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Motor Trend has replaced its “best handling car” with a “best driver’s car” competition. Is this an opening for the Camaro? Not so much. The new SS model placed dead last in MT‘s comparo, which was won by the Porsche Cayman S. And if you think the Camaro was simply there to serve muscle car whipping post duty, check out the rave reviews that the Shelby GT500 picked up. On the other hand, the fastest car around Laguna Seca, the Corvette ZR1, ended up in 6th place. There’s just no way to hide the fact that “best driver’s car” will always be a subjective award.
44 Comments on “Motor Trend Brings a Camaro to a “Best Driver’s Car” Competition...”
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“There’s just no way to hide the fact that “best driver’s car” will always be a subjective award.”
They seem to have embraced this wholly.
I’ve wasted my time so you don’t have to:
1) Porsche Cayman S PDK
2) Audi R8
3) Mazda MX-5 Miata
4) Cadillac CTS-V
5) Ford Shelby GT500
6) Chevrolet Corvette ZR1
7) Nissan Nismo 370Z
8) Jaguar XFR
9) BMW 135i
10) Chevrolet Camaro SS
This is the supposed judging criteria:
http://www.motortrend.com/features/performance/112_0910_2009_best_drivers_car/judging_criteria.html
I’ll take the entire list, no_slushbox, from 9 up.
Three surprises in the list:
(1) Miata’s high ranking. I know it’s good, but this good?
(2) 370Z’s low ranking. Maybe the Nismo version isn’t the one to buy. Personally, I would rank a 370Z above both the Corvette and Miata.
(3) 135i’s asbysmal ranking. It appears that BMW really f—– up the handling.
No S2000?
I’m surprised to see the RX-8 isn’t there.
No STI or EVO either.
I think they were trying for a cross-section of classes. As a track test, they should have restricted it to cars that might reasonably make it to the track in significant numbers. So I would have broomed the Camaro, the Jag, and the Caddy, and substituted in the RX-8, M3, 911, EVO, STI, and maybe a few others. (although we all know that aside from the Cayman, the RX-8 is the best driver’s car out there :) )
The results don’t surprise me, though. Like the handling test last year, they show that there are numbers cars and there are feel cars.
S2000 is being discontinued, no sense in including it…
The Mazda’s high ranking is NOT a suprize. Apart from girly looks (which don’t matter behind the wheel) and not truely obscene power (the Miata has all the power you NEED in a small roadster, you just WANT another 200hp…), it is a brilliant, brilliant car.
Add in the very low cost and it deserves to rank #3 in that list.
Why the 135 and no M3? How about the RX-8, EVO, STi or RX-8?
I can confirm, however, that the Miata is definitely worthy of its third place.
A push button, girl-tronic Cayman, a driver’s car? That’s rich.
I’ll join the chorus of asking why the Asian continent was so under-represented for this test.
However, It’s no real surprise that the two mid-engine cars won. I am surprised to see Motortrend give a dual-clutch car the overall crown tough.
I thought it was a reasonable list, order-wise. Saying the comparo was of “driver’s cars” means that it’s all subjective. The measurements and stats are just eye candy for the readers.
The Camaro definitely wins on the engine noise front among the cars where they had video clips.
As for the PDK-equipped Porsche winning: everything I’ve heard about both the car and the transmission has been extremely positive. As long as it’s in the right gear when you need it, then it’s doing its job. Most auto transmissions fail at this, which is one big reason why people hate them. If Porsche really managed to get it right, then maybe it doesn’t suck.
I’ll take the bait as well, where’s the RX-8? This is the same rag that put the RX-8 up against much more expensive cars and whose own driver said it was the second best car out there, yet they leave it out of a comparo containing more pedestrian cars? I think the ZR1 is the only carryover from the comparo they did a couple of years ago. Doesn’t make sense, unless Mazda wouldn’t give them one, which is beyond hard to swallow. Yet, one more example of why I no longer have a Motor Trend subscription.
I would have liked to have seen the Genesis Coupe in the mix. If I was Hyundai, I’d have a talk with them.
I call bullshit. The Camaro costs 20-30 grand less than most of those cars. It’s hardly amazing it came in last.
That’s rich! How could anyone posibly believe that the Corvette ZR1 could place behind a Porsche caymen? And then behind a Miata? I have to assume that they pushed the ZR1.
Thus the joy of the super-subjective “best driver’s car” label – it really depends on who the drivers are. Four or five MT editors like the Miata, don’t like the Camaro, and explain why they like and dislike both. Take in their reasons, apply your own weighting to what they liked and disliked, compare against your favorite (i.e. RX-8, although its love-it-or-hate-it engine seems to be polarizing enough so that I’m not surprised it wasn’t compared here), and take it from there.
(and as a new Miata owner – happily surprised to see it do so well, but still pretty surprised)
Call me crazy, but I’ve never thought much of Motor Trend as a judge of fine vehicles.
Can anyone say “Motor Trend Car of the Year”?
Answer – Yup…. just about anyone.
Wow!
I wasn’t sure I’d ever see the day that Motor Trend would give an “Epic Fail” rating to an iconic ‘must succeed’ offering from Detroit.
Predictions of future adequacy aside, Pobst’s comments convey a strong dislike of this car’s road manners. From a professional driver, the (para)phrase “I didn’t want to drive this car anymore” counts as an Epic Fail in my book.
And the Stig looks cool in his black-lensed Simpson, but Pobst’s open-faced skid lid looked like a NASCAR batting helmet. I know it’s hard to get good audio commentary from inside a full-face helmet, but give the man his dignity!
stevenm :
August 20th, 2009 at 3:33 pm
A push button, girl-tronic Cayman, a driver’s car? That’s rich.
0-60 in 4.1 seconds (per R&T) and one of the best-handling cars on the planet.
Yeah, really girly.
It’s very unfortunate the car they’ve named as their top choice are almost leased by trophy wives and yuppies.
I’m surprised the 135i didn’t place better…or was it C&D that always gives top spot to the 135i?
Man does that engine sound sweet! I just wish the interior was better.
TTAC: Why bait us with MT ramblings? I had MT figured out before I left 9th grade…
@Areitu:
I’m surprised the 135i didn’t place better…or was it C&D that always gives top spot to the 135i?
Yea, that’s C&D. Here’s the “Best Drvier’s Car” list from the that magazine:
1. BMW M3
2. BMW 335i
3. BMW 328i
4. BMW 535i
5. BMW 128i
6. BMW 135i
7. BMW Z4 sDrive35i
8. BMW M5
9. Honda Accord
10. BMW X6 xDrive35i
I liked the 135i’s engine sound the best…it rips like a race car.
A couple of well-chosen suspension mods and wider front tires and that car would be something.
Hmmmmmmm… *strokes chin*…
The PIG GT500 is rated higher than a ZR1????
And with that…Motor Trend’s credibility (what’s left of it) goes completely out the window.
A push button, girl-tronic Cayman, a driver’s car? That’s rich.
0-60 in 4.1 seconds (per R&T) and one of the best-handling cars on the planet.
Yeah, really girly.…
If you don’t stir ’em yourself and use your left foot, yeah, GIRLY. Don’t care what the posted number is. The rest of the car is great…
My critique of their critique of cars… and not to rank them in any sort of bias, I’ll use letters as to not offend. All cars can take advantage of a car guys sensibility. Here are some for free!
A) Porsche Cayman S PDK
A-Carguysays) Add the frigg’n turbo already.
B) Audi R8
B-Carguysays) Make it cheaper so I can buy one.
C) Mazda MX-5 Miata
C-Carguysays) That’s such-a-cute-wittle-car. Come on, get angry, look mean, and for God’s sake, get some torque and horsepower.
D) Cadillac CTS-V
D-carguysays) Ummm… less doors maybe? Less of the softy accomodations too.
E) Ford Shelby GT500
E-carguysays) Hells yea! Not bad. Just fix the suspension, and make it cheaper.
F) Chevrolet Corvette ZR1
F-carguysays) Bring it! And make it cheaper. Or, maybe just be this? http://jalopnik.com/5341204/2010-corvette-grand-sport-first-drive?skyline=true&s=i
G) Nissan Nismo 370Z
G-carguysays) MAHR POWAH PLEEZE!
H) Jaguar XFR
H-carguysays) Less of the fanciful bits, loose some (a lot) weight, then we can go out.
I) BMW 135i
I-carguysays) *spews beer through nostrils* What-in-THE-hell!? *looks around for the M3, RX7, Genesis Coupe, anything really… shuffles away in disappointment*
J) Chevrolet Camaro SS
J-carguysays) YEEEE HAWW! We unwashed plebes and bourgeoisie now have our wet dreams just come to life. I’ll take two and name one ‘panty dropper’ and the other ‘virgin slayer’. Yes, those exact names painted in artsy calligraphy on the sides. I know, you can taste my sweetness from there.
Man does that engine (Camaro) sound sweet!
It sounds like a continuous fart….
P71_CrownVic :
The PIG GT500 is rated higher than a ZR1????
And with that…Motor Trend’s credibility (what’s left of it) goes completely out the window.
Actually, tells me that they are the experts and know what they are talking about. After all, they have actually driven both cars – you have not.
If driving a car was subjective, we’d only need some stats from the manufacturer to make our decisions. Car reviews are supposed to be subjective. That’s the point. One car that pulls .90g on the skidpad doesn’t necessarily handle as well as another that gets the same number.
Shouldn’t the title of this article be “Porsche Cayman Wins Motor Trend’s Best Driver’s Car Competition”?
After all, they have actually driven both cars – you have not.
And you know that how??
Actually, tells me that they are the experts and know what they are talking about.
Yeah…”experts”. These are the same “experts” that told us that the best truck you could buy in 2008 was the Toyota Tundra.
MT Credibility = GONE!
After all, they have actually driven both cars – you have not.
And you know that how??
Well, have you? Unlikely that you have either driven them, or driven them back to back around Laguna Seca, so until you do, you are required (as I am) to accept the verdict of people who are paid to evaluate cars for their living!
I have only driven the GT500 but it is outstanding as all the other press reports have indicated.
You are right that the Tundra was a bad call, although I suspect you would not like the fact that the answer should have been the F-150 of course!
So you trust so-called “experts” that you admit made errors in judgement in the past.
Wow…
And NO F-150 is worth TOTY award. Picking the 2009 was as nuts as picking the Tundra.
The 2009 F-150 was a half-hearted re-skin with a terrible interior, boat anchor engines, the weight of a Sherman tank, and completely deceitful capability numbers.
But…it’s MT…who have no credibility. That is the only explanation for the GT500 being ON the list in the first place and a Miata beating the ZR1…among others.
I trust these experts on the basis that they have at least driven all the cars in the same place at the same time. That gives all of them an advantage over you.
As other knowledgeable commentators have pointed out, the Miata (MX-5) is one of the finest cars ever produced. Just because the ZR1 has lots of horsepower means absolutely nothing to the true driving enthusiast. There are so many more elements that make a brilliant car, and Mazda have mastered them with the Miata.
There is, by the way, nothing deceitful about the F-150 capability numbers and to claim so is disingenuous. All the claims are subject to intense scrutiny by a battery of lawyers and can therefore be totally justified. Stick to the facts please.
@jamie1:
Actually, tells me that they are the experts and know what they are talking about.
I trust these experts on the basis that they have at least driven all the cars in the same place at the same time.
So when Edmunds places the 370Z ahead of the Mustang GT, gives the F150 a 4th place in a 4-way truck comparo, gives the G37 the nod over the SHO, has the Accord beat the new Taurus, and says of the MKS “Lincoln Concedes to Cadillac, and Just About Everyone Else”– you accept and agree with those findings as expert opinion?
What about C&D giving the Focus an 8th place finish out of 8 cars, placing the Flex 4th out of 6 crossovers, and placing the F150 behind the Ram?
Even in this Motortrend test the CTS-V beat the GT500 as a better drvier’s car. Do you agree with that as an unarguable expert opinion?
The comments section here seems sometimes like a contest to see who can be most critical, as though that shows insight. Maybe it has something to do with the tone of the blog…
…and now I’m doing my part.
That out of the way, I actually liked the article. You know why? It was enjoyable for me to read about car people’s impressions of cars. Horsepower doesn’t make fun. They weren’t saying “which car would I most like to own” – they were talking about which are fun to drive.
I’m actually very impressed that Motor Trend is taking the conversation this way. The truth is, while not as bad as motorcycles, most modern sports cars are way faster than their drivers’ capabilities. It’s worth having a conversation about what makes an enjoyable car to drive, numbers aside.
But putting the numbers aside doesn’t make for an unassailable position. For those who would prefer to bicker about 5 seconds on the ‘ring, as though that really has anything to do with why one would actually want to own a car, have at it. For those who look at photos all day and only want to talk about how it looks from outside, go to town. But for my part, I have a 370Z and every single day I drive in it, I love it more, which is a rare thing. I was looking at a used Cayman S but I just didn’t fit in it. My knees didn’t work with the cockpit somehow. Those intangibles make different cars work for different people, and that’s *good*. Articles where people actually care about how the cars drive should be encouraged, even if you disagree with some of the rankings. I would say, I actually give a fair amount of credence to people’s opinions who had a chance to drive one car after another. The ZR1 might be stonkin’ fast, but the Miata is a brilliant car too. I love my Z, but that doesn’t mean I’m angry that it ranked low – the cars on the list are great, and different cars will shine under different circumstances. The only reason that they order the cars into lists is because it’s a trick of the human mind that that’s what we like to see.
I also have to say, the videos on the site are great, which is a rare thing these days. Straight, unabridged lapping with decent miking of the car sound and no crap soundtrack. I wish they had done all the cars, and I wish more review sites would follow this lead (without the Edmunds Shoot Me Now voice).
I will say I was surprised (and I’m surprised no one has mentioned) that they didn’t include and Elise or Exige, which are a kind of benchmark for driver’s cars…
I have no issue with any test result. Ford wins as many as it loses. But the fact is, we all buy magazines or read our favorite on-line publication to get the opinions of experts.
As such, whether we like it or not, if we have not spent time driving all the cars back to back, we are forced to accept the opinions of those that are paid to do the job for a living. We might not like the result if our favorite manufacturer or car does not win, but we should accept the result in good grace and move on.
Either way, constructive opinion is fine – baseless diatribe is not. Use facts where available, but don’t trash things for the sake of it – that is nether clever nor witty.
For the record, despite working for Ford, I would have placed the Boxter, R8 and Miata in these positions as I have driven all three and all three are outstanding – and yes, better than the Mustang for the audiences they play to.
Now, bring on the next muscle car group test!
I have no issue with any test result.
So then the 2008 Tundra is a better truck than a 2008 F-150.
http://www.motortrend.com/oftheyear/truck/112_0802_toty_winner/index.html
And the 2009 F-150 is the worst truck you can buy when compared to the new Ram, Tundra, and Silverado.
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/Comparos/articleId=147067?tid=edmunds.il.home.photopanel..3.*
Huh…I would have thought a Ford employee would have felt different.
Oh…and read that second linked article and try to tell me with a straight fact that Ford does not severely pad their capability numbers.
Ford has some serious issues when their claim of having the ‘most capable truck’ is debunked when said truck really struggles to tow a trailer HALF of the claimed max towing capacity.
Ford pads their numbers as an attempt to boost sales. They know that 99% of 1/2 ton truck buyers will not use their truck beyond hauling people…so in their mind, they can pad the numbers and get away with it. Is it dishonest? Yes…but Ford is desperate.
P71_CrownVic :
August 21st, 2009 at 11:31 am
Yeah…”experts”. These are the same “experts” that told us that the best truck you could buy in 2008 was the Toyota Tundra.
MT Credibility = GONE!
No, they didn’t say that. Their (fill in the blank) of the year competition covers only vehicles introduced THAT YEAR, not every model available.
You need to frame your arguments accurately.
I don’t see how naming a Cayman a top driver’s car could possibly be that controversial…but the absences here are glaring. Where’s the Nissan GT-R, the BMW M3, and the Dodge Viper?
And it was nice to see the Miata and Camaro representing the “cars us mere mortals can afford” segment, but there are PLENTY of others I can think of that are great driver’s cars, and none are invited to this show? How about a base Corvette ($45k), the Mitsubishi Evo and Subaru WRX, the BMW 335i, or the Infiniti G37?
I read the story and really can’t figure out why some cars were included, and others excluded.
These cars just get more and more cool as years go by. Making them faster and safer. More fun to drive. auto transmissions