BMWs are my weakness. My first car was a 1974 2002 burgundy over tan five-speed with a sunroof. At the time, it was twelve years shy of being a new model and cost all of $1000 bucks. Yet ask any high school girl what kind of car I drove and they all knew three letters. They were clueless to the many stranded push starts I experienced. Since the carburetors needed rebuilding, I’d kill the battery before it would run. Girls were also impervious to the rust and completely unable to fathom 140,000 miles on the clock. All this taught me one thing, park on a hill and find a good mechanic.
Fast forward twenty years, one ’84 533i, a ’89 535i and a ’91 M5 later, and I continue to set myself up for failure. These cars are brilliant to drive. It’s like every other car is a step down. Now hold on . . . I’m not going to go all Car and Driver on you and rate these cars the best above all the rest. I’m simply saying there is a reason manufacturers chase them. The problem is they break. And when they do, it’s expensive. Things you’d never expect to go wrong go wrong. Gremlins in the electrical system can take out gauges, flax discs break so you can’t shift and switches simply stop working. Heck, we had Erhard himself, owner of Erhard BMW, try to trace down an electrical short that killed the battery every five days. He couldn’t find it; we sold the car.
They say to find your mechanic first, then buy an old classic. These days it’s a lot easier to find knowledgeable and reputable wrenchers through the Internet and car clubs. Trial and error, and error, had been my usual way. It took me some time to find Peter Mardikian of Mardikian Automotive in Redondo Beach. He is a master. He loves BMWs. He is the reason I bought the M5. The trouble is, now I’m ready to sell the M5 and all I keep thinking about is buying another BMW. I love all cars and want that new and different experience. But in the end, I keep thinking about the hassle it is to start a new relationship with a new mechanic . . . I just can’t seem to break up with Mardikian.
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The 2002 was my first love.
I love the article and thank you so much for being truthful and honest.
This is another reason why I dumped my R&T. Im tired of hearing how the Accord is top notch..
But my biggest question is..
Are you married or divorced? Is there some kind of metaphor for your personal life?
I owned three 2002’s over a period of 16 years. My best automotive memories. The last one had the engine completely rebuilt, and I do remember choking on the cost of four new pistons, $110.00 each in 1982. And that represented 1/2 total cost of new internal parts. Can’t imagine what they cost today. Ouch!
How timely – bought a 1982 528e last year with 83,000 original miles for my daughter. The price was right and it is in terrific shape for a 27 year old vehicle. I have a good mechanic; he just seems to never look for the best price for parts. We now go through a checklist to compare parts prices after his original estimate and before any work is started.
I love those 2002’s. When I had an upholstery business I recoverd enough 2002 seats to fill Dodger Stadium. The horse hair padding was death to that car in So.Cal. It would dry out, get brittle, fall through the bottom of the seats, and the springs would find their way to your ass, and your lower back.
My hat to you, sir, for getting those great classics.
Unfortunately, there’s a reason why so many people lease BMWs:
they want the attraction of the badge (because only a minority actually cares about the great driving dynamics) without worrying about upkeep.
Paul – maybe you and BMW cars are just a match made in heaven. I feel your pain as I have tried a few times to kick my expensive habit and have meaningful relationships with other cars. But apart from a brief (but hot) fling with a Miata nothing else does it for me like a BMW. Life is too short to live in automotive misery so I’d highly recommend a E39 M5 or a used 335 as the next object of your affections.
I got into ‘The Ultimate Driving Experience’ in 1978 when I bought a 320i. It turned into ‘The Ultimate Repair Experience’. In three short months it was head gasket: Boom! Fuel Injection: Boom! Clutch: Boom! On top of that, the sunroof leaked like hell and driving above 55 mph induced a bone jarring vibration from the front end that no mechanic could cure.
BMW’s are not cars. They are time bombs with a delayed fuse.
I just got bitten by the BMW bug and haven’t yet managed to empty all of my savings account and wallet on mine. “Everybody” tells me it’s inevitable, however….
@menno:
I thought you were a Hyundai guy?
If you buy a used BMW from the late 90’s/early 00’s, just make sure you get a stick, ensure the major components in the cooling system have been replaced and ask about the effing window regulators. If they haven’t been replaced, they will need to be done soon.
menno: Depends on the vehicle. The last BMW that I had problems with was an E34 323is. The subsequent E46 330ci (100K+ miles) and E92 are some of the most reliable cars I’ve ever had.
I guess the question is “reliable compared to what?”. I’d rather take my chances with BMW over anything that Audi or Mercedes makes.
“They say to find your mechanic first, then buy an old classic. These days it’s a lot easier to find knowledgeable and reputable wrenchers through the Internet and car clubs.”
Even BETTER is to use those Internet & Car Club connections to become a better mechanic yourself. Breaking your dependence on a professional mechanic is the best thing the owner of a classic car can do for themselves. Even more so in the case of a current VW owner! I only seek a pro if it is something I know is over my head, or requires time or tools outside of my budget.
If I can keep a 44 year old Jaguar running (Just drove it 4000 miles in the past month!) then any of you can maintain and repair just about any car you can find.
–chuck
I love the older BMWs. I think they are great cars to teach your kids auto repair and maintenance.
The one thing I’ve learned is that the electric gremlin issue is still alive today. BMW just can’t get its siht together on the electronics. Ask me how I know…
Mechanics Are Like Girlfriends
Yup, with both I always get screwed.
John
Mechanics Are Like Girlfriends
I hope not.
Paul, we bought the same car in the same year (even the same color til I had it repainted Alpine White).. except mine didn’t have the 5 spd swap.
Loved the hell out of that car, spent a fortune (to me at the time) on body work, new suspension, body work, a factory rebuilt engine, body work, a new Weber, oh and some body work… til finally the Miata came around and made me give up on my ongoing rust repair project (20 years on, it’s still running like a champ, and rust free!).
I wouldn’t have made it without a good indy or two (we seemed to be blessed here in San Diego with BMW indies…)since my carb tuning skills are sadly nonexistent.
Your timing couldn’t have been better with this, as I was at said BMW indie just yesterday with my e46 wagon and saw all of the coupes and 2002s in the “showroom” and I got the bug. Checking my bank balance now :)
Oh and jkross is dead on about buying criteria — since said e46 had the auto tranny reverse drum fixed last year and just went through a $2k “routine maintenance” on the cooling system last month. It’s definitely not a Honda :)
My new toy is a 1993 BMW 740iL (E32), nothing particularly “special”.
What did I really WANT/drool over? An 850i or 840i.
Knowing that I did not wish to go into debt for a “toy” when people all over the place are losing their livelihoods, etc., and deciding that I should only gamble with such a car what monies I could essentially afford to write-off, I settled on a big 740iL.
The object of the exercise was a modern equivalent to a early 1960’s Studebaker Hawk with a European accent; a grand touring car. I just ended up with 2 extra doors….
The driver’s window regulator is somewhat slow. So I’m figuring it’ll crap out just at the most inopportune moment.
It does need a tail light assembly (I patched the crack for now – looks pretty bad) – $225. I need an owner’s manual – $35 and a 2nd key – $65.
“cringe”.
The Prius is the commuter car the Hyundai Sonata is the 2nd car/tow car, this is the “toy”.
Thus far I’ve managed to only put 600 miles on it and I’ve had it all summer. Normal “collector car” use even though it’s a tad new to most people when they think “collector car”.
Owning a BMW is like dating a super model with a bad cocaine habit. You know it’s going to break down, but you’re not sure where or when. When it does, you know it’s going to be expensive.
Twotone
1973 3.0 CSi
1984 635
1989 535i
1998 540i Sport
1998 328i
Owning a BMW is like dating a super model with a bad cocaine habit. You know it’s going to break down, but you’re not sure where or when. When it does, you know it’s going to be expensive.
True, but oh when they’re good!
My 1974 2002 went with the ex before the bad stuff started. My 1989 e30 convertible is the paragon of reliability, having about $4k of work before I bought it 4 years ago. Of course I’ve put almost that much into the suspension rebuild etc. now its ready for timing chain and A/C work. God help the hapless owner who doesnt keep up on maintenance. Including me.
Definitely not a Honda.
Meh, granted it is the Dodge Dart of BMWs, but I bought an 88 528e with 150k miles on it in ’96. I drove it for 11 1/2 yrs and put an additional 200k miles on it. I maintained it in my driveway. It never broke down. Parts are cheap and plentiful. Most of the electrical gremlins were due to loose fuses. I liked the Borman6 so much, I bought 2 more of them and they are my daily drivers. The secret to any old car is DIY maintenance. If you have to rely on professional help, it will ruin the experience.
I was just thinking about buying one of those $800 320is or 528es I see pop up on craigslist now and then, too.
Recent BMW’s and their problems. Still totally worth it. All were fun in the curves; the eta was not fast, yet a free-spinner to its 4.5K redline. The others were screamers – esp the Z3 with its Supersprint exhaust ricocheting off underpasses.
Only the M3 left me stranded, twice, with radiator failure and pulley failure.
’84 325e: owned 4 years. Driver’s-side-door recalcitrant lock: fixed with keyless entry; and driver’s seatback failure.
’97 Z3: owned 3 years. Lifters replaced under CPO. Engine mounts replaced under CPO. Recurrent airbag lights due to seat sensor fault, never completely fixed. Cats replaced under emissions warranty.
’97 M3: owned 4 years. Radiator neck plastic disintegration. Pulley, waterpump failures. Brake light circuit faults. EVAP code CEL’s… never completely resolved after various repairs.
’01 M5: owned 2 years. Bank1 Exhaust Cam position sensor. Diff mount bushing. Failed auto-dim on inside-mirror.
BMWs all have the same problem, which they share with other German cars. They suffer fools badly.
Many mechanics are fools and a great many drivers are fools. Most BMW horror stories contain one or both of these elements.
Those 80s 5 series are incredibly durable. Unlike the later cars, they have only a few parts that are made out of crap.
The combination of an out of warranty BMW and a BMW dealership is going to end in tears every time. DIY or a competent indy are the only ways to go.
I hear you!
I had a 12-year relationship with the service department of one of RI’s Subaru dealerships. I never once worried about the quality of work done on the car or the price I paid.
Now they are out of business and I am at a new Suby dealership service department. After the first oil change, the engine under-tray fell off the car. They tried to charge me for the clips to re-attach it. Here we go…
As for BMW’s…my pal with the 2005 540 he found with 7k on the odo…3 sunroofs, two steering columns, various window motors, vapor barriers twice, A/C compressor. God knows what else. He’s lucky it’s BMW Certified used. But I think it cost BMW their F1 program!
Why don’t you guys spend the time to learn to work on your OWN cars?
Makes life MUCH cheaper!
Growing up in Germany, my first “hook” was being taken for a long drive in our landlord’s 1600…white, four doors and I was in love. All Herr Kuehn ever owned (and still does to this day) was/is BMW. When I was finally in a position to do so, I sold off my (then) two year old Nissan Sentra SE-R for a pristine 1974 2002. In all of the years since, and after countless cars I’ve owned, it’s the only one I actually cried over selling. My heart still skips a beat when I see a nice ’02 on the road.
As for upkeep, I was fortunate to be close to a very strong BMW CCA chapter that had the same love for those older Beemers (thanks, Old Hickory Chapter). They saved me more than once, and kept ownership costs surprisingly low. DIY and a solid (ie honest, proficient and affordable) make all the difference.
“Why don’t you guys spend the time to learn to work on your OWN cars?
Makes life MUCH cheaper!”
What takes my shop an hour to do, would take me a day. Considering most modern BMW diagnostics requires a $10k computer, their $100/hour rate looks reasonable.
Twotone
I have a bad BMW habit that I can’t break. My current pet is an E30 1987 325iC that I rescued from being parted out in a rednecks driveway. The cars are generally great, if you eliminate the craptastic Bosch electrical parts. Even new Bosch replacements amaze me with how poorly engineered and constructed a part can be. Thankfully, BMW multi-sources many OEM parts from multiple vendors, and finding a Hella or Siemens replacement for a Bosch part is sometimes easy.
As for service, most independent shops that specialize in these cars seem to enjoy 150/hr labor rates and get very defensive if a customer tries to save a few bucks by attempting some repairs by themselves. A great example of this was when I recently called a highly recommended local specialist to change the head gasket on my car because I was really busy at work. I spoke to the owner who was “insulted” that I asked him to accept a job that I had “tinkered with” and hung up on me. I was prepared to pay him 6 hours of time and pay for any machine work that was necessary plus a 20% profit. The fact that I wanted to use my own stock of parts inflamed him. I just finished this job last weekend myself in 4 hours.
Shops like this lead people to abuse these cars and attempt home fixes that are over their head and result in the cars being slowly destroyed.
BMWs all have the same problem, which they share with other German cars. They suffer fools badly.
I have owned 3 German cars and all 3 were lemons and all the dealerships treated me like a fool.
I have owned 4 Japanese cars and they didn’t/don’t break and the dealerships seldom saw/see me.
I guess I am a fool when I buy German but not a fool when I buy Japanese.
@twotone
Not true about tools. You can do quite a bit with a cheap Harbor Freight OBD2 scan tool and a decent Craftsman metric set.
Oil Changes are oil changes, brakes are brakes, light bulbs are light bulbs. sensors are sensors. You think the guys working in a BMW dealer are any different than a Toyota or Ford shop?
BMW buyers are fools if they think they must drop serious labor or tool coin to fix these cars. BMW sometimes kills you with part prices, but if you shop around the parts can be had reasonably.
rmwill: As for service, most independent shops that specialize in these cars seem to enjoy 150/hr labor rates and get very defensive if a customer tries to save a few bucks by attempting some repairs by themselves.
It’s YOUR car and YOUR money. They don’t need to know who worked on the car last. Perhaps things are different there from here, dunno. Just tell them the service is needed. If they don’t want the business go somewhere else or learn to do it yourself.
When I do a repair and need a tool I buy a decent tool. The cheap tools usually work but won’t last in my experience. If it is a tool I know I won’t use more than once every decade or so the cheap tool is good enough – sometimes. At $50-$100 per hour I can afford to buy alot tools and factory repair manuals (i.e. not a $10 Haynes or Chilton manual).
A good brand specific enthusiast forum goes a LONG WAY too. The forums I use (VWVortex, Type2.com, theSamba, ShopTalkForums and HondaSUV) all feature pictorals for the more difficult maintenance. Someone has done the work and taken pictures and written it up. Often they or some reader will suggest good sources for parts at good prices.
Over time the tools and the books pile up and I have everything I need without new purchases.
You gotta enjoy this work though. If you hate the work then don’t bother. Just get your name on some mechanic’s list and bring your checkbook.
Me – I love the satisfaction and the details that I have to take care of to do a proper job. I am also proud that my car is running after nearly 200K miles because of the work my hands did.
I also know that I do a better job than the mechanics I have trusted over the past decade plus. Each mechanic I have given a chance to do what I didn’t have time or desire to do has failed to put all the hardware back or to tighten hardware or to clip all the hoses or wires back into their intended places.
Hell, I watched the Wal-mart guys fail to rotate the tires on my car last time. He removed the right side tires and balanced them and then proceeded to put the front tire back on the front hub. Nevermind it was dirty from brake dust making it obvious which wheel came from the front. The muffler shop guys failed to clip the new O2 sensor wires into the holders that keep the wires from melting against the header pipe on the other car. Figured since I needed them to weld my new cat on (I did not have a MIG then), I’d also have them screw the new O2 sensors in. Failed.
I recently did a timing belt on my ’99 CR-V. The parts were $150 to do the timing belt, drive belts, cam and crank seals, sparkplugs, valve cover seals, etc. I had purchased the Helm’s manual years ago and had every tool I needed.
Compare that to $400-$500 for dealer prices. Prob more because I bought quality parts but by no means OEM parts. I do like OEM parts when I can afford them and that’s usually online only. The local dealer only has a 100% markup. Ouch!
Oh – and back to the tools. The two previous timing belt jobs I jammed the crankshaft with a screwdriver so I could loosen the crank pulley nut. Never worked well. This time I made a tool from some square tubing for a handle, and a large nut that I reduced in size with a Bridgeport mill at work. This fit the inside of the crank pulley indention. I used my MIG welder to weld them together. I later found the crank pulley tools for reasonable prices online. So anyhow I have the tool for future Honda maintenance. I’ll keep the tool when I sell the car someday.
Hope this helps somebody.
I had a Black 1995 BMW 525i from April 2000-May 2001. 5 year old car with 54,000 miles on it. Car had the most unusual problems:
Sometimes, in the middle of a turn, the steering would skip and clunk. Then the steering wheel would be about 25% off center to the right. Temporary repair was pulling up to the concrete stop in a parking spot and turning the wheel to the left till you would hear a “pop” and then the steering wheel would be straight again!
indy shop charged me $1000.00 to fix it that.
God forbid you would turn the temperature up over full max cold on the A/C. The drivers side would get stuck on HOT and the passenger side would have A/C. For about an hour, or a week. Whatever the CAR decided.
Then the A/C went totally dead. Brought it to the local BMW dealer for an estimate. $1,500 for a condenser. Overheard a service writer telling a fellow dealer employee that you have to make the bills high for these cars or the customers don’t think your “fixing” them correctly.
Thought to myself, “This is not the place, or the car for me”
I then replaced the condenser myself, wrestling with the hood that opened the wrong way and with not an extra centimeter for ANYTHING like a hand or a tool! Had a local shop fill it up with R12 and put a For Sale sign on it.
Some guy paid me too much for it. Glad he did not adjust the temperature on the test drive. What would you want to do that for???
Steering problem was likely a bad steering rack or steering box. I would start at the steering wheel and make sure everything was tight. Also the steering links from the front spindles to the rack boots. Eliminate all the easy stuff and when everything checked out cleaners- replace that rack.
I have not worked on one of these cars so I’d need a manual. Just checked two of my normal parts sources (1 min look) and neither had a steering box or steering rack. Might be a difficult part to get in the aftermarket and thus expensive.
That $1K price might not be too unusual for this car. I have seen prices of $300+ for mere mortal steering racks.
Hey Joeaverage, re your 99 CRV, keep those valves adjusted. Last fall, I had to replace the #4 exhaust valves because the lash got tight and they burned. Son’s GF’s car.
Mardikian, that’s Armenian, and Armenian are usually good at what they do… some of the best workmen i have encountered in my life were Armenian…
As for the BMW, i love them from a distance, dont think i will ever get my hands and finances in one… but a 200X 3 series break parked at the lot in face of my office has been flirting with me,, and since i got a baby on the way, i might need the extra space….
Class is now in session…
BMW automobiles are called bimmers.
BMW motorcycles are called beemers.
BMW out of warranty stands for “Break My Wallet”…
Class dismissed.
My first car was a BMW E30 318i. Against my mom’s advice and quite a few mechanics. This one had 2800000 km’s on the clock which everyone told me to avoid immediately. I wasn’t fond of the high-mileage, 4-cyl engine, colour or the numerous dents/paint chips but I was admittedly desperate for a car.
As a last resort, I went to see the mechanic who serviced it regularly. He’s a BMW nut – has a 2002 and several E30’s including an M3. His charges were reasonable so I had him give that car a once-over. It had a few problems from the last service but was otherwise okay. Bought it the next day and you should have seen the huge grin on my face. Which was only wiped off when on the drive back home on wet roads, a tailgater rear-ended me. And I was uninsured.
The car has pretty much been problem free except for a continual coolant leak problem, new radiator cap, a leaking rocker cover and a new starter motor. Two months later and I’ve easily spent twice the amount I paid for it (including panel repair from the accident and numerous original BMW accessories) but I’m madly in love with it. I stumbled upon a great mechanic and can’t ever imagine parting with him, or my [hilariously underpowered] Bimmer.
Andy D – thanks for the heads up! I have heard about that problem and adjust my valves a little on the loose side. I use synthetic oil and the cams look nearly new at 181K miles and they have hardly tightened up at all.
A good mechanic, a good butcher, a knowledgeable wine merchant, a local fruit and vegitable vendor, a fish vendor –
These are all people who make my life wonderful.
If I didnt have a first rate VW mechanic, my Golf 3 would never had made it to 230,000 miles. So much so that I am not considering another car (why?). I do none of the work myself. None. I suppose that it would be cheaper to do it myself, but i dont have the tools or the interest.
So my hat is off to excellent service providers everywhere. Without them (i mean us, i am a service provider of a kind), my life would be filled with stuff i dont like doing,instead of stuff that I find interesting.
And yes, when and if i change cars, I would probably stay in the VW family because of my mechanic.
there’s an “H” in “Mishegas”