All the bad news is available at GM’s media page. All of GM’s brands were down by at least 50 percent, except for Pontiac which squeaked out a 40 percent drop. Buick sold fewer cars this month than it sold LaCrosses in February of ’08. CTS was the only Cadillac that sold over 1k units this month, and at 3,259, it sold at over double the rate of all other Caddys combined. The Malibu has finally outsold the Impala, as ‘bu sales dropped 3.7 percent to the ’pala’s 67.7 percent. Pontiac sold only 80 G3 Aveo clones, although solid (down 4.8 percent) Vibe sales kept the division’s average at a 39.2 percent drop. Saab sold fewer than 500 vehicles, and the canceled Astra is the only bright spot in the Saturn lineup. Astra sales have increased since it was canceled in December.
Wow, so bad that we don’t even get an ironic picture!
Keep it that way; it fits.
Don’t declare bankruptcy – and a new dawn (marketing wise) because people won’t buy from a broke manufacturer.
No wait – they’ve already stopped.
They’re launching the 2010 Camaro this month?
Anyone else catch that?
“By the end of 1936, General Motors not only was the largest of American corporations, but by vitrue of its success had become independent of Wall Street financing.”
— “Chrome Colossus”
this in the midst of a Depression. what a difference real management brings to the table. and the Board continuies to support Red Ink Rick.
Ferrygeist :
March 3rd, 2009 at 2:11 pm
Wow, so bad that we don’t even get an ironic picture!
http://noreah.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/lemmings_by_colgan.jpg
Man those are some ugly, ugly numbers.
TrueDelta’s doing better than ever lately. I can only imagine how well we’d be doing if people were actually shopping for cars. One impact we are feeling: not many people are enrolling 2009s.
Michael, I’m not surprised that few are enrolling 2009’s.
I hope I’m wrong but if this keeps up, we’re going to have our “1932” a year earlier than I expected.
(1929 mostly pre-depression car sales had collapsed down to one quarter of that number of annual sales by 1932, in the depths of the last Great Depression).
I expected 2010 to be our “1932” but it might just be 2009.
That would mean an annualized auto sales figure down from 2007’s 17 million, of 4.25 million, if the trend were identical (which it won’t be, of course).
Clearly, if this becomes a worldwide trend, then by 2012, there might be 1/2 dozen auto manufacturers surviving. World-wide.
Toyota-Lexus-Scion-Subaru-Hino-Daihatsu group
Hyundai-Kia group
Suzuki-Maruti maybe merged in with Mitsubishi and PSA group (unless India’s economy ceases to function)
Honda-Acura group
Volkswagen-Audi-Porsche group
Ford supported by the US taxpayers (with WTO and the EU screaming “foul” at the tops of their lungs)
Stein: that’s great!
I’m actually quite happy with GMs sales.
Their new product is still moving very well. The Malibu moved 11K units while the Fusion only moved 7K.
GM’s fantastic Lambda SUVs sold a total of 15,557 units, while the CD3 twins from Ford (Edge and the Lincoln rebadge)only sold 6300 units.
The Tahoe sold 4500 units compared to the Expeditions pitiful 1500.
And the G8 had a very good month (for the G8) at 2700 units.
So are fleet sales good or bad for GM?
A drop of 75% in fleet sales sure makes the overall numbers look bad.
But what is worse than 53%, is the fact that GM is now the number 3 manufacturer in Canada, behind Ford and Chrysler.
Happy with the sales? The Impala is down 66%… that is terrible. The Impala isn’t a great car, but it is a very profitable one for them. Or was.
Hey TTAC… How ’bout a post noting that Subaru’s February sales are up 5.6 percent?
Their new product is still moving very well. The Malibu moved 11K units while the Fusion only moved 7K.
How many Camcords were sold? Wasn’t the ‘bu pimped as being better than the “gold standard” sedans from Honda and Toyota? I don’t give a damn if Chevy can outsell Ford from month to month, they aren’t the competition that’s killing them and that’s what has been wrong with thinking at the D2.8 for far too many years. GM lives in a market place with many competitors from all across the globe, not their cross town rivals. Don’t talk to me until the ‘bu has sales rivaling the Camry or Accord. I won’t hold my breath it’ll ever happen.
The latest to be forced into early retirement? The phrase ‘Well, it can’t get any worse’
But what is worse than 53%, is the fact that GM is now the number 3 manufacturer in Canada, behind Ford and Chrysler.
It just gets stranger. Canadians once again show off their legendary disposable income by crowning Chrysler their new (sales) king.
(No angry replies, please. Read this in the facetious manner in which it was written. By the way, I’m Canadian).
http://www.desrosiers.ca/Monthly%20Updates/sales.pdf
the Malibu has 0% for 60 months and the Fusion doesn’t.
GM takes the money from the gov’t and throws it down on 0% and when that’s gone they’ll go back and get some more of the guvmit money. The Fusions that Ford did sell they made money on, GM not.
@ 200k-min
Well, I think you need to rethink that statement a small bit. I can’t disagree with the fact that the Malibu has not outsold the CamCord twins. However, from a platform perspective, the ‘Bu, G6, and Aura trio combined did outsell both the Camry and Accord. Not by much, but they did.
I’m also surprised at the G8 sales figures. They were actually stronger than January by almost double. If they keep this rate up, 24,000 to 28,000 G8s isn’t an unreasonable yearly total.
Still, not pretty figures, but there are a few bright spots in the toilet.
And another thing, since when does Toyonda make roomier cars than GM?
Malibu/Camry/Accord
Front Shoulder Room (inches) 55.9 57.8 58.2
Rear Shoulder Room (inches) 53.9 56.9 56.4
Front Hip Room (inches) 53.0 54.6 56.6
Rear Hip Room (inches) 52.1 53.9 54.3
(Polk)
(yes, I know that the Impala’s a roomier car than all of them, but that’s not what GM’s hawking anymore. Plus it’s out of date)
I’m surprised the sales figures are only down 50 percent.
RACEBEER-now divide the GM midsize platform sales by the number of dealers, do the same with the Camcords and subtract all the fleet sales.
You’ll have a better idea of who is reaching the public.
Just a thought,
Bunter
GM only sold 1087 hybrid vehicles in February, less than 1% of total sales. I’ll bet every one of them is a money-loser. There is no way they’re close to reaching economies of scale with that volume, which is why Chrysler killed off the Aspen and Durango hybrids.
Gee, maybe it’s the ridiculous price premiums they charge to be ‘green’?
As for Pontiac’s ‘only’ 40% decline, maybe that’s because they’re already close to bottom.
@86er:
Malibu interior volume: 95 cubic feet (per EPA)
Impala: 105 cf
Prius: 96 cf (outgoing model)
Camry: 101 cf
Sonata: 105 cf
Accord: 106 cf (per manufacturer)
Avalon: 107 cf
Taurus: 108 cf
qslippy,
Well, wasn’t Chrysler buying the 2-mode transmissions from GM, just as needed? They had far less in the way of fixed costs, I believe. If GM closes the program, they get to write off another “asset” and magnify their losses even further, I would guess.(*)
Of coursse, seeing as to how swell these weren’t moving for GM, it’s a wonder Chrysler bothered to do it at all.
(*) – on the other hand, they’ve lost so much money… what’s another billion?
@ Bunter1
I agree that per dealer sales don’t compare, but that wasn’t the point. Given the current demand (or lack thereof….), GM has way too many dealers, but that’s not something that is going to change soon due to the may issues discussed previously on this forum. I was just pointing out that the platform overall was comparable in sales and not nearly as bad as portrayed.
But point taken …….
Re Chrysler Canadian domestic sales King.
The reason for this is simple. Chrysler is practically giving cars away unlike GM at this point. You can get a minivan for $20k CDN on the road.
A question – 35% is “slide”, 48% is “tank” but 52% is “down”….. is TTAC giving up trying to get through to GM about how serious the situation is?
racebeer:
Well, I think you need to rethink that statement a small bit. I can’t disagree with the fact that the Malibu has not outsold the CamCord twins. However, from a platform perspective, the ‘Bu, G6, and Aura trio combined did outsell both the Camry and Accord. Not by much, but they did.
Please provide exactly numbers to back it up.
Oh, plz include Avalon and ES350 numbers, since we are talking about “platform” here.
does anyone have an asprin…..I have a headache
@ wsn
Camry 20634
Accord 15976
Malibu 11516
G6 8126
Aura 1508
total 21150
Avalon & ES350 don’t count. They are modifications of the platform, not just sheetmetal. With that logic, I should include the Highlander, Venza, and RX350 as well since they are offshoots of the Camry platform. However, all of those you listed don’t sell in the same segment as the Camry/Acccord/Malibu/G6/Aura.
Just trying to keep it apples to apples …..
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again…for how desparately BAD the situation is, the dealers are either in denial or pretending to be.
At least in my area (Southeastern PA), their dealing to move metal is no better than when things were rosy. With sales as bad as they are, you’d think that they would be discounting cars and trucks like crazy to just move the inventories. They are not. I don’t get it.
Kurt B,
That sounds more like “liquidation” than “sales.”
Richard Chen:
Malibu interior volume: 95 cubic feet (per EPA)
Impala: 105 cf
Prius: 96 cf (outgoing model)
Camry: 101 cf
Sonata: 105 cf
Accord: 106 cf [ed. non-sunroof model](per manufacturer)
Avalon: 107 cf
Taurus: 108 cf
I guess my point was that if you accept that an “American” car should be roomy in all respects, then the Camry and Accord would be more “American” than the Malibu. I find it weird that GM is pushing the Malibu as the direct competitor to the Camcord, in this respect.
I purposely excluded the traditional metrics of head/legroom, as everyone is pretty much competitive there. But in the good ol’ fashioned corn-fed (North) American tradition, a little hip and shoulder room makes all the difference.
On this site the relatively cramped nature of the Taurus has been noted, which while it has a spacious greenhouse (and lends to its 108 cf as per the EPA) the hip and shoulder room for this “full-sized” car is rather lacking, and the centre console limiting knee space doesn’t help.
A little prediction here.
IIRC the Malibu has beat the “odds” the last few months while the Imp is cratering faster than the market.
I think GM has switched the fleet emphasis to the ‘Bu and has the Imp ready to axe.
Look for the Imp plant to shutter (is that why Mickey’s buyout moved up 11 mo?) and ‘Bu fleet numbers at midyear to be 40-50 percent.
Racebeer-I do agree with your point on the excess number of dealers.
Bunter
So the dealers are supposed to lose money on each unit and make it up on volume?
racebeer :
March 3rd, 2009 at 4:36 pm
@ wsn
Camry 20634
Accord 15976
Malibu 11516
G6 8126
Aura 1508
total 21150
Avalon & ES350 don’t count. They are modifications of the platform, not just sheetmetal. With that logic, I should include the Highlander, Venza, and RX350 as well since they are offshoots of the Camry platform. However, all of those you listed don’t sell in the same segment as the Camry/Acccord/Malibu/G6/Aura.
I don’t see why they don’t count. For years, people (especially German fans) are saying ES is just a Camry XLE. It’s not even elongated like the Avalon! Tell me what’s the modification. Wheelbase? Same. Displacement? Same!.
Also, Avalon does compete with Camry and Accord, as a fact. Especially since Accord has up-sized recently.
Avalon isn’t more different from Camry V6 XLE than Aura is from G6.
BTW, one month’s sales figure doesn’t tell much. To prove your point, please provide figures for the past year, so fluctuations caused by 0% incentives are filtered out. Better yet, if we have figures for the past 4 years, then we can analyze a entire model cycle.
All of GM’s brands were down by at least 50 percent, except for Pontiac which squeaked out a 40 percent drop.
Interesting. Is cutting Pontiac as a brand a good idea after all?
Or is that Pontiac didn’t offer 0% last February?
the canceled Astra is the only bright spot in the Saturn lineup. Astra sales have increased
GM management at its best. The only car in the GM lineup that hasn’t tanked is a cancelled model from a brand that will be history in two years.
The new Consumer Reports Auto issue came in the mail today. The Saturn Astra got nice reviews and the Pontiac G8 got a fabulous review.
It’s interesting across all GM brands. The February 2008 sales of the Pontiac G6, Saab 9-3, Saturn Aura, Buick LaCrosse, and Cadillac CTS all outsold their entire respective brands (in terms of cars, not trucks) in February 2009.
“G6 8126”
I wonder how many of those are retail sales. The G6 doesn’t seem to be on many people’s radar at all.
“Overall, the number of cars and light trucks sold in Canada increased in February to 80,320, slightly besting the 76,900 sales seen the previous month.”
So, while sales increased slightly in Canada in February, GM slipped to #3 behind Chrysler and Ford. Not good.
the canceled Astra is the only bright spot in the Saturn lineup. Astra sales have increased
GM management at its best. The only car in the GM lineup that hasn’t tanked is a cancelled model from a brand that will be history in two years.
It’s the only product from GM that isn’t a flaming pile, and has a decent quality interior.
While we are adding to the CamCord numbers, don’t forget the TL.
I think the combined GM numbers actually illustrate the branding point. Rather than keeping the car as one model that outsells the Camcord (imagine those ads!) they can only say “well they are the same car”, thereby nullifying years of tring to convince the public that a Chebby/Poncho/etc. are different. And rather than seeing Malibus everywhere (free marketing) you rarely notice any Malibu, G6, or Aura even if you are looking for them.
I think this number merely reflect American companies being more truck and Suv dependant. If the market keeps it up a little cars will continue their comeback. And (surprising myself) at least in NA some of their cars are well positioned. If they can make any money or not on them is another question.
Down here after being number 2 for 40+ years, they’ve sunk back into number 3. And seem happy with that as there are no new products coming up and pretty much everybody now realizes just how old their powertrains are. I mean in the past they could get by by arguing that said powertrains were tested and true. Well, everybody else has moved on. I see no hope for them down here unless they modernize all their poerplants ASAP and don’t keep up their halfminded strategies of changing something here or there and changing the name on the engine and saying LOOK! BRAND NEW!! I mean, we’re backward and all, third world mongrels but as one Abe Lincoln once famously said, ” you can fool…”
Yo0u know the rest
the Malibu has 0% for 60 months and the Fusion doesn’t.
Plus I believe people are well aware of the new Fusion hitting dealers now….
Just trying to keep it apples to apples …..
But I have to agree with including at least the ES if not Highlander (and even Sienna). Very little platform mod IIRC. Isn’t the Malibu modded from the Aura platform?
GM is screwed. They got the ‘taint.
As the auto industry approaches collapse, one thing the feds should demand in exchange for any additional funding and even not pulling the funding they’ve already given is non-exclusive transferable licenses to all intellectual property the industry holds. Why? Because if they don’t, Asian companies might buy up patent portfolios from the wreckage and the US could find it very hard to build cars if we try to put the industry back together at some point.
Patent licenses should also be a requirement of any Federal funding of battery manufacturers. Otherwise we’ll probably end up with taxpayer money adding value to companies that are then snapped up by Asian companies or oil companies as apparently happened with NIMH batteries for transport applications.
Given that some people with money do probably just wander into Pontiac showrooms, and there are Buickman sales staffs out there that will sell them cars if given a chance … how many Pontiac G8s would you expect to sell, in a randomized “hey it’s a [family sedan] car” type of world?
Why should US auto sales be any different. Check your closet. No clothes are made in the US. Around your house…..all electronics are made in the Orient. Most of our vegetables are from South America and Mexico. Shoes from China, and it doesn’t matter if there from WalMart or Sharpers Image. Generic medicine from India. Sporting equipment from the Philippines and China. And now our gun manufactures Winchester, Smith&Wesson, Colt and Ruger are buying guns made in Czechoslovakia, Argentina and Russia. What it boils down to is the greed of US manufactures and us, the consumer, to save the almighty buck, have sold out our country. We deserve everything that’s going to happen to us.
GM always cancels their nicest models. Witness the end of the Oldsmobile Intrigue and Aurora. When they get them right, they die. GM hates success.
Why should US auto sales be any different. Check your closet. No clothes are made in the US. Around your house…..all electronics are made in the Orient….. What it boils down to is the greed of US manufactures and us, the consumer, to save the almighty buck, have sold out our country. We deserve everything that’s going to happen to us.
jester, I tend to agree with you on most of what you said. Wal-Mart isn’t successful for selling quality merchandise, they are a success for selling cheap junk. The American lower-middle class is a massive spending block. That said, I tend to prefer to buy quality products and buy them once. Example, I recently needed a new frying pan. Rather than buy a $9.99 made in China craptastic thing from Wal-Mart I went and bought a nearly $100 dollar Made in USA All-Clad pan. I should never need another one in my life.
When I was shopping for a vehicle years ago I cross shopped the Malibu, (old) Taurus, Camry, Accord, Altima, etc. Eventually settled on the Accord because it was on the high end for overall quality. For that I paid several thousand more than an equivalent Ford or Chevy. Over 200k miles later I think that extra $$$ has paid me back ten fold.
The American consumer ditching Detroit metal for transplants is a sign that they do care about quality. Wal-Mart might be able to get away with fooling the consumer on cheap frying pans, but GM doesn’t have the same leverage on what for most people is their second largest purchase behind their homes.
@86er: I guess some things haven’t changed with GM not widening the EU-based vehicles for the US market. I recall sitting in the back seat of a Saturn L-series at an auto show back in 2001, along with the Mrs. and a friend. None of us are particularly large people, yet it was a tight squeeze. Perhaps the new LaCrosse addresses this issue.
Of course, the proverbial American car had long before morphed into the Explorer and its SUV counterparts.
In economic terms we’ve been doing the equivalent of busting up the antique furniture, selling it for firewood and using the proceeds to buy cheap plastic replacement furniture. Only thing is, we’ve sold off pretty much everything that actually produces stuff outside the auto and aerospace/defense industries. The auto industry will almost certainly fold this year–suppliers will go even if Ford and GM are theoretically still around. And who is going to pay for all of those cool airplanes and other military items when the tax base is shot? And who is going to lend us money to buy all of that foreign made stuff when it is obvious that we’ll never be able to pay it back?
I’m not saying we should bail out the car companies in their current form. I’m saying don’t lose the ability for US companies to build cars in the future. Eventually we’re going to have to either revive manufacturing in this country or accept a much lower standard of living. Right now China, Japan, etc are sending us stuff in exchange for dollars. They already have so many dollars they have no clue what to do with them. They’re keeping on accepting them because if they stop the export-oriented industries they’ve built up tank. But as the value of their dollar denominated investments tank it gets harder and harder to justify sending us stuff in exchange for paper. It will end at some point and a that point we’ll need to be able to build stuff on our own.