King Henry III’s motto was qui non dat quod habet non accipit ille quod optat. He who does not give what he has does not receive what he wants. Henry Ford III is down with that. Autoweek.com reports that Crazy Henry’s not-short-of-a-bob-or-two great-great grandson spent two years as a junior high English and math teacher. So tell me what he wants, what he really wants. Three Sticks is a bit cagey on the “someday this will all be mine” front. “‘That’s not something I’m really focused on,’ he said politely, sounding like the young William Clay Ford, a guy who eventually did take over the company. ‘At this point in my career, there’s so much to learn about the auto industry and I really enjoy the learning aspect.'” So what has the 29-year-old scion (small “s”) learned? “I think the Ford products are far and away superior to our competitors right now,” he said. “I drove an Accord, Civic, Pilot, I don’t think they’re as well-designed, I don’t think they drive as well, I think our products are far ahead of them.” Absit omen.
I’ve never understood why people who are clearly affiliated with the car company in question say things like “I’ve driven our products and they are clearly superior to the competition.”.
What can one, realistically, do with this information?
I can’t trust it because the person who said it, clearly has a vested interested in me buying said car and, also, what else can I expect them to say? “Don’t buy our products, they’re really poor.”?
A completely meaningless thing to say. Just say “Try our products and see what you think”. I’LL be the judge of whether they’re better than the competition or not.
Just goes to show you that the poor lad can’t think. Or see, feel, or hear for that matter. I mean really, I can’t speak for all the comparos he hints at, but between the Civic and Focus there really is no comparison. The Civic is modern inside and out, and while you don’t have to like it – it is well executed. It drives tight (at least as tight as a cheap sedan should) and the seats are divine. Fit and finish inside is near German (high praise), and as a result resale value is absurd.
The Focus is an old car on a tired platform, and the designers well there apparently aren’t any at present. (Plastic chrome side “vents”? Cartoon racing guages? Please. Swaths of cheap plastic everywhere? Check.) By killing the hatchback versions, Ford killed the only Foci that were competitive. And they did this precisely when the competitors caught up: Fit, Versa, Yaris, etc. I had one of the early Focus ZX3’s, and dodgy reliability and myriad recalls aside, it was great. I honestly find the new interiors repulsive in comparison. (Re)Design by committee of accountants I presume?
Hopefully this alleged new “global platform” focus will work out for them in a couple years. And credit where due: The Focus is still well ahead of the Cobalt – perhaps the Wee Ford boy meant to say “Cobalt” and not “Civic”? In which case I’d agree.
Well, what did you expect him to say? Family is family, right or wrong.
I feel an Edsel coming on.
Andy D
Something more politic would have worked: “Ford produces excellent products that any Ford would be proud to drive.” Or something equally vague, reassuring and career-furthering.
Absit omen indeed. Thank you for this installment of the lifestyles of the congenitally clueless.
Well, I give him partial credit for getting a “real job” (wonder if he joined the teachers’ union? LOL). Not that he needed to worry about $$$.
But I agree that his statement regarding his family’s own products is meaningless. Makes me wonder how much “handling” the guy needs. When you’re talking 29-year olds, there’s still a pretty wide distribution of smarts…
I have no problem with this kid.
Come on, at least he’s not snorting coke or raping girls at his family beach house.
29 years old is still beginning today and he might believe what he says.
Being a teacher, the one Ford he must drive is a Volvo!
Mekkon : Just goes to show you that the poor lad can’t think. Or see, feel, or hear for that matter. I mean really, I can’t speak for all the comparos he hints at, but between the Civic and Focus there really is no comparison.
The Civic/Focus thing came to my mind too. Then again, what was he gonna say, “I’ve driven the competition and we’re still not better than a Honda Civic?”
“But hey, we don’t suck that much, and we’ll totally stop sucking next year.”
Another journalist named Robert unfortunately passed away recently….Robert Novak. As most may know, Novak was often referred to as the “Prince Of Darkness” as he would most often look at the dark side of every story and report it as if the world was going to end.
While I certainly cannot vouch for the young Ford’s statements (an “as good as” statement certainly would suffice)…I think you are really reaching here Robert in your continuing “Prince of Darkness” prose against the Ford Motor Company.
The guy is at least contributing to society as a teacher—more than I can say for alot of others that reside in his entitled class.
I admire him for focusing on the real competition and completely ignoring GM and Chrysler. Ford seems to be way ahead of its crosstown rivals in getting the point that they are competing with the world’s best for customers. The whole “import intender, domestic intender” marketsegmentation Detroit believed in for years was always a stupid way of looking at the market. At least Ford has moved on from that mindset.
+1 to umterp85. I’m not glad anyone has died, but I am glad to have Novak off the television.
While I don’t have first hand knowledge of how a Focus drives vs a Civic, I will say that I like car models that have had long production runs (like the Focus, Ranger, Crown Vic, the fox platform cars (Mustang, T-Bird, Fairmont) etc.)
Why? – parts are plentiful and cheap; probably most of the kinks were worked out long ago so quality and reliability of new production should be high; if I like the car, I can keep it a few years then go get a newer one that is essentially the same.
Call me old school, but this trend toward a total revamp every 4 years is just a waste of time and resources and simply exists to push people into flipping their cars more frequently instead of keeping them and not be eternally in debt with car loans.
Really to say their products are far ahead of Honda, I believe a more appropriate line would be to Honda owners suggesting that they come and take a look a Ford, as we’re excited about our new vehicles and in competing with Honda for your business. Something like that…
““I think the Ford products are far and away superior to our competitors right now,””
…Meanwhile…back here in reality land…
To state that their products are “far and away superior” to the competitors, particularly Honda, is to lose your credibility at once. If your products are even close to Honda’s, you’re golden. He’s obviously optimistic here, but if that’s his only crime, I, like others, fail to see where the story is here. It was a puff piece on AW. Here, it’s just a question mark.
double post, sorry
To be fair, if my billion or so dollars hinges on it, I’d say my POS is far and away better than the competition too.
# umterp85 :
August 24th, 2009 at 9:52 am
The guy is at least contributing to society as a teacher—more than I can say for alot of others that reside in his entitled class.
Considering how teachers’ unions work assiduously to keep incompetent teachers on the job I’m not sure that’s true.
“Entitled”? The Ford family earned its money. Family members have always been involved in running the company.
You want to talk entitled? Let’s talk about public employee unions, including teachers, who think that they are entitled to better pay and better benefits than are generally available in the private sector.
California state employees are bankrupting the state with their millionaire pensions.
The notion of the “idle rich” is just plain silly. Most wealthy folks have their assets working for them. They own stock and businesses. That employs people.
I know some millionaires. I’ve also known some public school teachers. I don’t see the teachers being any more ethical (or better informed), or more willing to contribute to society than the millionaires are.
When was the last time a teachers’ union endowed a wing at a hospital?
The kid is right, Ford products are the best right now. Will they continue to be, who knows. For now its a great time to be a Ford. Lets just hope he wants the company to continue to improve. By the way, I say this about Ford coming from a Nissan family. I now own two Fords. If Ford drops the ball I will find my way to the auto company who is ahead of the curve.
I’ll give this to Ford at least they are benchmarking themselves against Honda and not GM.
As far as the Ford family and entitlement goes they control the company with a small shareholding because they hold special “entitled” voting stock and promote themselves above their level of competence within “their” company, but whatever, if my grandfather had laid a golden egg I would be holding on to it as tightly as I could too. I like Ford but I don’t buy stock in family controlled corporations.
You can moan about teachers, and there are plenty of burnouts who only stay in the job because they couldn’t earn close to the same $$/benefits elsewhere, but the other 95% are there in the classroom everyday making a contribution. If teachers have it so easy why don’t you go into the profession?
Ford still has a ways to go to balance their SUV / TRUCK heavy lineup with a company as nimble as Honda.
Granted..
Honda has issues of its own (current Accord size along with the Crosstour, ACURA ((nuff said)) not to mention.. they too are relying on large and porky vehicles.. and not investing enough on engine technology, even though the Hybrid system is good.. could be better).
Doesnt excuse Ford saying how one automaker is better than another.
spt87a:
As far as long running production names go…
Ford has a bad rep about not redoing their vehicles, and or letting the models languish in the market. Its also not a “trend”. Its how things are done in the auto business. Maybe not for the domestics.. but for everyone else.
Now.. to get out my thread slicer..
I know back in the day every year or so a car was brand new. Now its down to about every 5 years a car is comnpletely redone. A new frame, larger motor, new interior, sheetmetal etc etc etc. — If we talk about Honda / Toyota Japanese.
Ford has promised that they turn cars over every 4-6yrs.
But issues like the Focus.. is a disaster. There is no reason.. why that car should be the same frame, underpinnings, motor and interior after 10yrs. Im not even speaking about us as a culture of short attention spans.. but to keep competitive.. new features, good looks and design variety.. the Focus just isnt it. As for getting the kinks out.. that should only take a yr or two.
As for the Civic v Focus debate..
Both now have a coupe and sedan model. Civic tops it with a sport model in coupe or sedan design. I for one wouldnt mind a hatch on that frame.. simply because an SUV is a bunch of heavy bloated crap and the CUV bandaid just isnt working.
I also for one believe the Mazda 3 with the hatch (based ont he C30) is a damn good looking vehicle that I think.. has the best of both worlds.
My wife has a 03 Focus.
Ive test driven the Civic enough times..
And Ive also test driven the Mazda3 hatch.
Mazda spanks them both.. for interior design, hatch availability, more creature comfort (no SYNC, no need for blue screens or to shut off car when M.S SYNC screws up.)
If teachers have it so easy why don’t you go into the profession?
Some folks prefer a challenge to a sinecure.
In any case, since I’m not a “progressive”, I’d have a tough time in that profession. I also like having some say in the decisions I have to implement.
Teaching is an ok gig. It’s really well compensated on an hourly basis compared to many other professions, including those that require actual competency testing.
As far as getting a full time salary for a part time job, yeah, teaching’s a good gig.
Spare us the tales of spending thousands out of their own pockets for pencils and papers, and staying up past midnight grading papers and preparing lesson plans. My sister and brother in law are both teachers in NYC. She drives a Lincoln, he drives a Caddy. She’s been using the same lesson plans for years. She’s an outstanding teacher but she’s exceptionally well compensated for the amount of time she puts in.
If teachers have it so easy why don’t you go into the profession?
Some folks prefer a challenge to a sinecure.
In any case, since I’m not a “progressive”, I’d have a tough time in that profession. I also like having some say in the decisions I have to implement.
Teaching is an ok gig. It’s really well compensated on an hourly basis compared to many other professions, including those that require actual competency testing.
As far as getting a full time salary for a part time job, yeah, teaching’s a good gig.
Spare us the tales of spending thousands out of their own pockets for pencils and papers, and staying up past midnight grading papers and preparing lesson plans. My sister and brother in law are both teachers in NYC. She drives a Lincoln, he drives a Caddy. She’s been using the same lesson plans for years. She’s an outstanding teacher but she’s exceptionally well compensated for the amount of time she puts in.
Mr. Accords, the 08 Focus is heavily redesigned. Much of it is quite different from the Focus’ inception.
It’s also selling fairly well so all the new Focus haters can shut up about it being on an old ass platform. Nothin about a car matters except that its driver likes the car they’re driving and ideally buy another one from the same make.
To state that their products are “far and away superior” to the competitors, particularly Honda, is to lose your credibility at once.
Not to mention…the market will decide if they are ‘superior’…and so far…Ford is a LONG way away from Honda, Toyota, Hyundai, etc.
Ford’s history of design defects isn’t inspiring.
Running through a few, Pinto gas tanks (yeah it’s old), faulty steering column electrical components that burn the vehicle and your house if that vehicle was garaged, tie rod ends on F-150’s that fail at 60,000 kilometers both those, not so old. And there’s more. The stonewalling and fingerpointing (“owner’s responsibility”, “owner neglect”, “normal wear and tear” – all that, the corporate culture that exists in the organization to produce it in the first place (ignore internal engineering memos) etc – exclude them from consideration for me regardless of what is in the showroom.
Idiocracy – watch the movie. Ford I = genius, Ford II = very capable, three sticks = .
Kind Bojack:
Id like you to know…
There wouldn’t be haterz of the Focus, if there wasn’t something BLATENT and Ford-like in the hatred. But Ford is the least of the 3 who have hatred… but their shares includes
Ford canned the Taurus, closed the factory, put hundreds of thousands of people out of work..
Only for Mulally to be hired, and the name brought back. Not to mention.. the car was given to a plant in Chicago. Thr reason he was hired.. is because William Clay Ford JR, couldn’t hack it as a MGR. His biggest problem is he cant say no in addition to a number of other things.
That D E B A C L E was the largest mistake.. FORD has gone through.. besides the Firestone / Exploder disaster.
Now..
On top of that there were HUGE SCREAMINGS all over the INTERNET about how the vehicles that FORD produces arent competitive with whats SOLD in the US. So after YEARS of screaming and begging for EUROPEAN driven and judged cars.. they are finally coming here. (Fiesta, Transit Connect, Kuga, jury is still out on S and C max, not to mention the MONDEO.)
Now..
On top of all of that..
The Focus was in the limelight for FORD PUBLICALLY ADMITTING that they screwed up the car, and it will take a BILLION dollars to PATCH the shit job they did. But its ONLY A PLACEHOLDER for what is coming from Europe to be built in a coupla of the Exploder factories.
Now..
All Ford changed for the U.S FOCUS, is the front and rear clip. The motor is back to a 2.0. It has a coupe design.. where as originally it was a 3dr hatch and a wagon design. Ford did do a shitty job of a SVT version early in its run.
NOW..
The vehicle is essentially the same underneath that it was back in 99.. when this POS debuted.
SO..
The only real changes expected for this car..
IS a total re-engineer of the car and more body styles for 2010-2011. New motors, new designs, new body, new sheet metal.. This will be a new car.. not the CURRENT PLACEHOLDER.
Thats all it is.
Now…
Ford DOES get credit for deciding to actually bringing the cars over and turning over the factories.. to hopefully produce more than 1 vehicle in the plant.. (looking at you GM!) They also DESERVE credit for realizing how important Taurus was.. (even though the current car is such a fat ass and isnt a mid-sizer anymore.) Its competing more with the Avalon, 300 and or Chargher, than Accord and Camry. Even though.. they too have gotten larger, to the point where the aforementioned cars.. ARE ALSO THEIR competition!
——————
Ronnie Schreiber:
Id like to add a correction to the debate that a teacher can drive a Linc or a Caddy. They can also get a Lex, a MB or a BMW.
In my neck of the woods (PA, NJ, MD, DE).. ya can drop 50g and BUY both a Caddy and a Linc. There are plenty of DTSs and STSs for the 20g range.
As far as Linc’s go..
The Fusion with a Linc badge sells for about the same price, early 30s.
The luxo market IS FULL… of leases for anyone who just must have a german badged vehicle. The credibility for driving any of the aforementioned brands.. ISN’T NEARLY as big as it used to be. Just like driving a PORSCHE isn’t such a big deal anymore either. I personally see more Cayenne’s and Boxsters / Caymans than anything else.. all on lease of course.
————————
While I also agree teachers are pulling in wayy too much. But they still don’t have the cache to be able to drop a coupla mil for a wing of a hospital.
Wow, Mr. Accord, that’s a lot of words there.
To quickly address the issues you brought up that have little relevance to what I said to you,
They canned the Taurus name because it got screwed real well during the Nasser era. They then decided to throw the name out because to millions the Taurus doesn’t mean anything. Mulally is essentially gambling that the Taurus name can be fully ressurected to its former glory. They also shut down the factory because they were stopping the car, this is basic business sense.
Mr. Ford Jr. didn’t do very well as a CEO. He had the balls to admit it and dug up Mulally this alone means he’s actually not that bad of a leader because he got out the way to let some one else more competent take over. He could have been a Wagoner and stayed around screwing it up for a decade or more.
The only people really screaming for the Euro Fords are the 5% minority of enthusiasts or the Merkur line up and the Contour and several other foreign market import attempts would have done much better instead of damn near bombing like they did.
Anyways, you needs to do some more Focus research. IIRC, original Focus used a 2.0 SPI variant of an engine that went back to 97 Escorts which was a variant of the 1.9s and can still trace lineage to even older engines.
The Focus also used a twin cam variant that was known as the Zetec. This I think went on until 2004. Then they switched to the 2.0 Duratec which itself is a Mazda variant if I recall. During the 2005 refresh the Focus received front clip and entire interior redo. I’m sure there were some other more minor changes maybe to trim or feature line ups. At any rate for 2008 the entire interior and exterior were redone. Extensive new stuff was piled into the interior as well. Take the average American down to the dealer and they think the whole car is new. Even then most don’t care about the platform being a decade old as long as it drives well. Mustangs sold like bananas for like 30 years on Fox platform variants.
The SVT Focus was not shitty. If you think it was you’re deluding yourself. The Focus itself is also not a POS as the bazillions of them on the roads in America can attest to.
Anyways, I guess that about wraps it up.
KING Bojack:
In case you didn’t know..
Ford is full of BLUNDERS and SCREWUPS and every single comment.. is time dated. Meaning the time that Mulally got hired, the time the Taurus factory got canned, and the time the Focus got redone.. is within 2-3 months of each other.
Makes them all relevant.
Now
The only reason why the damn car even sells now is because its Ford’s only attempt at a compact car in the U.S., on top of the whole C4C b.s.
The SVT Focus comes after a long line of shitty vehicles that SVT put out. When the market started going south they disbanded and spread themselves all over hell.
The basic point with the motor was…
The car started with a 2.0, and it ended with a 2.0.
So essentially..
Ford spent a coupla billion dollars on the Focus for 05 and 08.. and they still look almost completely alike, as the ones from 99. Great. *Toilet flushing sound in the background*
It would have been MORE COST EFFECTIVE if they would have just redid the whole damn car, from frame to motor, interior details to electronics every 4-5yrs like EVERYONE ELSE DOES (read: japanese).
And otherwise..
You’d be a more of a nut than I thought.. to buy the same damn car.. just a coupla years later. Car hasnt changed, not any better.. dont bother.
The Focus.. is average for Ford, better than the Cobalier and the Neon ever could be. At least.. Mo Fo Co is spending the money to keep the car going.. instead of just dumping it and launching a new one, like their history suggests.
And I hate to rain on ya parade..
But I’m one of those 5% of people.. actually wanting to drive the next Focus, in a 5dr hatch, in orange… with those alum wheels. Im also sick and tired.. of Ford pushing out such gutless, cheap ass, BUCKET OF MONEY ON THE HOOD shit, while sitting back and relaxing on their SUV / CUV background.
The current one.. is such shit, in so many ways. NTM, it personally DISGUSTS ME that people could be so flippin stupid / cheap.. to buy a car that’s 10yrs old, but of course add the SYNC b.s in.
Ford can’t sell their cars in Europe, but Euro Fords are going to sell in America? Didn’t GM just try this with Opels sold as Saturns? How well did this work for GM? A decently equipped Focus currently goes for around $20K? Ford has nothing to match the Nissan/Hyundai/Kia/Suzuki low end cars. For about the same money, I would buy a Fit or Civic or Mazda 3 over a Focus. Now Ford will add a turbo, which bumps up the price, and they think this is going to sell? GM’s death has distracted everyone from Ford’s death. Ford is now the Titanic, and has hit the iceberg. Yes the band is still playing, but we know how the story ends.
MATT51:
I think the difference between GM selling Opels as Saturns in the U.S..
And Ford bringing over its european stuff is…
For one,
GM just rebadged the Opel stuff as a Saturn.
They also didnt give enough marketing money to show off what DID came over. Notice Astra **crickets**
What did come over is the Aura which looks the same as the Malibu which again got more money than Saturn did. Bottom line.. GM brought over Opel stuff to badge as a Saturn and the stuff failed, (except for the Vue, which is a different story altogether.)
The Ford stuff..
COULD be a big deal. If they sell and market it properly.
I will say this much…
It is possible to buy a Civic for 20g, and get the EX. Its also possible to get the hybrid with the leather and navigation for 27g. You can also buy a stripper for 16g. But Honda doesnt advertise that (like everyone else does).. only $199mo lease rates for Accord and Civic, being the base models.
I think its possible to spend 20g for a Civic and I might, if it had the hatch and more features to be compared against a Mazda 3. With that said.. I see no problem buying a smaller car with the options. But.. this IS America.. where people want the most for their money and buying a Civic for 25 is probably foreign (literally), and buying a Malibu or a Accord could be their choice.
Mr. Accords:
I still don’t know why I made a simple comment about the Focus and you brought up the Taurus and Mulally and Ford Jr. etc. etc. Yes Ford has had and still does and for the forseeable future will have issues, some quite big but that wasn’t anything I was talking about.
Anyways, on to the debate I actually brought up,
So Ford should arbitrarily screw with the displacement of the motor just because? Not all 2.0’s are the same. They did upgrade and stop using the Zetec because it was old as dirt and use a Mazda derived engine now. Quite a good one too.
If you think the current Focus looks like the 99 one you’re delusional. Nothing that matters to most car buyers is the same as the 99 or 05 Focus. The 08 Focus also sold quite well way before any country was doing a C4C program. You’re also deluding yourself if you think that SVT only cranked out junk. It’s a shame they stopped the SVT Focus but what we gonna do?
You say buying an old car is stupid because it’s old. Ummm, ok. As if that matters as long as the car sells. I could esaily say that buying an untested new car w/ little aftermarket support or used parts supply etc. is stupid.
But enough providing Troll bait for now. Later!