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Volvo motors last longer than Jeep motors?
They call THAT a clunker? Talk about destroying a perfectly good car…
Yeah, that looked to me like a basically new car.
It got a little stressful when the car started making noises that sounded like whining/crying. Poor volvo.
Absolute stupidity, all so they can get a gov’t subsidized hybrid. Of course, parking a Prius is so much more trendy than a Volvo in the faculty parking lot. My coworkers are such-dumbasses….
Painful to watch. Couldn’t the previous owner have sold it used and got quite a bit more than $4500? I bet that S80 could’ve found a buyer for 8 grand or so…
So after watching this Volvo video, the Jeep video and an Olds Aurora Northstar video on YouTube, it seems that these videos will really tell which manufacturers make the best motors.
The Olds dies barely more than 1 minute in, The Jeeps lasts more than 2 minutes and the Volvo hangs on for about 4 minutes. Hmm.
Anyone with a Ford video?
I’m reposting this from the other thread in reference to this video that Ohsnapback posted.
Ohsnapback:
As a car lover and engineer, that video actually brought a tear to my eye and angered me more than I thought it would. The whole CARS program seemed detestable to me, but now having seen the fruits of this misguided attempt to provide economic stimulus, I’m almost disgusted beyond words.
I couldn’t believe my eyes when I read the “disabling procedure”, and now seeing in action has made me see red.
I like to believe that cars have a soul (however illogical that seems) and that this will somehow come to bite the creators of such a stupid program in the ass.
Honestly, watching that video was like watching somebody kick a puppy. I almost wish that Volvo would have erupted into a giant ball of flames just to make people think twice about such a stupid program.
Can’t be true. Car does not get 18 mpg or less.
Robert,
This isn’t really “clunkercide.”
This is more “clunkenasia” – or – “auto-Kevorkioration” (he IS a Michigander).
Maybe…”autobortion.” That’ll make the natives restless!
Why didn’t he just sell it? It would get more than the rebate! Stupid. The Jeep Cherokee one didn’t bother me in the least, though.
So a perfectly lovely Volvo is sacrificed so someone who couldn’t otherwise afford a new car can get $3,500 off a Cobalt XFE?
Great, and what loser is paying $1B — wait, now its $3B — for this?
Not good.
I just really want to know why the dealer didn’t treat this as a normal trade. The dealer is to blame here.
Steven is correct about the MPGs. Is this really a Cash for Clunkers car? Also, it is nice that all of the people complaining about this car being killed knows its history. How is that transmission? Have Volvo’s costly repairs pissed off the owners enough to kill it? Was the passenger’s side rear smashed up? It seemed that people only started to like some of these cars — from what I have read about the “love” for used FWD Volvos by most commentators on this site– when the government started paying money for them.
Remember, with every “good” used car taken off the streets, your well taken care of used car increases in value.
The more I see of this program in action, the angrier I get.
That car is cherry.
This CARS program, to have been intelligently designed and implemented, IF one believes it can accomplish any good under any circumstance, should have been limited to cars that had more than 120,000 miles (or more), fuel economy of less than 15mpg combined, and/or salvage titles.
Even then, many owners who value ‘value,’ wouldn’t have been bribed by taxpayer cash, if their ride was reliable.
Not only that, but this program is going to hurt charities and the working poor, as many of these perfectly reliable and dependable cars are destroyed senselessly, which will create a shortage for charities, and higher used car prices for the working poor who would’ve been able to afford these cars.
What a disgusting boondoggle of a FUBAR piece of legislation.
I am finding it easier and easier with each passing minute to dislike our current administration.
God I wish I could have my vote back.
Best Volvo advertising in years!
What a waste. Yeah, it’s illogical, but the wanton destruction of perfectly good machinery really bugs me. I would not use these examples of who’s engine can take more abuse than the other. The Volvo seems to last longer than the others, but the Volvo also looks like it has the fewest miles and was the best maintained. I can’t even see why this Volvo had to face this crap. There are plenty of car engines being grenaded on Youtube…many go out with more drama than this.
Wow. They buy the thing from the owner for the $4500 and stand to make double that possibly. Frenzy on both sides. If I were one of those employees I’d have cut a side deal with the C80’s owner for a clean $5K.
Edit:
“Edward Niedermeyer : Best Volvo advertising in years!”
Indeed. Being in the market, this has me now waffling between Mazda and Volvo!
According to the poster of the vid on YouTube, the car had 90,000 miles and its wholesale value was $4200. The owner recvd. $4,500 rebate + $200 scrap value.
I’d do it.
Like I posted before, it’s just an engine. It’s not a puppy!
The shredding provision states, “The entity crushing or shredding the vehicles in this manner will be allowed to sell some parts of the vehicle prior to crushing or shredding it, but these parts cannot include the engine or the drive train.”
Basically, the Volvo’s nav system, airbags, seats, interior trim, computer, etc., may be stripped and its “soul” may live on to give “life” to another Volvo.
@ohsnapback,
Hurt charities?!!!
Wait until this sob eliminates your deduction to charitable 501(c)3 organizations doing good in the world – like the one I run – so that his Kruschevian apparatchiks can tell your doctor that you no-longer contribute enough to society to have bypass surgery.
Wait for that! It’s on the way!
P71 Crownvic, you are the first person who I’ve come across that is man (or woman if that be the case) to admit that. I salute you.
A picture is worth 1000 words, P71 Crownvic.
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2009/07/obamas_revealing_body_language.html
You may cringe to read this, but you may as well get it over with.
http://www.thereturnofscipio.com/?p=2545
Be aware, there are a LOT of us out in America who are VERY angry.
Gerald Celente speaks of these people when he says “people who have nothing to lose – lose it.”
As for the Volvo, I couldn’t even watch.
Yes, dgduris, it is on the way. Then the drek hits the air recirculating device.
Some people laugh at this guy, but listen anyway. There is some truth to his
rant.
http://patriotroom.com/article/david-manning-ph-d-calls-obama-a-socialist–communist–marxist-freak
This is the first time I have been icensed by watching a Cash For Clunkers video. I saw the Jeep Cherokee, and wasn’t really bothered because it was what I expected a Cash for Clunkers car to be. I wasn’t even bothered by the Olds Aurora either (and I the Aurora is one of my favorite cars), because it had more than 200K miles, no AC and appeared to have a variety of electrical problems, so it was a true “clunker”. But this is just, just [i]siiiiicccccck[/i]. This Volvo S80 is too new and it was worth at least twice the voucher.
Did the RNC Blast Fax tell every body to talk about healthcare whenever cash for clunkers is brought up?
Don’t use fax machines.
Don’t use paper: need the trees to suck-up CO2 and output O2 so we can continue to drive our giant SUVs and run over snail darters!
Even take plastic bags into Whole Foods…just to enraged the multiply-pierced tree-huggers…with their dead tree grocery transport units.
;-)
You people assume that the engine in that Volvo wasn’t a complete POS before it was spiked. A friend who owned one will probably watch that video over and over and smile every time. Cost him more time and money than the VWs he had previously – ECU, throttle body, other things, repeatedly. I learned to stay away from anything he liked.
What’s more appalling to me is that all these cars seem relatively intact.
If I had a clunker to trade in, it’d show up at the dealer fully running, but rolling on four compact spares and missing just about anything I could unbolt. I might cut the top off and roll around with a helmet for awhile too.
Seriously, what’s a set of Volvo headlamps and tails worth, anyways? Gotta be quite a bit.
I don’t think the RNC had much to do with anything. When the tit of government is exposed, very predictable things happen. Read some of the previous TTAC posts prior to C4C going into effect (or other source’s analysis, for that matter) and people pointed out pretty much what will and is happening.
What can volvo add?
Volvo is very sad this evening.
Stupid Volvo owners. Those alloy wheels have got to be worth a bit, bumpers, lights etc etc. Have these folk not heard of Craisglist?
The hood struts obviously no good on this car. Definitely a clunker. /sarcasm
As a Prius hater, it’s a pity they’re not clunkers. I would happily celebrate the death of every Prius taken off the road.
I don’t think the RNC had much to do with anything.
Right. Everyone bringing up health care in every single C4C post was just a coincidence.
What are the odss if I go over to Rush Limbaughs site right now, that I will see C4C and the health care bill mentioned in the same breath?
***goes to Rushlimbaugh.com***
Well, well, well, whats the first thing I see?
http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/home/daily/site_073109/content/01125107.guest.html
Re. the value of the Volvo.
I went to truedelta.com to look for data.
None presented for S80s, but he has S60 data. Every year (2001, 2004, 2005, 2006) the repair trips per year is in the red (frequent) zone.
Only 2002 is in the green zone. There is no data for 2003 models.
So, this thing was probably a POS anyway – though that makes it no-less attractive to look at…or to feel sorry for.
Those links really say that? That’s Timothy McVeigh/Eric Rudolph territory, and that’s not hyperbole.
Absolutely disgusting, on many different levels.
@Slare & Lee:
That’s exactly what I was thinking.
If you are giving up a car to get grenaded and shredded, at least strip out some valuable parts and take off your nice looking alloy wheels.
The car only had 90K miles so I bet lots of interior trim pieces were in good shape too.
I am truly troubled by some of the links to other sites.
What does Limbaugh have to do with anything? Abre los ojos.
I’m not defending anyone here.
“This Volvo S80 is too new and it was worth at least twice the voucher.”
I doubt it. Both the customer and the dealer would have to be complete idiots to scrap the car for a lesser value than it is worth intact. That Volvo may have had a bad tranny, toasted turbos or some other very expensive problem which isn’t obvious in the video. The good body parts will in fact be available to salvage at the scrap yard; assuming there is sufficient market demand to make it worthwhile for the scrap yard to pull them. Scrap yards make the decision on what to pull and what to crush every day. It is what they do. Most people don’t have the time and/or interest to part out their own car on ebay or craigslist.
What does Limbaugh have to do with anything?
What does the healthcare bill have to do with cars?
I didn’t start is all I’m sayin’! *whistles*
So that’s why I’m a Ford guy.
I’m impressed with the engine, not so much with the miserable resale value. That car doesn’t have any rust on it. The death throes of the Jeep were more manly.
They should have done that to the Excursion sitting next to it.
I couldn’t believe my eyes when I read the “disabling procedure”, and now seeing in action has made me see red.
I have a ‘clunker\'(150k, less that $1k trade in [oh my, that was a surprise!], 16 mpg), and earlier this week started poking around about replacing it with something more economical/modern/fun. But to know it would be put down makes me shiver. No way.
My last ride trotted off to South America with 250k on it, still a little spring in it’s step. And I waved goodbye with $2k in my hand.
I love car destruction videos.
This one sounded like it had a bad turbo, from all the whining it made.
Sure it looks like it’s in great shape…but judging by earlier comments, it might just be that it needs $4500 of repairs.
…and I giggled at the end.
Menno:
P71 Crownvic, you are the first person who I’ve come across that is man (or woman if that be the case) to admit that. I salute you.
Thanks!
I gotta say though, I got caught up in the “hoopla”. I thought I was doing the right thing. We had eight years of the same policies…and the MSM would lead you to believe that they were the wrong policies. Now, I will flat out say that I didn’t agree with a lot of what GHWB did…and I thought the only way was up.
But here we are now, spending BILLIONS on this C4C pile of legislation, billions in failed stimulus…and these are the same people that want to “figure out” our health care?
And then we have Joe Biden out there saying that the only way to avoid bankruptcy, is for the Govt. to spend money. HELLO????? In what sick, twisted world does that make sense?
Well, well, well, whats the first thing I see?
The truth????
And how inept our new administration really is.
I thought Rush, Hannity, etc were nut jobs as well…then I listened to them and processed what they were saying.
They make TONS of sense…common sense. They say what needs to be said. They are the only voice of common sense and truth in today’s left-wing, “Messiah” media world.
I like how the Volvo spit its oil out at the end. A noble machine showing its contempt for retrograde humans taking part in such a stupid and destructive program!
Areitu :
This one sounded like it had a bad turbo, from all the whining it made.
No surprise there considering the bearings were being lubricated with shards of glass.
It´s not that the Volvo engine is better than the Jeep´s.
Hear the audio close to the end and the guy says “It spewed out all the oil”, and a large oil stain can be seen in front of the vehicle.
This jackass did not dispose of the oil first, they added the engine poison to the engine oil so the engine managed to last longer.
I´d like to take that Volvo and put a Mopar engine on it :)
I thought of something.
I know this wouldn’t work on every car, but instead of doing this sort of euthanization process, why don’t they just take the timing belt/chain off, turn on the car and smash the pedal?
I feel like that might take less time to demolish an engine.
wow…this discussion has turned….interesting. Cars have souls, cars are puppies, etc, etc…
Cars don’t have souls.
Cars are not puppies.
Nearly every economist believes this is the one govt program that is actually stimulating – multipliers upon multipliers.
And I voted for McCain.
Here’s what concerns me about this God-forsaken, idiot program.
1) Let’s think about where all these compacted cars are going end up. Landfill? Most likely…possibly leaching some form of toxins into precious soil. What do the Eco-Nazis have to say about THAT? Why not DONATE these cars to charitable organizations? How about having unemployed mechanics from all those shut-down dealerships RECONDITION the better ones and give them to families who can’t afford ’em? Nope, Obama and his jackboot Democrat House and Senate’s vision is one very FAR removed from reality.
2) Let’s think about a government so remarkably inept that it can’t properly administer the plan, then pulls another TWO BILLION DOLLARS out of taxpayers’ pockets without asking. Whatever happened to representative government?
3) What happens if/when the owners of all these bright, shiny new fuel-efficient rides lose their jobs because of an economy that can no longer support manufacturing like the good old days? Harley Davidson (two thousand jobs) and Mercury Marine (two thousand more) come to mind. Who gets stuck when they can’t pay THEIR loans? And don’t think the job losses are slowing down. Like Patrick Swayze said in “Roadhouse,” “You ain’t seen bad yet!”
As an owner of a 1998 Trooper hovering at 200k, I’ll be damned if I’m gonna let some dealership goons kill a trusted friend that’s gotten me through 11 horrendous Wisconsin winters, hauled me and my dogs on hunting trips, carried neighbors and girlfriends to safety and has coursed the waters of freak Spring flash flooding. Ain’t gonna happen. I agree with Earmiller – cars have a soul and my Trooper just happens to have one identical to every Golden Retriever I’ve had. Dependable, strong, vigilant, comforting and fearless. I’ll know when it’s time to donate it and let someone else find worth in it.
This program sucks from the word ‘go.’ Watching these videos turns my stomach. Even if these vehicles went to a boneyard, the most valuable part – the engine – can’t be sold. The poor suffer because the lack of cheap rides diminishes. Charities suffer. This program is further proof that Emporer has no clothes. He’s an empty suit and an idiot. If you can honestly say that you trust the Government to administer a health plan after seeing this wreck of a program in action, I hope they don’t start pouring liquid glass down your gullet for end-of-life care.
Deal with it. Obama is the WORST President this country has ever seen and he’s leading it into the toilet. When 2010 rolls around, payback is gonna be sweet.
Wow, this was a shocker. It seemed like the turbo was fine in the beginning, and only dies after that glass caught up with it. Man it sounded horrible. I’m not saying cars have a soul or anything, but it still makes me sad in the same way the old Detroit train station does. Good things that cost money to build should not be destroyed like this.
2Goldens:
When 2010 rolls around, payback is gonna be sweet.
Democrats and Republicans have been the ONLY two parties running the show since the get-go, and BOTH are responsible for basically running things into the ground economically. So I guess you so-called conservatives would be fat, dumb, and happy with a Republican in office – and you so-called liberals would be fat, dumb, and happy with a Democrat in office.
It’s time to give third parties a shot. Watching the Democrats and Republicans in action is akin to watching the Big Two (GM and Chrysler) in action. And we ALL know what eventually transpired.
“Democrats and Republicans (liberals and conservatives) – First-world prosperity for themselves, third-world prosperity for the rest of us…”
C4C is simply bad public policy enacted with Obama’s push that it would stimulate the economy, take polluters off the road and of course, JOBS!
This policy is a complete failure from A to Z.
How is it that people actually voted for this piece of roadkill legislation?
All the love in the world for Obama won’t change the fact that he is yet again supporting ineffective public policy.
Did he ever actually take a class in Econ?
“Nearly every economist believes this is the one govt program that is actually stimulating”
Nonsense. One academic economist (Blinder from Princeton) does not count as ‘nearly all.’
That’s one thing wrong with academics; they love to come up with complicated reasons and theories that run counter to common sense.
Yes, this is *not* music to a pistonhead’s ears.
I sense that anyone who posts these “auto-youth-in-asia” videos is opposed to the C4C program not because they’re destroying “perfectly good” machinery, but because C4C is working as intended.
And if Rush Limburger doesn’t like it, it must be good.
I’m not a fan of cash for clunkers, but people need some perspective.
It is the most effective $1 billion dollars that has been spent on helping the auto industry (and it is very narrowly tailored to help companies building in the US without violating trade law).
Who gives a damn about this Volvo. At most the government issued a $4500 credit for it, and more likely a $3500 credit. And whoever owned it BOUGHT a NEW car. That is the point of the program.
It’s not even aesthetically displeasing since this is just a FWD Volvo, not a classic RWD one. The engine may have lasted 20 more years, but the car wouldn’t have.
And stop pissing and moaning about the election. Do you think McCain would have vetoed cash for clunkers? No, he would not have.
Hell, the only reason that this pisses conservatives off is that 1) Obama signed it into law, and 2) it’s a government check instead of a tax credit (basically the same thing, except some people would not be able to fully use the credit).
Do all of you know that right now first time buyers are getting an $8,000 tax credit if they buy a new, or, much more likely, USED house. That program is massively more expensive than cash for clunkers, and all it does is create jobs for the mortgage brokers and realtors that helped create this mess. At least buying a NEW car creates jobs for engineers, designers, technicians and assemblers.
menno: I went to Patriotroom in your link. I am not so thrilled with Obama right now either, though if taking my vote back meant it would have gone for McCain, well I’m still ok with having rest where I cast it. Anyway: Patriotroom. I usually do go links like this when posted in the comments. But the first thing I do after I click on the link is to go to the site’s home page and read the “About Us” before I read the article. If you go to he Patriotroom’s home page and read the “About Us”, the very first sentence talks about links to Bill O’Reilly and Rush Limbaugh web sites. That tells all I need to know. No Kool Aid in the morning, thanks. The actual video starts off with “red blooded, god fearing, Jesus loving Americans rising up and not taking it anymore…” Please. I tried to listen to the whole thing but I just couldn’t.
EDIT:
Noslushbox:
If I remove my illogical emotional sentiment to inanimate objects, what you just posted above is 100 percent correct. And yes, anything that is from this administration is going to be viewed as poison by the right. Funny, when it is a tax break for the wealthy (say 15% capital gains vs payroll tax that average people pay) it is ok by the Rush crowd. The rich create jobs, they say. Well, this program gives to everybody who buys a car and does create jobs (not in the way I really approve of) but, hey as a past president once said: Potato chips or computer chips…
2goldens:
I hope you are not so hostile in front of your Retrievers…next time you are so angry, sit down with your best friend’s head squeezed between your legs and scratch behind his/her ears and feel your anger dissipate…I do, however, share your bond with your vehicle. That is something that can’t be explained to the people who churn through cars…a connection like that is made over years of ownership, and yeah, it does take more than 80,000 miles to create. Every long term vehicle I have had was an emotional breakup when it had to go…
Hi golden2husky. See vento97’s comments, they make perfect sense. At least to me, a person who’s been saying “neither the Republicans nor the Democrats have the interests of the people at heart any more” for oh, 30 years. Not that hardly anyone has listened. But people are starting to surmise the same thing on their own.
You can lead a horse to water but you can’t make them drink, comes to mind…
Personally, I won’t vote for a) any incumbents b) anyone on a ticket with only one party respresented (yeah, this happens in my area – a rural Republican county smack dab against an ultra-liberal Democratic county) c) judges (since they are not judges, they act as admiralties)
As for what party I vote for? I used to vote Libertarian until they went off their rocker, now I vote Constitution Party (US Taxpayer Party in Michigan since the Mich. Secretary of State “refused” to let them change their name 8 years ago as the rest of the state parties did in all the other states). Perhaps John McCain would have been running under the “Whig” party in Michigan had we had the same types of imbeciles in office 140 years ago…
The point is, you don’t HAVE to vote for the lesser of two evils (which results in what? Evil). You CAN vote you conscience, whether it is Independent Party (I truly admired Ambassador Alan Keyes who ran on that ticket for Prez – but his party didn’t appear on my ballet) and Reform Party (the party started by Perot – who was, by the way RIGHT when he said that NAFTA would kill this country).
Just like choosing what make of car you like, you can actually go do research and find out what political party ‘out there’ most closely represents what you want and what your needs are. Then vote for them.
I think of two things when watching C4C euthanasia videos: Jackass and the scene from 2001: A Space Odyssey as HAL is being disconnected (“Just what do you thing you’re doing, Dave?”).
The former because of what seems to be wanton destruction (especially in this case since the vehicle looks to be in really good shape, even though it may, in fact, be an unreliable lemon) and that it’s relatively obvious the idiots performing the procedure aren’t doing it right – they’re not draining the crankcase and simply dumping the silicate solution into the oil filler opening, prolonging the whole affair needlessly.
The latter because it’s a man-made, mechanical device that exhibits plaintive, anthropomorphic qualities as it’s being destroyed.
The crux of the issue is that, as TTAC-reading ‘motorheads’, the engineering and design of automotive engines (and mechanical devices, in general) holds more meaning to, say, the average slob that sees his ride as little more than a transportation appliance.
Does the C4C program prohibit the re-use of anything other than the engine? If the intent was to make the entire vehicle unserviceable, why would they waste the time and effort to disable just the engine instead of the much simpler (and likely cheaper) method of sending the whole car to a crusher?
If you take the energy needed to build a new car, the C4C program makes no sense, even if you leave the old car still running till it expires naturally.
ethanol all over again. Feels good but the long term not so much (hey that works for people too !)
Cars are metal. They don’t have souls, save a few old vettes :)
Oh, my gosh. I am appalled at the COMMENTS, not the video.
“That car is cherry.”
“…I couldn’t even watch.”
“…though that makes it no-less attractive to look at…or to feel sorry for.”
etc. ad nauseam
THIS IS A MASS-PRODUCED, NON-LIVING COMMODITY PRODUCT!! This is not a human! It is not a living being! It doesn’t love anyone! It is not smiling! It has no emotions! It is not crying!
How can you “feel sorry” for a hunk of metal? How do you get emotional at an engine seizing?
Do you types have funerals for alternators? Do you weep over a blown compressor?
Geez!!!
IT’S JUST A MECHANICALLY UNSOUND CAR WITH A NICE PAINT JOB!
Now if you want to talk about how this program is really more pork for automakers, then we’re on! But feeling sorry for a HUNK OF METAL, GLASS, AND RUBBER? Come on!
This is a big waste of financial, natural, and human resources.
It’s unconscionable.
These cars are already built; they did not require the same amount of additional natural resources (or even funding or labor) to keep them going that they did for original construction.
We truly are morally bankrupt, to be wasting like this…
The reason why so many apparently good cars are getting clunked is very simple. New car dealers, who don’t want any used car more than 4 years old on their lots, are determining the suitability of tradeins for CFC based on the book TRADE-IN value, not the retail value, and don’t forget the “book” is written by industry insiders who know the new car dealers don’t keep older trades.
A specific example will illustrate. Let’s consider a 1994 Cadillac Fleetwood Brougham (RWD) with 40,000 miles. That would not just be a “cherry car”; it would be a prize in the hands of a Cadillac collector. Smart Caddy collectors are already snapping these up and putting them away; the good ones are getting hard to find even before CFC came on the scene. But there are a lot of these still in the hands of ordinary folks who might want to trade them in.
Go to the Kelley Blue Book CFC calculator site and it will tell you that the trade in value of that Caddy is $3875, so you will get more by murdering it.
However — the same KBB site will also tell you that the suggested dealer retail of the Fleetwood is $6885, and the private party retail is $5360. That range is probably realistic. Take a look at http://search.ebay.com/330344661027 which is a 1994 with 45K miles that was bid up to $5600 and did not meet reserve.
That beautiful car is a clunker. If that doesn’t make you physically ill, then you view cars as mere appliances, and I respect that, it’s your decision. But to the rest of us, that Brougham is the last of a breed and the idea that someone would crush it to get a few hundred bucks, and to save themselves the trouble of selling a car people would fight over to buy, is just sad.
(To avoid panic, I don’t mean that particular Caddy has been killed. I’m just using that listing to illustrate the point)
And if Rush Limburger doesn’t like it, it must be good.
+1
” it seems that these videos will really tell which manufacturers make the best motors.’
Uh, I would say that is flawed thinking. Unless you can verify that all 3 engines were driven and maintained EXACTLY the same way and driven in the same manner and used in the same climate and…
I posted this to Jalopnik about this S80:
The Volvo pictured is an S80 T6 (inline six, twin turbo). It has the Arakkis 17″ wheels, which, IIRC, weren’t available on the earliest models, so I’m guessing it’s a 2000 or 2001 model. The 2002 model got fully painted bumpers, so this one isn’t that recent.
I’d be willing to bet that the pictured car is a high-mileage model with a failing (or failed) automatic transmission. Volvo used a General Motors 4T65-E transmission in these cars (the Volvo version was called the 4T65-EV). The torque output of the T6 was very close to the upper limit for what a 4T65 can handle, and then Volvo had the good sense to neuter the transmission fluid cooling system. The end result is that the transmissions on the T6 S80s and XC90s tend to fail about every 50,000 miles. If the car has 100,000+ miles, scrapping it is probably a better “deal” than sinking a few grand into a transmission overhaul.
@willamettejd:
“Nearly every economist believes this is the one govt program that is actually stimulating”
Not so. It will delay the recovery of the automakers because these sales were artificially generated by the taxpayers. Once the nitrous flow stops, auto sales will have to resort to selling cars for real prices. This will generate an insatiable hunger by the automakers for more CFC funding.
And if CFC is such a great idea, why don’t we subsidize all sales for 2009, or forever? That way, apartment dwellers can help suburbanites get new cars more cheaply.
Nearly every economist believes this is the one govt program that is actually stimulating – multipliers upon multipliers.
Sure. Destroying wealth with taxpayer´s money is going to mak us richer. Makes sense. Sure it does.
Now, Ironic mode Off: I think that the (lets say a number) 1% of economists saying this program is complete madness is the 1% that is RIGHT.
The idea that producing a new car accounts for the majority of its life time energy consumption has been debunked numerous times. Most reports put the energy consumption from driving the vehicle at well over 70% of the total life time fuel consumption. Of course the actual vehicle in question makes a big difference.
Earlier today I had a look around the killing fields of a local modest sized Toyota dealer. Mostly I saw older pickup trucks and SUVs. Two older Lexuses, one Lincoln and one minivan as well. All told there were about 15-20 vehicles in the kill zone, 80%+ of which were trucks and SUVs. Of the whole lot only one was visually a reasonably clean vehicle: An early 1990s F150 with 186k miles on it. No telling what condition the mechanicals were in. That F150 was the only vehicle which nudged my WTH are they scrapping that thing for meter.
John Horner: “Earlier today I had a look around the killing fields of a local modest sized Toyota dealer.I was doing the same thing with about the same results. It’s kind of fascinating to see all of the dilapidated relics from a now bygone era, like walking through a dinosaur graveyard. The best one was a ragged ’96 Buick Roadmaster Estate Wagon (the one with the Corvette engine). That would have been fun to hotrod and take down a dragstrip.
What really caught my eye, though, were that there were more than a few vehicles with old, faded used car information stickers on them. You know, the ones that you see on a used car that gives basic information, along with a couple of big blocks where they can check off ‘No Warranty’ or ‘Warranty’. Sure looked like some shenanigans going on there.
A good discussion. Oddly, I find myself agreeing with folks on both sides.
segfault: “The torque output of the T6 was very close to the upper limit for what a 4T65 can handle, and then Volvo had the good sense to neuter the transmission fluid cooling system. The end result is that the transmissions on the T6 S80s and XC90s tend to fail about every 50,000 miles.”
So much for fine European craftmanship. The owner of the transmission shop that fixed my Windstar’s transmission (died at a little over 60K miles) says manufacturers don’t want to make transmissions that last. I have to admit there’s evidence to support his allegation. Of course, there’s always the possibility of incompetence. Any engineers out there to speak in defense?
I have to throw my .02 onto this discussion..
That’s a pretty nice Volvo S80 for about 40g, 10yrs ago.
I’m just po’ed that it got traded and had to cry at the end of its life.
Thats no way to destroy a good Volvo..
Exploder maybe
G.C definately
Expedition HELL YES
But this ‘Vo.
No.
Idiots….or A$$hat’s?….your call.
I can summarize the Volvo’s big weakness in three words…
Lifetime Transmission Fluid
Volvo gave this model a fluid that simply could not stand the test of time. Toyota and Nissan used an equivalent fluid (I believe the fluid designation is 3039) and had changes listed every 60k for the Camry and Maxima models.
This car was not Ford’s fault. Volvo was notorious for having terrible screw-up’s when they ventured in a new direction and the S80’s maintenance regimen was just one of many.
The last screw-up before that? The 960. Just feel free to venture to the Brickboard some time and you’ll get an earful.
If spending a billion dollars on this program helps these companies off the public dole faster, then so be it.
Wow what a pile of BS…
First, no-one forced the owner of the Volvo to sell his/her car for $4500.
Second to everyone that says “cherry ride”
What you you think a Volvo with leaky head gaskets and a blown transmission is worth these days?
Third. we have three examples of cars with nice paint dying… Here is a revelation all of those nicely painted body panels will be at a wrecking yard near you ready to save cars that are worth saving.
dwford:
“So after watching this Volvo video, the Jeep video and an Olds Aurora Northstar video on YouTube, it seems that these videos will really tell which manufacturers make the best motors.
The Olds dies barely more than 1 minute in, The Jeeps lasts more than 2 minutes and the Volvo hangs on for about 4 minutes.”
It’s easy to think that, especially when the media and popular culture has been telling you for that last 25 years that foreign = good, domestic = bad.
But these videos are not indicative of that.
You see the dealership employees in Volvo video neglected to drain the oil out of the motor per the government instructions. That’s why at the end of the video you see this eruption of brown stuff out of the motor. In the Olds video it looks like they properly drained the crankcase before adding the sodium silicate and the engine died a much quicker (and less heart breaking) death as a result.
On Tuesday of Bike Week in Daytona Beach, FL., one can go to Sopotnick’s Cabbage Patch and watch the annual “Bike Drop.” I attended once and it was very similar, in concept, to this Volvo destruction. Here’s the major differences.
The victim bike was a Honda UJM from the late 70s. The oil was drained from the engine, the bike was started and the throttle wired to WFO. It was then hoisted about 60 feet into the air on via crane.
And there I stood, surrounded by Harley people. And every one of them said, at the 7 minute mark, “A Harley wouldn’t do that.”
At the 22:28 (Swiss timing!) mark, the little Honda’s engine shut down and the crowd went wild.
Point being, you won’t see a Honda in a cars-for-clunkers wind’em down video. I don’t think Google would let you upload a movie that is that long.
As for the S80, remember that a 72dpi picture hides a lot of flaws. The S80 could be a POS.
Cars4Charities would have been very happy to take the volvo as a car donation. The owner would have gotten a tax deduction instead of a voucher. We would have sold the car and given the proceeds to the charity selected by the donor.
http://www.cars4charities.org