Find Reviews by Make:
Department of Energy “retooling loans” – $25b
GM and Chrysler “bridging loans” – $17.4b
U.S. Treasury “investment”in GMAC – $5b
U.S. Treasury supplement to GM for GMAC – $1b
TOTAL – $48.4b
30 Comments on “Bailout Watch 319: Damage Report...”
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What a waste of money. The only way out is chapter 11 + 300B federal investment.
Allow me to provide the graphic for this lovely article:
http://www.bellycast.com/buynow/vaseline.jpg
Well now the steel industry and the housing industry have bellied up to the bar. This is a dream of the Democrats, having the industries all nationalized. The return of National Socialism.
This may be a dream of the Democrats, but please do not forget from where the pen-stroke came from, ok?
I agree, it’s Nazi-ism at its finest.
Actually, it’s more along the lines of Fascism, as fascism is the merging of corporations and the state.
“Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power.” – Benito Mussolini.
Don’t forget about the newspaper industry. Wait until the government comes to the rescue and starts running media outlets. Now that’s Nazi-ism at its finest!
Its a good thing no one is over reacting to this. I mean the last thing we need is a bunch of people running around saying the world is going to end.
In fiscal year 2008, there were 11,524 earmarks totaling $16,501,833,000 for appropriations accounts.
Come on, its just a loan.
bluecon:
Socializing manufacturing industries is a huge mistake, but this is worse than that. The response to the “financial crisis” is a mix of kleptocracy and socialism that in unprecedented in US history. Bush cronyism and Pelosi “the sky is falling”, shock doctrine, panicked panty wetting have come together to create the worst possible combination.
The government has managed to spend and allocate almost $50 billion bailing out companies that, pre-bailout, were worth less than $5 billion.
$50 billion is quite a large number, especially in this somewhat shackle-free market environment. However, it pales in comparison to the $586 bil we’ve just pissed away in Iraq alone. At least we will see some of that $50 billion returned. Can you say the same for the $$ pissed away in Iraq? And Bob, no I am not trolling. Just stating the obvious.
RF,
Proof positive that you do indeed read your email and take it to heart. :)
By the way, wasn’t some senator (who was against all of this a few weeks ago) quoted as saying that it would take something like $125b to bail out the automakers entirely?
I can almost see one of those silly thermometer-type boards with GOAL at the top and the red in the thermometer just going up with each passing announcement of more taxpayer money going to the Big 3…
Derm81: “At least we will see some of that $50 billion returned. ”
Really? How will that work? When you loan money to insolvent parties, they have a tendency to not pay that loan back.
The Bridge Loans to the automakers is bitter, but it will keep employment going until someone, somewhere sorts out the Big 3…I’m thinking a well trained and disipilned military retiree….if these numbers choke you, at least we can see and count the results.Look at the banking industry…especially the CitiGroup “event”…talk about smell test.
P.S. JKross22…the banks were insolvent too.
…All the King’s horses, and all the King’s men…..
jkross22
Really? How will that work? When you loan money to insolvent parties, they have a tendency to not pay that loan back.
How do you think the governments of China and Japan feel?
Some very good thoughts and opinions on this post.
derm81, I am no fan of the war, but as a person who studied economics in college, I cringe when I hear that phrase. The money spent on the war has been and will continue to be the best way to stimulate our economy. I’d estimate that 90% of those dollars flows right back into our economy that otherwise would not have. That would be in the form of wages, equipment, food, etc. On the other hand, Obama’s planned “huge stimulus” dollars (and dumb-ass Bush’s too) go to buy things like fuel imported from terrorists, TV’s & toys made in China, etc.
Another thing is that frankly the 50 or so billion that the gov’t is loaning the automakers will eventually make it’s way into the real economy, and also (theoretically) be paid back. Now, where is the 700 billion going that the banks got? I’d say the Detroit bailout was a much better value. A prettier pig, anyway.
48,400,000,000!! So, every family in America has had it pocket picked for about $500 by GM. I suppose it wouldn’t be the first time, but it is galling. Who will go to court for this? Who will go to jail? A corporate or government entity is not a thing you can pin a crime on.
Poor simple people go to jail for stealing $500 from a family. Proud, rich ambitious men can murder a mother-in-law or steal your savings, and for them it’s not a crime. If they are really clever, they can even get you to say, “Thankyou.”
Pockets picked? Robbed? It is a loan, a risky bb rated loan to be sure, but a loan. Now they need to use the money and re-pay it, with interest in keeping with the risk. I would say the buying of toxic debt,(the same descriptive name used by all), from the banks is of much higher risk, and brought down all the large institutions. Most were saved, some were not. Now we see the pain when a Leahman is allowed to fail.
Two homework assignments:
1. Examine and document how much the foreign carmakers have been supported by their governments over the decades. Don’t forget nationalized health plans, government investments, government purchases, national attitudes by everyone except Americans, and exchange rate manipulations. Report back.
2. Report back on the 10x effort you’re spending blogging about AIG. 10x the government cost should equal 10x the blog time, right?
We’ll wait. You’ll have a LOT of writing to do! :-)
TheRealAutoGuy,
I can appreciate your tongue-in-cheek post, but when in the hell did two wrongs MAKE a right? That’s not the way I learned the saying in my younger days. “Yes” AIG and a host of banks used Paulson & Bush to rob the taxpayers! “Yes” it was more money than Bush & Paulson gave to the auto makers! Is any of it “right”? Should we as taxpayers just shrug our shoulders? HELL NO! I’m a big boy and I understand how the world works. I can’t help but be pissed off thinking about my kids and (someday) grandkids continuing to pay for this B.S. because our government refused to be adults and actually tackle tough issues with some fiscal responsibility.
Tex
luscious, that quote from Mussolini is spurious.
In the 20s there were two main schools of socialism: The USSR’s on one hand, and all the others on the other hand.
The USSR sought to control socialism. Non-USSR socialism included Italian Fascism, German National Socialism, and to a lesser extent, American New Deal.
The war for socialism in the 30s in Europe pitted the Communist (Soviet-instigated) Party and the national parties of either Italy or Germany, or Spain (etc).
In those countries, the non-Soviet socialism won. The Soviets got mad and termed Nazi Germany and Italian Fascism “right wing.” But really they were just left-wing socialists, in tight with corporations just as much as the Soviets were.
The internet likes to use spurious quotes and term things fascism as though the brand were somehow distinct from other brands of socialism.
The far right usually tends towards monopoly (usually w/ state assistance and/or blessing). The far left tends towards total state ownership.
Either way, as a private citizen- you are equally fsked. Either way you, a private citizen, becomes a slave. And if you can’t agree that we the citizens are being fsked this very moment (bailouts to the tune of several Trillion dollars), then you are not dealing in reality.
I didn’t mean to sound confrontational ronin. My apologizes.
But yes, this is not the idea I had in mind of a so-called “Free Society”: Pay the government for government’s sake…or pay the government so they can in turn give it to global corporations. And on top of that, the threat of outsourcing your job to China in the name of “Globalism”…yes, the average working person in this country is getting totally raped.
Maybe we can coin our own term for it. My particular choice is not fit for print.
Mein Kampf right from the horses mouth.
Very disjointed and difficult to read but there is no doubt about Hitler’s belief in unions and socialism.
http://www.hitler.org/writings/Mein_Kampf/
I don’t want to know how much it would cost Uncle Sugar if one of the three went down in flames.
“Orderly bankruptcy” is a misnomer to me…
@TheRealAutoGuy
Your homework assignment:
Examine and document all the taxbreaks, government investments, government purchases, and whatever else you enumerated about those other companies. Apply this to the D3.
The facts will illustrate the playing field is pretty damn level. One gets some here, the other guy gets some there.
Very Rovian to just put out a ridiculous allegation, and just hope people will not fact check it. Hey, (sadly) it does work. But when you actually add the numbers, the conclusion is that the D3 have gotten more than a lot over the last 50+ years.
Sure the ‘transplants’ make political donations. Funny thing is, if you look at the amounts, the D3 outspent all the transplants combined.
(Thanks to Mr. Schreiber for the link to a website that lists all those political contributions.)
While I oppose bailouts in general, and do realize that this is an automotive site, everyone does realize that this all together is just over half of AIG’s first bailout, a company that WSJ says will be as bankrupt as Chrysler in 2009. My point is that my disgust lies with the government here, not GM or Chrysler.
I differ to beg. No one held a gun to their head and said, hit up Uncle Sam. They could have taken their medicine and filed for C11. Management’s behavior– their willingness to kow-tow to Uncle Sam to avoid accountability– is reprehensible,
“They could have taken their medicine and filed for C11.”
now wouldn’t that have been something. think the country and consumers would have rallied behind one of the Big3 had they decided to do the bankruptcy thing – could’ve called themselves the real american car company or somesuch.
everyone does realize that this all together is just over half of AIG’s first bailout
Comparing bailouts is bound to fail. They are not equivalent.
It’s hard to imagine what would have happened to the world economy should AIG have been allowed to collapse. It is the holder of a STAGGERING amount of credit default swaps. How would you like your house to be worth half, or less?
A point never corrected by Detroit apologists requesting auto bailout funds be referred to as “loans”, is that the financial bailouts are equity which Governments all around the world expect to sell back to private enterprise recovering their “investment”. (Sometime in the distant future anyway).
Over-sight of those early funds is a different and more difficult question that clearly receives a Fail grade.
“Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power.” – Benito Mussolini.
Yup, the dream of the Republican since Reagan. Dubya finally made it all come true. Elimination of Consitutional protections and the Bill of Rights. Check. Destruction of fiscal responsibility. Check. Unprovoked wars of aggression. Check.