offer ine Europe over hear, they would sell like hotcakes in the current climate.
I had a 1996 Camry Wagon. I don’t care what anyone wants to call them it was loved by my car pool buddies and it was appreciated by the dancers when I showed up with the amp, speakers, dolly, and stands.
I could also (steal) clean out grocery carts left in the neighborhood and drop them off at a local food bank where the carts were appreciated.
My Prius has wonderful gas mileage but it can only carry 4 people comfortably – not 5, I already had to downsize the dolly and may downsize the amp and speakers to fit a 4th person in and I can’t carry grocery carts anymore.
Damn I wish Toyota had built a REAL Camry wagon hybrid.
The word “crossover” makes me think the manufacturers want to charge more and raise the floor level to make lifting things in more difficult.
It’s a Camry wagon but has added as a bonus high ground clearance, good towing capacity and AWD.
Pretty nice package, if it gets good fuel economy.
So, where’s the hybrid version?
It’s a Camry wagon but has added as a bonus high ground clearance, good towing capacity and AWD.
All of these “bonuses” are drawbacks to me and Toyota probably expects me to pay extra for all this added junk.
I don’t care what anybody thinks. I just expect that Toyota will sell SCADS of the thing — a very-nearly PERFECT vehicle for the hordes who will be bailing out of SUV’s over the coming years. Another Toyota home run, while the Detroit companies continue swirling down the toilet bowl….
I don’t understand the point of this car and the upsized RAV4 and the Highlander and the Sienna. Something’s gotta give, and my money is on the Highlander.
The SUV/Crossover market has proven a sticky trap for manufacturers: it’s a great way to get people to pay for more car than they need (jack a wagon six inches up and sell it at 20% premium) but it’s also the first to crumble when the economy goes south and people start reexamining their needs vs wants list.
Marketing departments have also painted themselves into a corner: they’ve spent the last ten years selling SUVs, while making wagons into veritable paraiahs. Now, they’ve got to essentially reverse a decade’s worth of psycological programming and, suprise, that’s not easy to do. There’s a lot of intertia, both internally and amongst customers. Oh, and when the product you need to shill is making fifteen percent less margin, you can count on it not getting much support internally.
If–big if–this car gets good mileage it could be a winner. It has a certain look to it, though, a look that says “I weigh nearly four thousand pounds”.
It’s like a sequel to the Ford Edge: nice design, capable vehicle, terrible timing. If I were either company, I would be working feverishly on a Camry/Fusion wagon.
It’s bigger than a camry. Almost as big as an Avalon. Whatever platform it’s built on, I would call it an Avalon wagon.
OMFG! Toyota is suffering from Ford syndrome. Except with ugly complications, like in that picture at the top of the screen. For those who read the C&D review of the Flex:
Customer – “So what’s that thing over there? A compact SUV?
Salesman – “No, that’s our RAV4. It’s a 5-7 passenger midsize crossover with an optional 3.5L V6.
Customer – “So what’s that? A midsize SUV?”
Salesman – “No, that’s the Highlander. It’s a 5-7 passenger midsize crossover with an optional 3.5L V6.
Customer – “What about that? It’s a wagon right!?”
Salesman – “Nope, that’s the Venza. It’s a 5 passenger midsize crossover with an optional 3.5L V6.
BINGO! Product differentiation! LOL
@Rix – It’s a Camry wagon. Identical wheelbase.
Whoa…a nice looking vehicle indeed. the interior is…uh…a little challenged, but the wood helps make up for it. I would even consider this against an RX350-which we currently have a 2009 and I am sorely disappointed in the poor build quality of this Lexus. I like Lexus, we are on our 2nd one, but the 2001 RX we had was hands above this 2009 in terms of build quality and skimped quality parts.
Silly name…Venza, but overall nice package. Sadly for us car guys/gals it appears the day of quality vehicles is over, in general as no real profit can be made in the manufacturing sector-at least in the first tier former Christian nations/Japan.
Interesting that they used every phrase to describe the vehicle in their press release except CROSSOVER, a word which appears to now be the kiss of death to sales….
Why don’t they just call it a Toyota Camry Outback?
AWD? Check.
Wagon? Check.
Based on a preexisting car? Check.
Increased ground clearance? Check.
Oh, yeah. Subaru’s been doing this for years.
If car manufacturers don’t like the term “station wagon”, maybe they should borrow the term the brits use: estate.
I’ve always liked the term “estate” better than “wagon” – I’m certain marketing types will like it better as well.
-ted
Looks a bit like a stretch version of my Matrix.
That cockpit area looks funky, like the passenger has more room than the driver. Just the camera angle???
“Crossover” sounds pretentious; it’s a no-meaning marketing word that was devised when “SUV” started to lose karma. The problem is that “crossover” never had any karma to start with.
As a former English major, it very much offends me, much like “paradigm” or “synergy” do. I dislike words whose meaning depends too heavily on the context and background of those using it. It’s a linguistic circle-jerk, and it’s far too common in marketing.
In the case of “crossover”, no one outside of automobilia uses it: most customers still use “SUV” and will look at you funny if you say “crossover” at them because the word means nothing to them. I’m hoping that the self-congratulatory types in these companies’ marketing departments get a rude awakening when cars like this fail to sell.
Is this perhaps a preview of the 3rd gen 2010 Lexus RX?
Toyota has been on a roll over the past two decades creating unique products that manage to break the mold and open up new market segments that many other makers have benefitted from. Granted all of these vehicles have been people/ cargo movers but the RAV4, Matrix/Vibe, RX300, 2nd Gen Prius, have all come to market with attributes that the competiton all lacked.
The RAV4 was the original “cute ute”, it was light-weight, unibody, handled very well and was durable as hell. The Rx300 was the orginal mid-sized cross-over based on a pasasnger car (much safer)platform. The Matrix brought upright seating and expanded interior room to the (almost non-existent)compact hatchback segment.
Toyota’s success comes from removing a great deal of unnecessary BS and selling the costumer exactly what they need without loading up a vehicle with a bunch of WORTHLESS potential. The Venza will work because it is the “not quite” but “just right” vehicle that stradles multiple segments. It is not quite a mini-van or SUV but manages to have more useful interior dimensions than a traditional wagon. It is more than a Camry but less than a Highlander, while not being as jacked up and truckish as a RAV4. It can be equiped with a efficent 4 cyl engine or a rather powerful 3.5l v6. If you order it with FWD you do not look foolish with a jacked-up but cant do jack SUV.
I am also sure that the Toyota dealers are happy to have this vehicle in their lineup, it simply provides more sales leverage for them. Unless you are looking for a sports car Toyota has all bases covered in one showroom.
Marketing people should be forbidden from using any words that have not been in the lexicon for at least 20 years.
I love wagons. Especially sport wagons. Sadly, the last decent affordable sport wagons (Mazda6, Legacy GT) were much unloved by people who actually paid for cars.
This car (?) has been growing on me since I first saw the mock-up 5 months ago. If they keep the weight down and make a 4 cyl or hybrid available for a reasonable price, it’ll be a hit.
Hmmm
Have people figured out.. what this vehicle is made from??
CAMRY!
CAMRY gave birth to:
The Highlander
The Avalon
The ES
The RX
And now the Venza.
That is.. 6 vehicles all of them are built with a car frame! Doesnt matter worth a damn, what the company’s PR line is. It is, what it is. A glorified WAGON!
Now me…
This is a poor time to have this vehicle on the showroom. They are getting to be like the domestics in this reguard… OVERLAPPING VEHICLES!
Ya got the RAV 4 who should have stayed compact.
Ya got the Highlander that gained a few inches and now is as big as the 4Runner.
Ya got the FJ, that is the Bronco reborn for Toyota. On the frame of the 4Runner.
Ya got the 4Runner that is competition against the Exploder.. and is within inches of the Sequia.
YA got the Seqouia that is as big as any dumb bastard ever thinks they need
Few people can see the difference in construction as I point out so easily.. between the vehicles..
And to have this Venza slip in between… what and where?? To steal sales from the other for..?
Bad move..
Bad Move.
They got gaping holes, and faaar too much on one side.
What ever happened to tacking on a nice rear hatch, keeping the weight down to 2800-3300lbs.. and dumpin the awd unit.
Poor choice Toyota.. Poor choice!