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I don’t have anything else to say. Lieberman thinks the Hyundai Sonata (decent car, really) handles better than the MINI Cooper and MINI Cooper S. I think Lieberman has been hitting the wine early in anticipation of the Jewish holidays. There are, however, some cars with great enthusiast reputations that some of us are just not on board with. Lieberman doesn’t like the MINI. I don’t get the fuss over the 1-Series, Nissan 350Z, or even the Nissan GT-R. P.J. McCombs just doesn’t love the Lexus IS-F. Jay Shoemaker doesn’t dig the Maserati GT. And so on. It just goes to show, there’s nothing truly objective about cars. Even the truth. Especially the truth.
21 Comments on “Daily Podcast: Lieberman: “The Hyundai Sonata handles better than the MINI Cooper”...”
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Depends on what he means by handling, I suppose.
OMG…the Sonata handles better than the Mini? Now I’ve heard it all. I’ve actually driven a good deal in Sonatas (royalty of the rental fleet) and I’ve really never heard anything quite as absurd. Sure, I’m biased in that we own a Mini. However, I drive our WRX all the time and I have to admit that the Mini handles better than that car. On the same road the Mini’s manners give it an edge over the WRX’s power. The Mini is a bit tiring as a daily driver, but it is tops in the fun to drive category. I think Jonny needs to be punished by having to drive a Sonata for the next year.
Well, the 2009 SE handles better than previous Sonatas…
As for the MINI, I’ve had mixed feelings myself. On the right road, it handles very well. Other times I’ve been underwhelmed, especially if the car had an automatic.
Expectations play a role: I expect less of a sedan like the Sonata.
Should we expect a Sonata review soon? I hope so! DJ went down 700 points I think today. Not so many people are really feeling German imports right now. :)
LOL. Yes, I need a Sonata to drive me to the poor house now.
Actually, Hyundai just refreshed the Sonata for 2009. I’ll review it soon.
Results from the G stock and H stock classes at the SCCA Solo national championships this year, trophy positions:
G Stock
1. 197 Craig Wilcox 2007 Mini Cooper S
2. 32 Anthony Savini 2005 Mini Cooper S
3. 136 Greg Reno 2006 Mini Cooper S
4. 21 Per Schroeder 2007 Mini Cooper S
5. 191 Kevin Royce 2005 Mini Cooper S
6. 148 Jeff Schaadt 2007 MINI COOPER S
7. 30 John Ma 2007 MINI Cooper S
Highest placed non-mini, 15th place, Toyota Celica
H Stock
1. 191 Ron Williams 2005 Mini Cooper
2. 95 Jerry Irvine 2007 Mini Cooper
3. 84 Mark Allen 2005 Mini Cooper
4. 186 Jimmy Crawford 2005 Mini Cooper
5. 195 Shawn Hill 2007 Mini Cooper
6. 184 Jeff Jacobs 2008 MINI Cooper
7. 97 Mark McKnight 2006 Mazda 3
8. 199 Joseph Austin 2007 MINI COOPER
9. 194 Jack Burns 2007 Mazda 3
10. 92 David Patrick 2004 Honda Civic EX
Any more questions on the handling of the Mini?
Handling can be somewhat (obviously) subjective. As has already been mentioned, as a daily driver over the rough and tumble roads we all mostly travel, I’d venture to say the Sonata is a better choice. A Sunday afternoon romp through the backroads and switchbacks, and I’d want the MINI. I guess handling is dependent on intended use…
Justin: I’m not feeling the Maserati GT either.
I look forward to seeing what you think of the Sonata, though.
JL definitely has it out for MINIs. His review of the 2006 Cooper S had one glaring fault that made no sense whatsoever. He claimed that 1st gear was “ludicrously tall.” I couldn’t believe I read that. At the time, I had recently gotten rid of an ’05 MCS and, if anything, first gear was ludicrously short, this after MINI shortened all the gear ratios from ’04. To this day, I can’t figure out how he or anyone else could call 1st gear anything close to “tall.” Either there was an extreme bias going into the drive or very careless writing afterwards. Which is it?
“I don’t get the fuss over the 1-Series, Nissan 350Z, or even the Nissan GT-R.”
Really? I get the other two, but what don’t you like about the 350Z? Just curious…
The only one of those cars that I have driven is the 350Z, and I would hardly call it a world beater. Good acceleration and decent cornering for its class but nothing to write home about. Throw in the poor ergonomics, no back seat, initial reliability problems, and no storage room and I can think of at least three cars right off the top of my head that I would rather have: Mazda RX-8 (cheaper), Mazdaspeed3 (much cheaper), and Mustang GT (much cheaper).
I drove a mini in the 60’s and all I can say is that they handled better than a go cart.
It was my friends car and he was 6’7”. It was kind of funny watching him snake out of the car.
I believe the man was just pulling your leg.
To CGROPPI..
Pales into insignificance when compared to the original Minis racing achievements. For instance here is the result of the 1966 Bathurst 500 production car endurance race: (These are outright results)
Pos Class No Team Drivers Car Laps
1 C 13 BMC Works Team Rauno Aaltonen
Bob Holden Morris Cooper S 130
2 C 17 Fred Gibson
Bill Stanley Morris Cooper S 129
3 C 22 Bruce McPhee
Barry Mulholland Morris Cooper S 129
4 C 27 Arthur Davis
Paul Mander Morris Cooper S 128
5 C 10 Peter Brown
Bob Cook Morris Cooper S 128
6 C 9 Harry Firth
Ern Abbott Morris Cooper S 128
7 C 24 John Leffler
Bill Jamison Morris Cooper S 127
8 C 23 BMC Works Team John French
Steve Harvey Morris Cooper S 127
9 C 16 Barry Arentz
Barry Seton Morris Cooper S 125
10 D 5 Eiffeltower Motors Jack Nougher
David O’Keefe Chrysler Valiant VC V8 124
To Nicodemus,
If this thread had anything to do with the original Morris mini, your comment would be significant. My point is that the modern mini dominates its classes in autocross, to the virtual exclusion of other similar vehicles. That, for me anyway, defines “better handling,” in a sport that values handling over all other attributes.
I’ve heard really good things about the Ford Fusion’s handling, actually. That’s another one to check out.
I haven’t driven a Mini Cooper yet, but I did spend some time behind the wheel of a V6 Sonata (’07?) that made it appear to be fine, for a rental only. Teen-ager-type wheelspin off the line, but the usual FWD plowing in corners. Predictable but far from nimble. Certainly not the grip I get in my S60R in fast bends. OK, half the price, but we’re not Consumer Reports here.
Best anything is subjective. I probably prefer an Integra Type R to any SRT8, Rwd or not. The Mini has its handling weaknesses. Its stability for example is probably not on the same level as the Sonata. A weakness inherent in the size of the Mini. Some folk will not like such things. Its ok.
The Sonata has a lot of torque steer. Like whoa.
Punchy though.
I don’t like the new steering on the mini now. It’s too overboosted, I think.
350Z is not my thing, either… I’d rather have a Z4M
speaking of Nissans, rode in a GT-R recently… I certainly get that car now.
I do agree that handling is subjective, but comparing a Mini, to a Sonata doesnt make sense. i think comparisons, whether subjective or objective should be done on cars of the same segment.
Surely an RX8 handles better than an H1, hell yeah, but where’s the point?
however, on the subjective argument, handling is that, each driver has a preference, and some don’t even have a clue!!!! i prefer a front engine FWD layout because i’m used to it, but i adored the responsiveness and dynamic attitude of the Gallardo SL (Mid engine AWD) etc.etc…
and the Fiat 500 is one of the best handling cars (crap autobox though) i’ve ever driven, surely that is not everyones opinion.
cheers
I own an ’07 Sonata. And if a MINI handles worse than it, BMW better go back to the drawing board and MINI owners need to stop drinking the Kool-Aid.
In all seriousness, it is a decent car and would be better if I could ditch these Michelin OEM tires! A set of Kumho Ecsta ASXs would make me a happy camper.