Thanks to soaring gas prices (remember them?), cliff face depreciation, chronic over-production and a withering economy, the majority of the “my-truck’s-an-extension-of-my-huge-ass-belt-buckle” crowd have flown fly the (turkey) coop. We can safely assume that both remaining pickup truck buyers have bona fide big-truck needs: towing, hauling and posing getting dirty. Yes, Virginia, some people really do “need” nearly five tons of truck. If that’s you, it’s hard not to wish for an F-250 Super Duty 4X4 under the Xmas tree. Unless you have a problem with conspicuous consumption…
As a study in “how to make a pickup look like a blinged-out semi,” the F-250 Super Duty shines. The colossal chrome grille and the “jewel effect” headlamps could’ve been pilfered from the show “Trick My Truck.” The slightly-out-of-proportion greenhouse (thanks, mammoth crew cab) recalls the most spacious big rig sleepers. As do the 20″ donuts. In fact, the F-250’s enormous exterior dimensions– a devilish 6.66′ tall– make you wonder if the Super Duty might have 18 of ‘em. The optional red and black two-tone paint adorningout tester helped camouflage this gargantuan hulk. But with only 7.8 inches of ground clearance (on a 4X4?), almost all of that height is just one massive slab of pure truck.
Climbing into this super-optioned Super Duty is like ascending into the tree house of an upscale biker bar. The F-250’s reasonably comfortable (if not entirely supportive) black leather seats look smart. The chrome-ringed gunmetal-on-silver gauges aim squarely for a chic, industrial look. Everywhere you look, black, silver, and chrome abound. Sure, it’s all plastic. And yes, it’s a cheap to the touch. So don’t touch it. Otherwise, BMW money buys a damn luxurious truck; the observatory-sized moon roof, booming stereo and penthouse views co-mingle extravagance and traditional truckness. Truckitude? Truckosity? Truck it.
Speaking of tradition, Ford’s low-end-torque legacy is safer than ever, thanks to the Power Stroke’s 6.4-liter oil-burner-from-high-tech-hell, which diesel- out 350 horses at 3,000 rpm and 650 lb.-ft. of the twisty stuff at just two grand. Twin turbos, Piezo fuel injectors and particulate traps make this diesel meaner and cleaner than nearly any other big mill in Ford’s storied V8 history.
Although I didn’t get to tow anything, I probably wouldn’t have noticed if I had. Ford says this mother can pull 12,500 lbs. with a conventional hitch and 15,300 lbs. with a fifth-wheel rig. But that’s partially due to the limitations imposed by the mandatory 3.73:1 axle ratios in the F-250 4X4. The same engine in the beefier F-450 4X2 (with 4.30 gears) can tow over twelve tons. Sheer size masks the truck’s accelerative prowess, but try checking your speed at the end of a quickly-devoured on-ramp: you’ll slam down the (spongy) brake pedal and strain your retinas scanning for cops.
It takes one helluva chassis to handle power like that, and as far as sheer strength goes, the Super Duty’s got all you’ll ever need. But when it comes to driving dynamics, it takes the tractor-trailer theme a little too far. The Super Duty doesn’t ride or handle much differently from its Reagan-era predecessors. Call me sentimental, but I liked the 1980s “Novacain” power steering better; over-boosted numbness is better than the Super Duty’s rubbery feedback in my book. Still, the deer-stand-high perch aft of the tiller provides strategic high ground for all but the most death-defying parking lot heroics.
Overall, the new F-250 Super Duty frustrates aesthetically and lacks dynamically. So what? It’s big, it’s intimidating and it’ll handle genuine big truck tasks with the best of ‘em— and not even break a sweat in the process. But its significant shortcomings should remind Ford never to rest on its laurels. After all, the whole point of “better ideas” is to keep having them.
Luckily these behemoths are basically non-existent in Europe.
Carpenters and construction workers over here just drive around in vans. About half the fuel consumption or less, quick enough and about as comfortable as you want them to be.
I think these vehicles only serve a purpose for either lumberjacks and surfers or really heavy construction work (ie, building sites for big office buildings, industry etc that are big enough to have a need for heavy objects being moved around on site).
But the first category can just have an F150 as well…
Here in the Netherlands, I rarely see a fullsize pickup truck, and the ones I do see are clearly owned by posers. That might sound like a bold, maybe slightly jealous looking statement to make, but let me explain;
Here in my neighbourhood (suburban would describe it best) there’s a guy with a bright yellow Dodge Ram with black stripes over it, HEMI badges everywhere and Rumble Bee written on the rear, with a small picture of a stinging bee. It’s not just him either; everytime you do see one of them it is almost always a Dodge RAM.
Since the Ford is a much better car and has been for years, the only reason I can think of as to why people here, willing to purchase an “unofficially” imported vehicle from the US at a premium, would opt for 2nd or 3rd best is because they are posers and just buy the one that looks ‘tough’.
Why would a work truck have 20″ wheels? Doesn’t that subtract from the tow/haul capacity and the off-road handling needed with a 4×4?
Does anyone have an opinion on how the Ford setup compares to the Duramax/Allison combo?
I was born in America but I still don’t understand why we drive HUGE PICK UP TRUCKS.
Probably because our roads are wide enough to accomodate these trucks, We have 4 lane highways,
overweight so we want bigger space,gas is cheaper or whatever?
I still don’t know why? anybody….
Carpenters and construction workers over here just drive around in vans.
They do here, too,** at least the sensible ones. I see a lot more E-Series and E- or F- cut-offs than I do “standard” Super Duty’s. Very, very few people need a super-duty pickup truck: farmers will make do with a tractor for A-to-B work, and contractors go to cube-vans or E-Series.
About the only people who do use them are small motorsports operators, tow trucks and large livestock farmers. Outside of that, you’re into the Redneck Bling market.
This is a good truck, but it’s also a specialized tool. The above-noted model is the press-kit darling edition, which exist purely to make Ford et al wicked levels of margin. Or at least they did, before this market imploded.
** (though I’ve never seen a North American contractor use anything like the Piaggio Ape)
“The optional red and black two-tone paint [adorningout] tester helped camouflage this gargantuan hulk.”
Great review all the same, but one question: with the F-150 as capable as it is (I mean, maximum tow weight somewhere in the region of 11,500lbs) who really needs the F-250? Especially when the F-150 is scheduled to receive a diesel anyway? That’s still in the pipeline right?
The whole “Fuel economy ratings not required for this vehicle” thing doesn’t make a lot of sense to me. If it’s a work truck, used for commercial/business purposes, efficiency should be MORE important, not less.
Maybe they’re just going for the recreactional set. RV’s, horse trailers, boats, etc. For that purpose I think it’s perfect: comfortable, attractive, capable. But if you’re a lumberjack, what do you want with 20″ wheels and leather seats?
Given the premium up front, the higher cost of diesel and the complexity of modern diesels unless you tow 10k lbs frequently you are better off with the F-150.
Trucks like this are actually on the SMALL side for the Recovery & Towing Industry. In that realm you are competing with International, Freightliner, Hino, Isuzu, etc.
If you really want one of these things you are better off getting a used one. $5/gal diesel earlier this year just pummeled the resale on these when all of the “Urban Cowboys” stampeded for the exits.
I once saw a Ford Super Duty (probably a F-450, though) tow a full sized shipping container. That is to say, these things can substitute for a big rig.
@JJ excellent observation. IN US we have more posers, then in Netherlands (well we have larger population as well). We accustomed to drive monsters because low price of fuel and discount you get form the dealer. Let’s face it: this rig, except for motor and transmission is 40 some years old. Ford makes at least 10K on each one of them, so they are priced high and then dealers are selling “at cost” for refund check from manufacturer. You actually could not buy a good car from Ford (and I am not sure you can today). Last couple of years (decades) Ford (and GM and Chrysler) butchered their car fleets and operation chasing those monster profits. Consumer was conditioned by manufacturers, using flag waving and “big is beautiful” sales/marketing paradigm. There was large segment of not very bright consumers who felt for it.
Great review all the same, but one question: with the F-150 as capable as it is (I mean, maximum tow weight somewhere in the region of 11,500lbs) who really needs the F-250?
Because you’d be insane to tow ten thousand pounds, day in and day out, with an F-150. It can do it, but it’s like using an adjustable wrench to torque nuts: you can, and in a pinch it will work, but in the long run you want the right tool for the right job or you’ll pay for using the wrong one.
The horsepower wars have enable some real stupidity. Just because you can tow ten thousand pounds with an F-150 or damn-near twenty-thousand in a Super Duty, or approach six seconds in a Camry, break five in a 3-Series, or break four in a Corvette, doesn’t mean that you should. We’re putting a hell of a lot of vehicle in the hands of people who aren’t remotely ready to make the kind of compromises a vehicle or task allows.
Towing this kind of mass requires expertise. Hell, just driving this kind of truck in normal traffic requires skill and attention that a lot of people just don’t have. Something tells me that if we didn’t have cheap gas and easy credit enabling this kind of stupidity, we wouldn’t have the “truck hate” that went with it because these vehicles would be restricted to people who need them. That these vehicles made their makers big, fat margins didn’t exactly encourage them to do anything about it, either.
I work with a woman who commutes in an F-350 Harley Davidson. This is a big truck; parking my Honda Fit next to it is unnerving. Even more unnerving was watching her run over another co-worker’s Cavalier (she wasn’t looking where she was going and managed to get one wheel up on the car’s hood). That a G-class licensed driver can buy a truck that makes that possible is just flat wrong.
@psarhjinian
There are plenty times that grain farmers need to haul large wagons down the road. Tractors aren’t always the best choice for this.
Also, the farmers that I know buy their trucks used and with significantly fewer options than this beast has.
The 20″ wheels/tires are 275/65/20 Load range E
18″ wheels/tires are 275/70/18 load range E
F150 tow ratings go down from 11300# to 5100#
SuperDuty are 8300#- 24600#
The F150 limits your choice in RV somewhat, max seems to be about 31 feet and generally not luxury RVs. The luxury RVs tend to use heavier materials and thicker insulation which brings weight up.
Same thing with payload ratings for things like slide in campers.
The horsepower wars have enable some real stupidity. Just because you can tow ten thousand pounds with an F-150 or damn-near twenty-thousand in a Super Duty, or approach six seconds in a Camry, break five in a 3-Series, or break four in a Corvette, doesn’t mean that you should. We’re putting a hell of a lot of vehicle in the hands of people who aren’t remotely ready to make the kind of compromises a vehicle or task allows.
Ahh…but on the opposite end you have people who buy these monsters to tow jet skis or bike trailers when a Tacoma or Ranger would do just fine, let alone an F-150 or Dodge Ram. A friend of mine who drives a Volvo V50 has a single jet ski and said she wants to buy a Tundra to pull it. I nearly smacked him on the head with a 2 x 4. The Volvo, properly outfitted of course, could the job just fine, and at the very least, he can pick up a used Ranger for cheap if he REALLY wanted a truck. When I asked why does he want a Tundra his answer: “the salesman was giving him a good deal.”
Jeez…
And then you have the people who can’t handle a 268hp Camry or a 270hp Altima.
I laugh at these people.
$55k? Who in their right mind?
Never mind. I answered my own question….
It’s not so much the pounds it will tow, but how well it tows heavy trailers. I rode in a diesel ’04 RAM several years ago that was pulling a long closed-in trailer with a big muscle car it in, and it we were passing cars driving over the Rockies.
I have also been in a Super Duty, and Ford does make a nice truck.
Plus, I am getting tired of the hate for anyone in America that drives a big vehicle. They bought it with their own money, not to mention pay the additional taxes for it, so get over it. It just sounds like some people are envious of what others either can afford or want to own. Frankly I’d rather live in a country where the average Joe can afford a big truck even if he just wants to be a poser.
In Alabama, if you are a male of driving age and don’t drive a suitably large pickup truck, you’re “funny.” Note that funny does not mean you have a good sense of humor – rather, funny in a Liberace sense.
Great review all the same, but one question: with the F-150 as capable as it is (I mean, maximum tow weight somewhere in the region of 11,500lbs) who really needs the F-250? Especially when the F-150 is scheduled to receive a diesel anyway? That’s still in the pipeline right?
I once made the mistake of pulling a u-haul trailer from Michigan to Oregon behind an F-150. This wasn’t a huge trailer. I don’t know what it weighed, but I doubt it was more than a few thousand pounds.
The truck could barely maintain the speed limit over the rocky mountains, and got about 9 mpg.
Fast forward to my Y2K F-350 Crew Cab Diesel. I have hauled 5000 pounds of gravel in the bed on multiple occasions, and the truck had no problems accelerating or handling. Oh and the mileage dropped from about 17mpg to about 15mpg. This truck is also a pleasure for highway trips. Smooth and stable for thousands of miles at a stretch.
By the way, I test drove an F-250 and a Chevy Silverado 2500 last weekend.
In my opinion the new F-series interiors just seem garish. The engine had plenty of pep (more than my old 7.3L Diesel), but felt “rev-happy”.
The Chevy felt much more refined, and will probably be my choice.
These trucks, with MSRPs around $45K, are selling for around $30K right now. Regardless of fuel prices, that’s a bargain. So long as there’s some company around to honor the warranty.
Plus, I am getting tired of the hate for anyone in America that drives a big vehicle. They bought it with their own money, not to mention pay the additional taxes for it, so get over it.
It’s wasteful, and it damn well affects other people if you can’t use it responsibly (see the above post about my co-worker who ran over another car in her F-350).
There’s a lot of things you can do that you ought not to out of a sense of shared social responsibility. Buying a truck way, way beyond your needs is one of them. Remember, this isn’t a New Age Station Wagon like a Flex or Sienna, which, massive as they are, have a lot to recommend them. If you need an Super Duty (and a lot of people do–that’s not in dispute) that’s fine. If you’re buying it as a five-ton piece of jewelry, be man enough to suck it up when people question your needs, judgment or sanity.
They have just as much a right to criticize your choices as you had to make them in the first place.
Hmmm…what’s more interesting is that with last gen’ F-150 (up to ’08), the max towing weights went up from 9500lbs to over 11,000lbs, all on the same platform with no measurable increase in hp (a measly 10hp doesn’t count).
I don’t so much hate the casual truck buyer as to his/her reasoning for buying a full sized truck. Hey, even I at one point wanted a Dodge Ram just because it looked so cool and the letters HEMI appealed to me. But then I looked at the gas mileage and figured hmmm…what if gas were to go up? And wouldn’t ya know…2-3 years later there it went. And with it, so did the people who bought trucks for looks etc.
If you can afford to maintain a truck (buying it is a breeze these days) then by all means, enjoy the experience. For those of you that wish you could, there’s a Ford Ranger somewhere with your name on it.
God Ford was successful in making that truck amazingly ugly.
They had the best looking truck on the road with the previous gen and now they have the ugliest…with the worst interior I have ever seen on a vehicle that costs $50K+. The plastics make the Fisher Price Cozy Coupe look like a Maybach.
Let me address some of the comments above. I sell these beasts for a living and the F150 and F250 Super Duty are entirely different animals.
The F150 is a capable light-duty pickup but, from my experience, is used more as a work/personal vehicle combo or persaonal vehicle exclusively. Notice how Ford advertises this product. Its nearly always advertised in personal use configurations. While we do have customers that will use the F150 in a base work spec configuration, they are often company vehicles for foremen/supervisors or light delivery vehicles. Here in snow country, this truck is nearly never used in a plow application.
We sell mostly white, base spec Super-Duty trucks nearly exclusively as a heavy work truck. The suspensions on these trucks are much heavier. Its ride is much stiffer. These are the bread-and-butter trucks for heavy contracting applications like road building, landscaping, electrical construction and so forth. They are fitted with plows, service bodies, racks and other upfits. This is Ford’s work horse. The truck, as tested, probably makes for a nice horse or haywagon hauler, but does not represent how this truck is used in my world.
All that said, who cares if a “poser” wants to own one. If he can afford it, why not?
Darn, I was hopoing this was a review of a truck with the V10 powertrain.
SupaMan :
December 3rd, 2008 at 12:40 pm
Ahh…but on the opposite end you have people who buy these monsters to tow jet skis or bike trailers when a Tacoma or Ranger would do just fine, let alone an F-150 or Dodge Ram. A friend of mine who drives a Volvo V50 has a single jet ski and said she wants to buy a Tundra to pull it. I nearly smacked him on the head with a 2 x 4. The Volvo, properly outfitted of course, could the job just fine, and at the very least, he can pick up a used Ranger for cheap if he REALLY wanted a truck. When I asked why does he want a Tundra his answer: “the salesman was giving him a good deal.”
Well, the Ranger is such a piece of shit I can see why you wouldn’t want one of those if you can avoid it. My boss has what I believe is an 06 Ranger as his work vehicle, and man, what a piece. He has to really work at getting it started, plus it sounds horrible once it does run.
Plus, the difference in price (in the real world, after rebates and discounts) between the Ranger and the F-150 or the Tacoma and the Tundra is minimal (especially the Fords). You might as well trade up, especially in a personal vehicle.
Of course, you are right when you say the Volvo could tow that just fine.
“… They bought it with their own money, not to mention pay the additional taxes for it, so get over it.”
They didn’t buy with their own money, they borrowed the money from someone else. 95 cents out of every $1.00 of value. And that’s one reason Detroit is in the porcelain fixture. Like subprime mortgages, the economy turns down, buyers stop payment, the vehicle is reposessed and if the loan is made by Ford/GM a large loss. On the other side is a buyer claiming they didn’t understand the transaction and would Nancy/Henry cut them a check with taxpayer dollars just like the big boy bailouts. For those that do pay – their right and happy trucking.
I have to laugh at a lot of these statements. Especially from people (United States) that should fully understand the meaning of ‘FREEDOM’. Why should it bother anyone if someone wants to spend 50 g’s on the biggest MFing truck they can find, as merely a poser? Who cares!!! Part of FREEDOM is the FREEDOM of doing what you want with YOUR money. I find it especially amusing that these same people would see no problem with someone spending $250,000 on a Ferrari F430 where speed limits are 65MPH. See the irony? Let’s see, did anyone mention in the F430 review the poor fuel economy and usability of a 500 HP car? https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2008-ferrari-f430-review/ Personally, I believe that most people that buy a truck this large (in the U.S.) ‘do’ put them to use. SUV’s, not so much. But should it matter? I don’t think so. Do you know how annoying it is every time someone asks how many MPG my Viper attains, merely to try a make point? IF I CARED, DO YOU THINK I WOULD HAVE BOUGHT IT? I bought it because it was my dream car ever since I was a kid, and I saved for 10 years to be able to afford a 2 year old used GTS. I’ve always had a passion for sports cars, albeit one that may not serve my pocketbook best. Point is it is my choice how to spend MY money. DOESN’T EVERYONE HAVE SOME VICES ANYWAY? You know one that makes no sense logically, but makes your happy? Wouldn’t it be a boring world if we were all like Spock from Star Trek? Everyone driving around in Toyota Corollas and Honda Civics?
Now that my rant is over, I DO NOT think any company should be bailed out by tax payers. Nor should any private citizen that borrowed more than he could afford. It’s called personal responsibility, and for true FREEDOM to exist this must become a reality. People’s tax dollars going to bail out failing companies or irresponsible individuals is not FREEDOM. It is not CAPITOLISM! And it is NOT the direction the United States should be headed.
Why should it bother anyone if someone wants to spend 50 g’s on the biggest MFing truck they can find, as merely a poser? Who cares!!!
Because your choices impact other people. Trite as it sounds, freedom isn’t free. As I said above: if you’ve bought a big, manly truck and aren’t doing big, manly work with it, grow a big manly spine and accept that people will criticize you for it.
And yes, people criticize Ferrari drivers. All the time. But a lot more people can drop fifty grand on a Super Duty than can drop a quarter-million-plus on a Ferrari.
what a joke. What does it matter what someone wants to drive. It is ludacris to me to sit and think people take offense in this country with all the rising problems, due to these liberalist views, to a truck. People should be more concerned wit hthe fact that, in a time of near depression and total fail of an American iconic business failure, that you still continually send tens of thousands of dollars on cars from japan. They are not of better quality, atleast American cars can stop. Yes, American cars have recalls, but typically for paint, or somethign wrong with the dashboards cracking, not total brake system failure. Another hipocritical thing is most people on here probably drive an over priced german sports car, BMX, which are purely junk. which ican say based on exp of a brand new one, or over priced Nissan Altimas and etc. What is wrong with buying a big powerful truck that can serve a purpose if need be for 50 grand, where as your forty thousand dollar nissan has no purpous but to speed on freeways and back roads. All the individuals that have griped about my 250 here in Georgia had no complaitns when we had a very odd winter and had snow storms and they were in ditches because the cars couldnt perform and my truck pulled them out without having to file a costly insurance claim.
Geotpf:
Well, the Ranger is such a piece of shit I can see why you wouldn’t want one of those if you can avoid it. My boss has what I believe is an 06 Ranger as his work vehicle, and man, what a piece. He has to really work at getting it started, plus it sounds horrible once it does run.
I have an ’06 Ranger XL, possibly the same as this “work vehicle” your boss drives. Vinyl seats, rubber floor, four cylinder with the manual trans, Oxford White. The only “option” is air conditioning, which incidentally for many of us in the South is not an option.
As with most any vehicle, you get what you deserve. In this case, your boss is either way too hard on his Ranger, or doesn’t service it as recommended. Or perhaps both. Mine is serviced every 3,000 miles with Motorcraft 5w20 syn blend and the ubiquitous FL400S Motorcraft oil filter. Not once have I had trouble out of it. Two of my tires are still the original Contitracs from the factory at 40,000 miles– but then again, I actually take the time to rotate my tires at every other service.
The powertrains in the Ranger are among the most proven in Ford’s line-up, and from my experience, the Duratec 2.3-liter four cylinder is plenty powerful and fairly quiet for a truck engine.
My father works as a contractor, and I’ve done preventative maintenance on the Rangers his coworkers drive. They all have either the 3.0 V6– known in Ranger circles as the “3-point-slow,”– or the 4.0 V6, either way with an automatic transmission. These folks drive it like they stole it, they go 10,000 or 15,000 miles between oil changes, they never replace the air filter despite driving stop-and-go in very dusty conditions, and they seemingly find a way to run over every tire-puncturing, dent-causing, rattle-inducing thing they can find out there on the road.
At that point, yes, of course the Ranger turns into a turd. Just like any pickup would. But suffice it to say they keep chugging along, and I’ve yet to see any of their fleet trucks come out to be “lemons.”
The Ranger is still tough for a small pickup. Its base interior, even though parts of it have been in production for at least 13 years now, is still way nicer than anything GM has managed to put into the dreadful Colorado/Canyon base trucks. Toyota’s four cylinder Tacoma is more thirsty, but not any more capable. The Dodge Dakota has never been this size anyway, and it gets fuel economy numbers that even the gas-hog F150 laughs at.
Thus, for some people who need a miserly, capable truck to haul firewood from the barn, jet skis to the lake, or trash to the recycling center on the weekend while still having a cheap runabout to drive to work and back through the week, the Ranger makes perfect sense. And in my experience both with my current truck and previous Rangers in the family, the less options it has, the longer it lasts without any major failures. Users at Ranger Power Sports are even reporting a few 300,000 mile Rangers with the (relatively) new 2.3 liter Duratec mill.
Now, with my off-topic rant over– I would buy an F250 much the same way I bought my Ranger: Stripped. But I would only buy it if it met my needs. It’s difficult enough finding parking, dealing with tight traffic and narrow small-town streets and backroads without having to consider the heft of a vehicle like this one. But if I needed to pull cattle to the stock sales, or had an RV to take cross-country…sure.
This is America, after all, so common sense, moderation and control over Needs vs. Wants need not apply: I wonder why so many around here still react negatively to the normal way we Americans know how to display our own exhuberance?
Case in Point:
Go to ANYDressage or Show Jumping (or any Horse-related event for that matter) and park on the back of the lot: You will see plenty of MILF driven “Super X-tra Heavy Duty 4×4 Dually Turbo Diesel” trucks with leather seats and the mandatory De-Luxe Xtra-Large steel horse trailer attached to it. Complete with Starbucks coffee stains all over the cabin. Guaranteed.
Do the same in Europe & you will find the mandatory E seriers and 5 series wagons with lightweight horse trailers attached to them (and better horses inside). Anything bigger needed over there and it’s to the commercial hauling: their owners have something better to do with their time than play livestock hauler.
Because your choices impact other people. Trite as it sounds, freedom isn’t free. As I said above: if you’ve bought a big, manly truck and aren’t doing big, manly work with it, grow a big manly spine and accept that people will criticize you for it.
And yes, people criticize Ferrari drivers. All the time. But a lot more people can drop fifty grand on a Super Duty than can drop a quarter-million-plus on a Ferrari.
Criticism is one thing, but ‘forcing’ people to do something is quite different. I’m not suggesting you are implying this, but some people are…. And where did I say (or imply), “Freedom is free.”? Quite the contrary.
Personally, someone driving an F250 does not impact my life in the least. Apparantly it did impact you (or coworker) due to someone not knowing how to drive, but I do not think that has to do with the vehicle. Merely the driver. Matter of fact, I won’t be surprised if these type of vehicles are in far less accidents (% wise) than Honda Civics. Every time someone has hit my car in 20 years (only a few knock on wood), it was not a truck. But I do agree with you on advanced training for large vehicles. Heck, I think getting a license should be a more demanding process (training wise). But that’s another topic…. A longgggg topic.
Costal Elites cannot stand the sight of proletarians living a little well in socially garish rides.
LS600h Pimpmobiles anyone? Nobody? Last call?? Navigator EL Ultimate or F-450 Harley-Davidson? That’s more like it :)
Criticism is one thing, but ‘forcing’ people to do something is quite different.
Correct.
At this point, I’m not inclined to care what anyone says about my vehicle choices. And I’m definitely not about to be forced into driving something that the “enlightened” among me deem “proper”…….unless they are willing to pay the car note, gas and insurance every single month. Until then, I’ll subsidize whatever vehicle I wish to own.
As for Europe, most drive the cars they drive out of sheer necessity. Narrow streets, lack of parking, fuel taxes, VAT and displacement taxes can really dictate what you drive over there. Might explain why no one harps on the Ferrari driver’s “wastefulness” — they secretly want to be him!!!
So John Williams, does this mean you’re not ready to buy a Prius and smell your own rose fragrance farts? ;)
BTW – Your post NAILED IT!
Just wanted to point out one big feature that was missing from the review truck, but is a big selling point on the new ’09 superduties: Ford Work Solutions. This includes –
CrewChief – A telematics system that allows the foreman/supervisor/motorpool-director to acess everything from the location of each vehicle via GPS, average idle time, when oil changes and other services are due on each truck, average and max speed on each vehicle, etc, all in real time.
In-Dash Computer – Turns the cab into a mobile office with the ability to print invoices on site, access the internet via Sprint mobile broadband and do remote desktop work, etc.
Tool Link – Uses RFID tags and sensors in the bed along with a program in the dash computer to make sure all tools needed for a job are in the truck, and alerts the driver if leaving the depot or the work site if any of the tools are missing.
CableLock – In bed heavy duty cable lock system to make sure all aforementioned tools aren’t stolen out of the bed of the truck.
NulloModo:
Just wanted to point out one big feature that was missing from the review truck, but is a big selling point on the new ‘09 superduties: Ford Work Solutions…
Yup. That’s all great stuff.
In addition to the CrewChief, In-Dash Computer, and RFID Tool Link, the 2010 Model Year Option List will include a 20mm M61A1 Vulcan Cannon for dealing with any potential thieves.
Maybe it’s silly of me, but I am damn proud of the great trucks our miserable US automakers are able to produce. While it is stupid that so many suburban dads who have to tow a 4000 pound boat are going to think they need this truck, it’s good to know that we still make the very best of something in the automotive world.
We’ve got lots of dually driving horse MILFs up here. The only time I’ve seen an F450 it had a “ranch” name on it.
Horse chicks are always crazy hot too.
I suppose if you have a $250K horse, it’s OK to have a $50K truck.
I wouldn’t use Europe as an example of safe or expedient towing practices. Their typical tow rating for a compact (Golf, Astra, Focus)is 1200kg or 2640lbs.
For a Passat wagon it’s 1700/3740
an E-class estate is 2100kg/4620lbs
Maybe all those cars could move those weights they’re rated for but it’s not going to be at a speed you would want or without great effort.
ihatetrees –
The scary thing is that a bed-mounted cannon would probably lead to a runaway sales success…
The ’09 Super Duty Cabela Edition comes with a locking gun compartment under the rear seats:
http://www.cabelas.com/story-123/cabelas_edition_superduty/10967/Drive%252Ba%252BLegend.shtml
davey49 –
Who said anything about it being fast or effortless? If you’re towing something, you probably shouldn’t be driving the same speeds or attempting the same maneuvers as if you weren’t.
ctoan- effortless towing is exactly the point to these trucks.
I never would have expected the personal freedom debate spawned by my review of this truck (but I am thoroughly enjoying it).
Far be it from me to interject my own (strongly-held) personal beliefs into the Best & Brightest’s intelligent and entertaining discourse on the matter, but I would like to concur with davey49 about the fact that there is definitely something to be said for “effortless” towing.
If you take a look at what has happened to the towing capacity of the average car (coupe, sedan, or station wagon) sold in North America over the past 30 years, you’ll see that it has decreased dramatically (I read one statistic that said 90+%, which isn’t at all unbelievable). Not all of this reduction is due to front-wheel-drive and unit-body construction, either – some of it has to do with gearing, drivetrain longevity issues, and even bumper support designs. Even Ford’s venerable rear-wheel-drive, body-off-frame Panther platform vehicles (Crown Vic, et al) can’t tow nearly what they could twenty years ago (due, among other things, to the 2.73:1 final drive ratio most of them now come with for the sake of improving fuel economy).
I’ve grown up around trucks, the vast majority of which were full-size. But fundamentally, I am a CAR person. So even though I have to haul a 2,000 utility trailer 50+ miles at least once every week (I’m in a band), I wasn’t going to buy a truck…I wanted my daily driver to be a car. And even though my car is rated to tow a trailer this size, and even though I do it, let me tell you, IT ABSOLUTELY SUCKS. Reduced transmission life, reduced brake pad and rotor life, 25% (at least) decrease in fuel economy while towing, vastly different handling while towing, etc, etc, etc, etc. But let me borrow my Dad’s ’99 F-250 and pull this trailer…and all those issues are gone…the truck performs exactly the same in each of the aforementioned categories (including fuel mileage) with or without this (admittedly small) trailer behind it.
Whether or not you believe it’s someone’s right to own a vehicle that exceeds their legitimate needs is something that is (obviously) open for debate. But keep in mind that many of those needs are not practically met by a vehicle who’s specifications merely equals the minimum requirements these needs suggest. An F-250 with an 8,000 pound towing capacity (like my Dad’s) is certainly overkill for the trailer I pull, but my car (which is rated at 2,000 pounds exactly) does an extraordinarily poor job of pulling it, as would some other vehicles (i.e. cars) that are just not build for towing like full-size trucks are.
I am fatigued by the whole Europe is great, America sucks argument. The fact is that these guys can drive whatever they want and whatever they can afford. And, nobody can stop them. Oh, if they can’t afford it, they can buy one that is a couple years old which they can afford. So you really can’t stop them if they want that big truck.
I usually tow with my 1990 4runner, which is my daily driver. When I have a bigger load, I borrow my brother’s F250, which is his daily driver. He likes it. He likes what he likes. He also knows the price of fuel. I don’t think he cares. Not everything is done for economy. If it was, we would all be driving civics, as was mentioned earlier. IMHO, its too boring of a car. You may disagree. Good fuel economy though. I think my brother gets the same gas mileage as I do in my V6 4runner.
God Bless America. That’s what makes her great. You can’t tell everyone what to do. You guys can have Europe.
rmwill :
Costal Elites cannot stand the sight of proletarians living a little well in socially garish rides.
ARGH!
Don Gammil- Thanks for the mention, I knew someday someone would agree with me.
It’s the people who believe Honda’s (and other minivan makers) specs that their vans can tow 3000-4000# I feel for. I sure wouldn’t want to do it. Minivans tend to grenade transmissions naturally, don’t know how quick it would happen if you were towing.
fli317- the 4Runner is one of the best cars ever
rmwill :
Costal Elites cannot stand the sight of proletarians living a little well in socially garish rides.
ARGH!
Well said, Justin “Charlie Brown” Berkowitz!
rmwill :
Costal Elites cannot stand the sight of proletarians living a little well in socially garish rides.
I just wish there were a weight graduated driver’s test, so that people who are trying to pilot a 4-ton giant are certified to have the proper training. Driving a truck != driving a car.
You may not have noticed, but there’s a lot of trash talk about so-called “coastal elites” buying and driving these vehicles, and no one really cares about bob the farmer with a big truck, because no one cares about bob the farmer. They care about buffy/clint the cell-phone talker in her/his new F-YOU driving over the front of their car, to quote an extreme example.
A consumer $50k anything is not for proles.
leighzbohns :
Are you equally offended by drivers of M/AMG/R performance gas guzzlers as you are with truck owners?
deleted by author
rmwill:
I’m not offended by truck drivers. I’m scared by car drivers who drive trucks like they’re cars. I also recognize that people have different views on what constitutes a status symbol depending on their location. I don’t feel that a really expensive truck is any less ostentatious than a really expensive car, or a really expensive , or anything else designed to show off how special the owner may be.
What bothers me is not the ostentation, but the torturous attempts to justify your toy as something practical: Who is going to try to justify a M3, when a 3-series is as good at getting you around (better, probably)? But a F350 with duallies? you hear nothing but a litany of excuses as if owning an awesome truck with a diesel and duallies is not enough. trust me, it is. Just don’t tailgate, please.
How many dually trucks does everyone here see? Outside of racetracks and RV parks, I think I’ve seen 3 in my lifetime.
Anybody actually own one of these things can attest, do not buy it.
The diesel emissions control shuts off the car if you haven’t burned off the particulate filter device or thingamagig in awhile. I’ve heard owners taking back the truck when they realize the emissions control will shut the car off for 45 minutes to conduct the burn and you’re stuck waiting for it to finish. Great technology. Buy a used diesel 2007 and before to avoid it.
Is it me or does the Trucks from Ford keep getting uglier and uglier. That thing looks like something out of transformers. Ford long with all the big 3 should be engineering fuel efficient diesels for these big rigs. Hell is BMW can build diesel with 4 cylinder efficiency yet V8 power and get 32mpg it shbould not be that hard, or should it. If you have a truck for ranching and suck its good to have all that power and muscle but if your just getting it just to cruise it’;s pointless, they should engineer a bio diesel so people can have different options and are not limited. Especially in the midst of another fuel crisis.
I own an F-250 SuperDuty.
Why did I buy it? Because my F-150 was struggling to pull my 22′ enclosed car trailer. The engine and transmission were up to task; but the chassis and brakes were marginal at best. I drive a semi for a living…I know what a vehicle should feel like when pulling a trailer.
I have 70K miles on my truck, of which I estimate 40% of those are towing or hauling. With the V-10 engine, fuel mileage was not a high priority concern. Ya gotta pay to play sorta thing.
My wife and daughter enjoy driving this truck as well.
Did I need this truck? 40% of the time I do. Did I drive it this past summer with $4 gas? Yes I did. Would I buy this truck again? Damn straight.
If you don’t understand why we have these trucks, then it’s best that you just stay away from them since they are not for you.
JJ,
You U.S. bashing Europeans really make no sense. You owe your freedoms and form of democracy (if you can call it that anymore) to the U.S. We spread democracy and had to salvage yours in two world wars with our blood and treasure. Then you grew fat and lazy with your 4-day work weeks, six weeks of vacation, free health care, ridiculous job benefits, etc… all through the Cold War as we Americans paid for your national defense to our own detriment. Your governments gave you all these benefits because we were paying for your defense against the good ole USSR. In many ways, we still pay for your defense. I know. My daughter works for the CIA. I am college educated and am a history buff.
Many european countries have very little rural areas and natural areas left. Of course most of you don’t need an F350 with your urban lifestyle and tiny streets. Here in the heartland of the US, our government was the first in history to conserve millions of acres in national parks, national forests, and other open spaces. We have a much better environment than you but you still think you need to teach us about being green while you live in a concrete world! Teddy Roosevelt created many of our national parks and forests and was being green before you were born! You think being green is driving a little death trap at your own peril and bragging about it while you have consumed almost all of your landmass to development! Or putting up ugly, inefficient wind farms (electricity cannot be stored and when the wind is not blowing you still need to be hooked into the regular coal or fossil fuel powered grid) that only function 30% of the time. Where I live, agricultural production is on a grand scale with large farms and cattle ranches and millions of acres of national forests and parks. We need large pick-ups for work in this environment. I have an F250 Diesel and tow equipment and livestock about half the time. I tow at elevations over 10,000ft. where a gas engine will overheat. We have snow here in the winter and need four-wheel drive and the ground clearance provided by these vehicles just to get back home. My private drive-way is 1.75 miles long from the end of the public road. The government does not plow my drive-way!
Even if I lived in the city, I would want to visit the country and public lands for recreation and would need a truck. Plus, my ancestors moved here to have freedom of choice and to get away from people who think like you. Please stay in europe.
CWO, don’t get too hot about JJ. I’m American too and have lived for several years in Europe. They have dense cities and open countryside like anywhere else. No – they might not have alot of areas like Iowa or Kansas or the Dakotas unless a person visits Sweden or Finland or Russia.
There are alot of narrow streets between vintage buildings in some towns. There are also plenty of wide roads frequented by plenty of large vehicles in the more modern areas of cities. They deliver with heavy trucks just like we do. Vehicle physics remain the same everywhere. Europeans will give up some acceleration in favor of fuel mileage though.
A person does not NEED one of these big trucks in many, many places. A person does not NEED one of these to have some rest and relaxation here or anywhere else in the world – UNLESS you haul stuff. That’s the only reason for it. A quality SUV could conquer your snow and mud. The only place your big ole truck wins is the hauling contest. Glad your truck has a purpose. So many do not except to carry cowboys with big hats and bull-balls off the trailer hitch.
JJ is right a Dodge Sprinter style van does accomplish more than many Americans would give credit for. Not sure that the average HD Sprinter would ever return much MPG advantage though if it was weighted down with a ton or two of tools or materials.
The little car based commercial vehicles so common in Europe could also get alot of work done here too. A car body with a cargo box on the back. I’ve driven all of these commercial type vehicles and they would do fine here if people would accept them but too many of us have an inflated idea of what we need vs what we want.
Just wait until inflation nails us in the near future and we’ll be looking for these smaller vehicle alternatives. Thank Wall Street and DC for the coming inflation (both parties too).
I guess as long as your wants don’t affect the prices of my needs then we’ll get along fine… VBG!
We all look at these large vehicles as extreme solutions for problems that may or may not exist in our particular lifestyle. I do see alot of these trucks not doing anything here that an ordinary commuter car or light van couldn’t do around here. Out west I’m sure your situation is different. JJ’s is too I’m sure.
The Europeans I knew had a friend with a commercial vehicle to deliver heavy or bulky stuff to them or they simply hired a truck for a load of stuff. Considering the cost of owning a large vehicle when gasoline or diesel approaches ten bucks a gallon and then the insurance cost and taxes – why would a person keep a truck around for occasional use?
For the record I’d love to own one of these trucks but even if I did it would sit unused b/c I really never need one. Maybe a couple times a year I could justify getting it out for a ride.
I don’t care what anyone drives unless we get into a tight fuel market where what we drive collectively pushes the prices up or if the over-abundance of very large vehicles makes the roads unsafe.
Of course I think the commodity speculators have done WAY more damage to prices recently than the American fascination with thirsty vehicles.
On a sidenote – noticing that during this recession that alot of these big trucks owned by folks who have them for the style are riding around on bald tires here. Apparently the lower wages b/c of the recession and cost of ownership are hurting their budgets. My commercial tire salesman uncle reports the same thing. His customers are parking a good portion of their equipment and taking tires and parts off of them to keep the rest of the rolling stock on the move for the minimum cost. There will be a run on tires eventually when the economy recovers a little.
I own a 2000 F250 with the legendary V8 7.3 diesel engine. I say legendary because it is hands down the most reliable engine ever put into a SD truck frame from the big three (Chevy, Dodge, Ford). Something about when International made this engine they just made it right. I’m on 104,000 miles and not a SINGLE problem.
My truck has a 6″ suspension lift with 35″ Nitto Mud Grapplers. I have a front end replacement ranch hand bumper at home waiting to be put on when the time comes. I’ve installed a “chip” in my truck to aid in power and acceleration…also in the occasional smoke out for drivers and pedestrians that anger me. My truck weighs in at just about an even 6,000 pounds and i still acheive roughly 20 mpg highway and 12-15 city mpg. That being said…
I do not tow anything with my truck. I am not a construction worker who needs the bed to throw things into. I am a full time college student who uses his truck to get to and from classes (and work in the summer). I drive my truck for a few reasons.
1. Because I can. Plain and simple with not much of an explanation needed. I can afford the diesel for it, I can afford the extra taxes on it, and i’m pretty dang good at parking it even in the tightest of spaces.
2. I like the size of it. I don’t say this because I am “compensating” for anything. I am a 6’4″ 175 lb home grown Texan. And personally from the way i was raised, i prefer sitting much higher on the road than everyone else. I am so accustomed to riding higher than everyone else that anytime i ride with my friends in their cars, I…well to be honest I feel like my @$$ is dragging on the ground.
3. The third and most important reason being, because nobody, and I mean NOBODY can tell me otherwise. I hate having the Green Peace activists outside my campus yell at me after i park that I am the reason it’s so hot outside. I hate that when I fill up my tank, yes all 30 gallons of it, that some random Prius owner decides he needs to tell me what he thinks about my truck. And to be honest, these comments are usually met with me getting into my truck, driving by slowly, and belching out as much of that beautiful black diesel perfume as I can all over them.
Well this ends my little rant.
-Shooter04
I am in the market for an F-250 and have been searching for reviews and comments to help me with the decisions related to such a important purchase. Even though reading this exchange couldn’t answer the common questions of a potential buyer, it has been so very enjoyable. Thank you for the many smiles; my mother in-law even asked, “what is so funny?”.
Consider this: the GCWR-Gross Combined Weight Rating of an F-150 Crew Cab is over it’s limits when loaded with a full tank of gas, four average sized adults and two cases of beverages. Now add two or three hundred pounds of tongue weight and you’ve set yourself up for a liability suit. I am sorry your honor, I didn’t realize I was operating an overloaded vehicle. I was just trying to keep the owners of little cars from scowling at me. I am truly sorry I ran over one.
Thanks for the laughs, what a hoot! I am sorry I have to cut this short my overloaded laptop’s battery is running low. I know, I should have purchased a bigger battery. :)
Buy an F-250 or larger depending on your needs!
I have a 08 250 crewcab FX4 that I use to tow our boat. The rest of the time its a daily driver. So I’m I a bad person driving a behemoth everyday. What people don’t understand is I’m getting the gas mileage as a F-150 but the protection of a tank. I feel my family is safe as can be in it and if little bobby wants to run a red light and T-bone my family, we will walk away. Basicly stop profiling people due to what they drive.
Have any of you ever thought that the truck would be used for towing a 5th wheel, toy hauler, boat, horse trailer??? Netherlands REALLY your a 3rd rate country Im surprised you have electricity.