TTAC commentator talkstoanimals writes:
The recent TTAC flap over the Priapus’, er, Prius’ potentially failing HIDs got me to wondering if turning of my MKV GTI’s daytime running lights would lead to any meaningful gains in HID bulb longetivity. Historically, I only tend to keep cars for approximately 80k miles. I also like the fact that DRLs mean I never forget to turn on my headlights in the rain—a requirement in many states in my neck of the woods. However, I like this GTI so much that, the car gods willing, I may keep it longer than my other cars.
So is it worth it to shut the DRLs down and possibly keep the bulbs in action for a longer period of time? Or would the potential gain be so small that it fails to offset the potential for forgetting to light the Xenon fires in the rain? (I never had a problem remembering to turn on the lights before my cars came equiped with DRLs, but I’m not getting any younger and neither are my memory banks.) Lastly, how does one turn off the DRLs in a MK V GTI? My owner’s manual sheds no light (groan) on the subject.
Sajeev answers:
Conspiracy theory alert! When the DRL issue came to “light” (double groan), I thought the battery lobby pushed hard to bring this supposed safety feature stateside. Which worked great in frozen Nordic countries, but has little to no statistical benefit to car accidents in the mostly-thawed US. And demanding more electricity on a regular basis has some amount extra wear and tear on the car’s charging system. Hence my paranoia.
Back to your HID + DRL dilemma. I cruised VW forums and the best way to kill DRLs without hacking wiring (usually not a good idea in a VW) is to buy a European headlight switch, and then reprogram the computer to accept said Euro-toggle device. FAIL: that’s pricier than a new pair of HID capsules, so . . . leave well enough alone.
Bonus! A Piston Slap Nugget of Wisdom:
I’m no Daniel Stern, so when in doubt, I ask Daniel Stern.
“You won’t realize any practical increase in HID bulb longevity by deactivating the DRLs. What is hardest on HID bulbs is turning them on, not leaving them on.
If you nevertheless wants to turn off the DRLs or alter any of the car’s other lighting parameters, it’s done with VAG-COM, the VW computer interface. A Google search focusing on the VW forums will give full info.
As for DRLs in the rain: Sure, but while most VWs turn all the exterior lights on full-time with the DRLs (or have an ambient-light sensor to turn the parkers, markers, and tails on when needed), lots of other DRL-equipped cars don’t, so it’s important not to put too much faith in the DRLs.
In most cases, you still have to turn the headlight switch all the way on when it’s dark or stormy to display low beams, sidemarkers, and taillamps for adequate visibility and safety.”
[Send your technical queries to mehta@ttac.com]
I could fill pages as why DRL’s are not such a good idea. Glare and its effect on vision, known as masking are my main objections.
That said, Audi’s LED DRL’s are by far the best answer. Long life, relatively negligible energy usage and no direct in the eyes high beam headlight pattern. I only wish they would make them amber. I hope all vehicles move to these, and soon.
As to fuel use . . . . (http://auto.howstuffworks.com/fuel-efficiency/fuel-economy/drl-gas-consumption1.htm). Another note, GM, the foremost advocate of DRL’s who succeeded in having the feds override several state laws so they could produce vehicles with DRL’s, also successfully lobbied to be allowed to disconnect them when generating CAFE numbers.
The profit motive is also not to be denied. No small fortunes could be made if you could get everyone to run with their lights on, causing increased light bulb replacements over time. Little numbers add up, just like the case of fuel use above.
While I can’t speak to Volkswagens, on Honda’s equipped with HIDs, the Daytime Running Light circuit either uses the high beam lamp (an incandescent bulb), or have dedicated DRL lamps that are completely separate from the headlight lamps.
Based on the GTI image at the top of this article, it appears this car also uses the incandescent high beam lamp, rather than the HID lamps.
I suspect this is because HID lamps are all or nothing. In other words, the lamps cannot illuminate at reduced brightness and are never used as DRLs. If that is the case, DRL circuits have NO impact on HID lamp life.
My erstwhile 9-3 had a jumper I could remove to disable this “feature.” I saw no quick way to do it with my VW. DRL: a good way to forget to turn on your back lights in early morning. As far as I can tell they are useless, but probably harmless at the same time.
DRL’s are mandatory on Canadian cars, and I can’t think of one (including our own 2 cars with xenons) where the HID bulb serves this purpose. In some cars like the old CTS even the fog lamps were co-opted for DRL duty.
Interestingly, my RX-8’s DRL solution involves a chintzily-engineered control module that is guaranteed to fail, as it has on my car. Bye, bye, $200!
My A4 Cabriolet has a switch next to the headlamp switch where you can turn off the DRLs if you wish. I keep them on because driving in Atlanta traffic you need every advantage you can get to make sure they see you.
The sensor for the automatic headlamps isn’t sensitive enough to turn on the exterior lights when it’s raining, though, so I still have to do that manually in inclement weather. Not to hijack the thread, but since more and more states now require the lights on when it’s raining, why don’t the automakers give us a feature where if the windshield wipers are on, the lights automatically come on with them? They could set in a delay to keep them from activating when you’re just making one or two wipes to clear some moisture or using the windshield washers.
Just wonderin’.
Boff :
August 18th, 2009 at 11:45 am
DRL’s are mandatory on Canadian cars, and I can’t think of one (including our own 2 cars with xenons) where the HID bulb serves this purpose. In some cars like the old CTS even the fog lamps were co-opted for DRL duty.
Several vehicles in Canada use the HID’s as DRL’s… typically those vehicles have bi-xenons and don’t actually have a separate halogen high beam lens… the Mercedes ML and current VW Passat are a couple that come to mind.
My son’s VW R32 does use the HID’s for the DRL’s.
There are a perfectly good set of lights inside of the HID’s that don’t seem to work at all(no they are not fogs)yet for some reason VW has chosen to energize the Xenon’s for the DRL function.
Yes, you need the VAG-COM to turn it off, which means a trip to the dealer… (no sir, we can’t deactivate those, its a SAFETY FEATURE!), or a trip to a local VW club meeting where someone hacked the VAG-COM onto a laptop, and can do a ghetto fix for you.
I personally think the worst thing for the lights is turning them on and off- which happens every time you turn the key—–can’t be good for longevity.
Regards,
BD
Two things.
To Dave Skinner, I own a MkV GTI and, yes, the HIDs, not the incandescent high beams, are the bulbs used for the DRLs.
Also, to refute Daniel Stern’s comments, none of the other exterior lights are on when my DRLs are in use. The other lights could use a sensor to cut on when it starts to rain or when it gets dark, but that’s an option I didn’t order.
@ Emro:
Well I stand corrected, then. VW headlamps do seem to fail with regularity, now that I think about it…
Frank – I often wondered the same thing. When the wipers come on automatic turn on the lights… seems simple enough.
Speaking of lights –
one thing that drive me nuts is that some vehicles require the headlights to be ON before allowing the fog/driving lamps to be activated. My Passat is like this, but thankfully my Dakota isn’t. When its raining I think the combination of parking lights (for others to see me) and fog lights (for me to see the road) is perfect. Because I’ve noticed that headlights in light rain produces too much glare on the road so I just want the fog/driving lights only.
I’ve never understood the purpose of DRLs, the problem is not in seeing a car coming at you, instead its someone not realizing your stopping quickly and thus rear-ended you (can you say whiplash?). So I’d rather see progressive brake lights were you can tell a light tap of the pedal vs an “oh snap!” full-on, tire-smoking, panic-stop occurring by the clueless driver in front of me.
It’s likely the DRL’s use the inner, incandescent lights, which are cheap to replace. They’re often run at a reduced voltage, so the filaments last a long time.
My 3-series runs the inner lights as DRLs, and they can be disabled in the computer settings I keep mine on- it may help people from pulling out in front of me. In fact, DRLs & flash-to-pass are all the inner beams seemed to be used for at all- the HIDs aim up slightly when you select high beams. The coupe uses the corona rings, aka “angel eyes”, as DRLs, so I’ve no idea what the inner headlights are for on the coupes.
HID bulbs tend to wear based on how many times they’ve been cycled on and off. My automatic headlights were coming on every time I started the car in the garage in the morning, and when I’d pull back into the garage in the afternoon. I disabled the automatic feature and now the lights probably cycle 10% as often as they did before. This is where the real life-extendings savings are at.
Hopefully, soon all headlights will be LED and this won’t be an issue.
My lowly PT Cruiser has the DRL control on the stalk with the headlights. Go to parking light position, pull out, DRL on, push in, DRL off. Same on headlight position. Simple and easy to use, as are all the controls on the PT. The Germans couldn’t figure this out?
Also I have replaced one brake light in 7 years and 100k. VW has some work to do before they dominate my world.
Euro headlight switches aren’t that badly priced. About $90. http://bit.ly/bMwUd
And if you take it to someone with VAG-COM, make sure they have the cable for Mk 5 cars that can interface with the Can-bus.
DRL’s were a great idea; incorrectly executed (like the Jaguar X-Type). So many people think they’re lights are ON because they see light in front of them; but dont realize that their tail lights are NOT ON! Automatic lights dont come on soon enough (funny, they come on under bridges all the time – off, on, off in 3 seconds).
Seems silly to have more programming to have lights come on when wipers are turned on. WHY NOT just have “lights on” when the engine is started!!!!! No one will ever forget to turn them on, no one will leave them on when they get out of their car. And OEM’s could eliminate the switch/dial on the dash (less wiring, simpler electical, etc). And bad guys cant sneak around with lights off….
And DRLs are horrible at twilight times since DRL’s are 50% highbeams. CHRYSLERS are the worst, so bright. OH, and Chryslers – the DRL light turns off when they signal (signal side only) – what, they dont think we can see a signal when lights are on? There’s my rant, CHRYSLER!!! For many reasons I’d never buy a Chrysler, this is reason 956!
I can’t speak for newer VWs, but on the previous generation Golf/Jetta you could disable the DRLs with a piece of electrical tape over one of the terminals on the headlight switch connector (check VWVortex for the exact terminal). I did this on my car (when I had it) and my wife’s car (which she still drives).
IMHO, DRLs make it harder to see emergency vehicles and motorcycles and the benefits are statistically negligible (I don’t remember the exact numbers from the Canadian study, so please don’t ask. I do remember that the difference was within the margin for error.) VWs eat light bulbs, so anything to help them last longer is okay in my book.
carve – see akitadog’s response. The inboard lights on the GTI housing do absolutely nothing other than light up when you pull the turn signal stalk past the high beam position. This is also only when you have your headlights off (else it just flashes the high beams). It took me ages to figure this out.
(o = on, x = off, “[” & “]” indicate headlight housings)
DRLs:
[Ox] [xO]
DRLs + “flashing headlights”:
[Oo] [oO]
Low beams:
[Ox] [xO]
High beams:
[Ox] [xO]
I too echo that DRLs make for lazy drivers who won’t turn their lights on during inclement weather. Every time it rains I am stuck behind a gray car driving down the highway in some kind of wet foggy mass that brakes at the last minute. Rear lights are a must – as much a consideration as the DRLs which let other drives see you.
Having done some “creative” wiring on my own car, I can say that parking lights should be made brighter. Their original purpose is all but extinct now, and they can (with brighter bulbs) serve as perfectly good alternatives to a forward-light-casting beam, low or high.
Audi’s LED eye-makeup looks great, although I really don’t want every car on the road sporting that same or similar look.
Pulling the parking brake turns the DRL off. In my MK3 GTI, the sensor was right under the parking brake cover…assuming the same in the MKV, should be easy enough fool it.
As a hard core motorcyclist, I’m completely against DRL’s. Why? Motorcycles already have them, and to put them on cars takes away one safety advantage a two wheeler’s got.
I too echo that DRLs make for lazy drivers who won’t turn their lights on during inclement weather.
I would posit that DRLs are BECAUSE OF lazy drivers who seemingly never turn their lights on when they should.
I don’t like them for many reasons, but I do understand the idea behind them. I think they don’t hurt, even if they don’t help.
And a request: don’t drive around in traffic with your fog lights on. Very few of these are properly aimed. Extra points deducted if you drive with headlights and foglights “for extra visibility” when it’s not foggy out. You’re just a blinding annoyance to oncoming traffic.
RE: dingram01: OH MAN i forgot about Fog Lights!! They should be banned from cars, there’s nothing sporty about them but they come on all “Sport” models.
I like to flash people that drive with fogs on: one guy stopped and asked why i’m flashing him (11pm – no fog). I yelled very slowly out the window “THANK…..GOD…..YOU….HAD….YOUR….FOG….LIGHTS…..ON….OTHERWISE…..I…..NEVER……WOULD…..HAVE……SEEN…..YOU…..MORON-TURN YOUR FOG LIGHTS OFF – ITS NOT FOGGY”
martymcfly: let’s not even mention the “please kill me because I am an idiot” REAR fog light….
DINGRAM01 – rear fogs??? i’ve never seen those before. is that whats on the back of Pontiac Sunfires?? I thought those were huge reversing lights….
@ ttacgreg & others:
I could not agree more. I remember the GM DRL push beginning around the time I began driving and I thought it was an idiotic idea. If you can’t see a 2-ton mass of oncoming moving metal without DRLs, you probably shouldn’t be on the road period.
The Nordic data confirms that the ONLY positive of DRLs is that they provide some level of illumination on white, silver, and beige cars driving in fog, mist, rain, or snow. For some reason these car colors seem to attract lazy fools that love to tool around in adverse weather with all their lights off.
martymcfly :
August 18th, 2009 at 1:51 pm
DINGRAM01 – rear fogs??? i’ve never seen those before. is that whats on the back of Pontiac Sunfires?? I thought those were huge reversing lights….
hehe no on Sunfires (and Grand Am’s), those were reverse lights, or in GM-speak, “rear cornering lights” (i’m not kidding)… rear fogs are standard in every country in the world except North America, we get a trickle of cars with them by default, but noone here knows what they are or how to properly use them. Typically it’s a single red taillight (typically on the driver side, but sometimes in the middle (think MINI or 370Z), or even dual (Audi A6)) that is brakelight intensity. They work extremely well when used in the correct conditions, but that rarely happens in NA, so you end up with Volvo/Audi drivers leaving them on while driving around the city. And can anyone explain what possessed GM to add dual rear fogs to the 2nd gen Olds Aurora?! The baby-boomers driving them around always leave them on, grrrrr… that car must be the only domestic oem car ever sold in NA with rear fogs… good piece of trivia tho :)
AAAAH yes, thanks dingram01. i’ve seen those red rear lights on a few Mini’s. and F1 cars! and dear god i hope they dont put them on NA cars – like you said – no one here would be smart enough to use them properly (see Fog Lights).
I think that DRLs are helpful to some degree – they do make the oncoming cars more visible, even in bright daylight. Yes, there are dodos that don’t turn the lights on at night, but that’s not just because they have their DRLs on – what plays an even bigger role are the instrument clusters that are lit all the time (Lexus, Toyta Matrix, Mazda3, etc). That way people have no visual feedback that their lights are not on at night. The traditional instrument cluster has no backlight (unless you turn it on) so as it gets dark you notice that you can’t read it any more and you turn the lights on…
NHTSA Center High Mounted Stop Light (CHMSL) technical reports confirm the CHMSL lost effectiveness soon after its 1986 introduction. In 1987 and 1988 it is credited with reducing rear end collisions by 8.5% and 7.2% respectively, decreasing to 4.3% in 1995. Commonality decreases usefulness.
The Daytime Running Light (DRL) is producing similar statistics. Headlights that automatically illuminate in low light conditions are probably superior.
Purchasers are still obligated to pay for them however, and the safety Nazis who mandate them still have jobs.
Mr. Blue, thanks. I’ve always wondered how people couldn’t tell their lights are off when the dash would be pitch black. Now I know why.
People drive with lights off because some OEM’s thought lighting the guages all the time would be a great idea. Oi vey.
Oh, please. Find someone on VWVortex with a VAG-COM cable/software/laptop, have them switch off DRL’s (along with the seatbelt chime, door chime, key in ignition chime, and all the other obnoxious warning chimes that VW’s lawyers think we need).
Go to OEM.PL.US, order a three-position (plus two position pull-out for fogs) european lightswitch, which is like 60 bucks. it takes 30 seconds to install, and bam, you also have parking lights.
no wiring hacking required. What do you think it is, a GM?
I hate DRLs, at least those without an override. Here in Washington state the ferries require you to turn off your headlights, and only use side-lights when loading and unloading at night. This is a safety issue for the people who work the car decks arranging the cars. When I drive on in my VW I CAN NOT TURN THE DAMN THINGS OFF, which annoys the workers to no end, and honestly, puts them in a bit of danger.
If anyone from VW is reading this: LET US OVER RIDE THE DRLs PLEASE!
–chuck
So I’d rather see progressive brake lights were you can tell a light tap of the pedal vs an “oh snap!” full-on, tire-smoking, panic-stop occurring by the clueless driver in front of me.
I’d rather see people maintain a safe following distance. You can already tell how hard a car is braking by how quickly the gap is closing.
@Chuck Goolsbee and others
While the dealers will try to give you the “party line” of not wanting to turn off the DRLS, there is one sure fire way to get them to do it: The magic words are “I need to drive onto Military bases”. Works nearly every time. Had to go through this for my ’08 Saab 9-3SC, which sadly has no equivelant to the VAG-com available. Doesn’t have HIDs, but I would like to have control of my own damned car, thankyou very much.
I’ll be digging my VAG-com out this weekend, as Mom is taking delivery of an ’09 Jetta Sportwagen S. Time to KILL her craptastic Windstar! Wish I could do the honors… I just hope the steaming pile op crap makes it to the dealer – we are having to go 125 miles to get a Jetta in the spec she wants.
@akitadog:
none of the other exterior lights are on when my DRLs are in use. The other lights could use a sensor to cut on when it starts to rain or when it gets dark, but that’s an option I didn’t order.
Are you quite certain? If that’s actually the case — if your car doesn’t run the tail/parking/marker lights with the DRLs and they do not turn on automagically when it gets dark out — then your car is in violation of FMVSS 108 (if you’re in the States) or CMVSS 108 (if you’re in Canada) and VW will likely face a recall as soon as the noncompliance is Noticed. What year is your GTI?
@Gardiner Westbound:
NHTSA Center High Mounted Stop Light (CHMSL) technical reports confirm the CHMSL lost effectiveness soon after its 1986 introduction. In 1987 and 1988 it is credited with reducing rear end collisions by 8.5% and 7.2% respectively, decreasing to 4.3% in 1995.
Certainly. That’s just the novelty effect wear off. The 4.3% figure has endured pretty steadily, though.
@Quentin:
The inboard lights on the GTI housing do absolutely nothing
Right, because U.S. regulations (FMVSS 108) limit high beam axial intensity to 75,000 candela per side of the vehicle. The limit everywhere else in the world is 140,000 candela.
@Juniper:
My lowly PT Cruiser has the DRL control on the stalk with the headlights. Go to parking light position, pull out, DRL on, push in, DRL off.
No, those are the car’s “fog” lamps. Pre-facelift Canadian PT Cruisers burned the front turn signals full time as DRLs; post-facelift models use reduced-intensity high beams. In both cases they are hardwired with no driver-operable on/off control.
@JMII:
When the wipers come on automatic turn on the lights…
This is the way it should be, but isn’t.
some vehicles require the headlights to be ON before allowing the fog/driving lamps to be activated.
There’s nothing such as a “fog/driving” lamp. “Driving” lamps are auxiliary high beams, never for use alone, with low beams, or in traffic. Fog lamps are for use in fog, rain, or heavy snow to help you see the edges of the road close to the car so you can safely make your way through the foul weather at very low speeds. That;s all these lamps are designed, intended, and able to do. The vast majority of the fog lamps on the road, particularly in North America, are wholly useless even for that task; they are cosmetic toys that are nowhere near adequate to serve as the vehicle’s only forward illumination at greater than parking lot speeds. Yes, it’s delightful to have good working fog lamps and be able to use them by themselves at suitably low speeds when the weather warrants it, but neither of the two vehicles you mentions has fog lamps anywhere near that good.
Leaving the fog lamps on at all times does not meaningfully improve seeing or safety—in fact, it worsens it—though many people do so in the mistaken belief that they can see better this way at normal road speeds in dry weather.
@Emro:
[Rear fogs] work extremely well when used in the correct conditions, but that rarely happens in NA
True and true. There’s a requirement being phased in under European/rest-of-world regulations (but, of course, not in North America) that rear fogs must switch off every time the headlamps or vehicle ignition are switched off, and may not re-illuminate unless manually activated by the driver. This will go a long way towards addressing the “I don’t know what this switch does, but I paid for it, so I’m gonna turn it on, ahyuck!” morons; all it would take to solve the problem completely would be a tie-in with the vehicle speed sensor. If you’re going faster than 50 mph or so, the visibility’s obviously good enough not to require a rear fog.
@ECJ
Pulling the parking brake turns the DRL off. In my MK3 GTI, the sensor was right under the parking brake cover…assuming the same in the MKV, should be easy enough fool it.
Same parking brake story on the MkV. That is a great idea. I’ll try that first, then resort to the vaguely NC-17 sounding VAG-COM if the parking brake trick doesn’t work.
Thanks Sajeev and everyone else for your helpful ideas.
rochskier :
If you can’t see a 2-ton mass of oncoming moving metal without DRLs, you probably shouldn’t be on the road period.
Obviously you’re never driven much in the country on two lane roads at twilight when a lot of people have the attitude “I can see the road just fine so everyone else must be able to see me” and never turn on their lights until it’s pitch dark. DRLs help immensely in situations like that. Or when driving in areas where the road may be heavily shaded and a dark car could be coming out of the shadows.
With the muted colors most everyone seems to be going for nowadays, DRLs give an extra margin of visibility to oncoming traffic. And with the crazy way the typical American drives, those of us who actually pay attention to traffic need all the help we can get!
Purchasers are still obligated to pay for them however, and the safety Nazis who mandate them still have jobs.
DRLs cost, effectively, nothing. People who complain about them sucking power or costing money, generally speaking, curiously still have cars with air conditioning or sunroofs or any number of other features that also suck power and add cost and also aren’t needed or wanted by everyone.
But because they’re safety or environmental features, they’re obviously the Fault Of The Nanny State Fascists.
Seriously, where’s the Jihad Against Sunroofs? Because I can tell you, me and everyone else over six foot four would trade DRLs for sunroofs in an instant.
My 09 Jetta does not have a light sensor and has DRLs. The only indication is there is a green “DRL” light in the dash. Headlamps must be manually turned on.
I dont think its as much a problem in a VW as it is in Certain Toyotas and Hondas.
Some have the DRLs and always lit dashboards, but no auto light control. I cant count anymore the times I have seen a Camry/ RX350 or an Accord or some form of Acura driving down the road with only DRLS at night and a brightly lit dashboard so the idiot inside thinks their lights are on.
As for the mandated auto lights with wipers, that is an Idea that needs to be put into effect pronto
ALONG with all the European lighting standards.
Amber rear signals, Side repeaters and White only running/park lights.
Its time for this continent to catch up with the rest of the world.
DRLs help immensely in situations like that. Or when driving in areas where the road may be heavily shaded and a dark car could be coming out of the shadows.
Another time they help is when you’re driving into the sun, say in the morning or evening. Because they often use either high beams at reduced power or signal lights, they’re quite visible even when the rest of the car is drenched in glare.
Finally, they’re a good clue as to whether or not a car is going to move or not. No DRLs? Probably parked with the engine off, brake on or not in-gear. DRLs on? Pay attention, this guy might move.
TonUpBoi
Agreed, and now more and more motorcycles are running with their killer full strength high beams on. I suppose to standout more.
When these are in my field of vision, my eyes adjust to their brightness, and I see little else nearby.
I got to experience universal DRL’s (with an open mind to the concept) driving in Canada in the early 90’s. It was a relief to get back to the USA where I could discern visual details up ahead without them being drowned out in a sea of glare. DRL’s had not yet been rammed down out throats by GM at that time.
Am I the only person who thinks changing a light bulb in a modern car requires either a) the ingenuity of McGuiver or b) the flexibility and imagination of a porn star ?
I mean – where does Mr VW/Honda/Toyota/GM/Kia/Hyundai hide the bloody things ? They are in plain sight at the front most of the time shining to mock us – until they fail when they take on a magical cloaking device.
Arragonis – i’m with you! My 1994 Ranger was SOO easy to change the headlight bulb. My ’01 MPV and ’03 Protege – i need my 5-yr old to get his tiny little hands in there. Or i have to remove the batter, Radiator, etc to have enough room to get ahold of the connector. Luckily on my MPV when i wiggled the connector – the light started working again. Still goes out sometimes but all i have to do is ‘smack’ the headlight and it comes back on. Winter only…go figure. I’m too cheap to spend $$$ on a new connector or even take it to a shop – i got a hand and it smacks things good :) For Free!
@martymcfly
Is that child labour ?
Mind you I have an 8 year old loafing with a DS, just in case ;-)
Am I the only person who thinks changing a light bulb in a modern car requires either a) the ingenuity of McGuiver or b) the flexibility and imagination of a porn star ?
Some of the best automotive reviews, from my point of view, are Michael Clark’s Inside Story stuff on CanadianDriver.com. The language is pretty fluffy, but every vehicle gets the once-over in terms of cubbies, ergoonomics, trunk utility and ease-of-maintenance. Not even CR checks this stuff in this kind of detail.
BostonDuce:
Yes, you need the VAG-COM to turn it off, which means a trip to the dealer… (no sir, we can’t deactivate those, its a SAFETY FEATURE!), or a trip to a local VW club meeting where someone hacked the VAG-COM onto a laptop, and can do a ghetto fix for you.
Some clarification. VW dealerships have VAS-505x diagnostic systems that cost $4-$15k. VAG-COM is an aftermarket software program (and interface) that is available as shareware and priced up to $599 for a fully unlocked program + interface; no “hacking” required by the end user. VAG-COM is arguably superior to the factory diagnostic system, and anyone that works on VW family products should seriously consider buying the extremely useful and powerful VAG-COM.
If only someone had the equivalent for Honda products…
@psarhjinian (and others)
I am from that old world where you could actually find screws next to your lights and get the things out from the front.
Once there you would examine the beast, puff on your pipe a little and then wrestle with Mr Spring Clip until the rascal was free. You would then examine it, probably shaking it next to your ear to listen to the broken bits inside. You would then replace it.
As Mr Haynes would say, then “refitting is the reverse sequence to removal” and we are done. We would then test the lights, puff on our pipe some more, nod knowingly and move on to the next task of the day.
Nowadays everything is “dumbed down”. I bought a Bike for Arragonis Jnr the other year – I expected to take said item away and allow the little fellow to ride it straight away.
“No” said the shop oaf. “We have to assemble and test it”. Test it ? It’s a child’s bike you spanner holding excuse for a shop worker. Are you suggesting that I, a male adult and a father don’t know how to wield a spanner ?
As a contrast though changing automotive bulbs is like changing the oxygen system on the ISS. Why ? Its a bulb… Even changing the one in my wife’s Skoda’s govebox is an engineering operation close to inventing Stephenson’s Rocket.
I always drive with my headlights on. My car is essentially the color of asphalt, so I need that extra bit of protection. My rear fogs only come on with the headlights on, and I only use them in brutal snow storms, heavy fog, or when the hussy behind me in her Excursion may need to see that extra bit of red when I’m braking. (I have a 240 Wagon, the brake lights are right above the rear bumper.)
@ Frank Williams:
Obviously you’re never driven much in the country on two lane roads at twilight when a lot of people have the attitude “I can see the road just fine so everyone else must be able to see me” and never turn on their lights until it’s pitch dark. DRLs help immensely in situations like that. Or when driving in areas where the road may be heavily shaded and a dark car could be coming out of the shadows.
I have, but I honestly can’t recall an instance where I was bothered by a vehicle with its lights off during twilight. Now I live in a city and occasionally I see people attempting to drive via streetlight.
These days I expect to see at least one light-colored vehicle with no illumination when I need to drive in fog, mist, rain, etc.
@Roundel:
My 09 Jetta does not have a light sensor and has DRLs.
That’s permitted, as long as the DRLs are not full-intensity low beams. Stay tuned for tomorrow’s article.
I remember my dad’s ’92 Olds Cutlass Supreme (Canadian spec) having DRL’s (full strength low beam), with the rest of the lights coming on automatically at dusk. It was one of the few things on the car that always worked well, and I don’t think anyone ever needed the override switch. I’m amazed that more cars aren’t set up like that 17 years later. Credit where credit is due. The car also had backlit steering-wheel-mounted controls for stereo and climate control, the latter of which was digitally and automatically controlled (though that did intermittently fail by about year 8, with the LCD screen going blank and the HVAC defaulting to full heat, full fan).
My ’92 Jetta had VW’s ghetto version of the then-newly-mandated Canadian DRL’s: all the lights on the car were illuminated as soon as you turned the key. The 2 position light switch was only used for the parking lights when the car was off, and to allow use of the high beams when the car was running. There was no way to override them, except for the odd (probably unintentional) non-detented position between “off” and “run” where none of the car’s accessories (heater, wipers, etc.) were enabled, but the ignition was still running.
The car went against convention in a few other ways, too: the radio was hardwired independently of the ignition, so you had to physically turn the radio off every time you shut off the car to avoid draining the battery. And the horn only worked with the ignition on.
In the 5 years I owned the car (I bought it at 10 years old), I changed one headlight bulb, one taillight bulb (burned out days before I sold it at 160k miles), a sidemarker, and a couple of license plate bulbs, which in my view is a hell of a lot better than today’s VW’s. And that was with all those lights burning for every one of those 160k miles. The only “major” electrical problems I ever had were a wire to the alternator becoming unsoldered – a 5 minute fix – the heater blower failed a couple of months before I got rid of it, but gave lots of warning beforehand, and the “coocaracha” door chime occasionally wouldn’t come on when the door was open with the key in the ignition.
1992 is the last year of VW I would readily consider owning.
@JuniperBug:
In the 5 years I owned the [1992 Jetta] (I bought it at 10 years old), I changed one headlight bulb (…) which in my view is a hell of a lot better than today’s VW’s.
Yeah, the #9004 bulbs in your A2 Jetta lasted forever, but they also gave piss-poor lighting performance compared to today’s VWs.
IMHO, DRLs make it harder to see emergency vehicles and motorcycles and the benefits are statistically negligible
Screw statistics. Based on my experience during my daily commutes, I am now a strong proponent for DRLs for the simple reason that it minimizes the chance of getting broadsided by inattentive drivers who decide to pull on to the highway without looking for oncoming vehicles. Unless one is blind, it is hard to miss a pair of headlights heading in your general direction.
I rest my case.
Nowadays everything is “dumbed down”.
I agree. I like vehicles that are intuitive (forces one to actually use their brains) – not vehicles whose lights turn on automatically at dusk, or vehicles with a digital readout for a speedometer, or any sort of wizard or nanny device in many vehicles nowadays.
As far as DRLs are concerned, when one goes out, I change both bulbs (should always be done in pairs) myself. Anyone with rudimentary mechanical skills (and who can read a manual) can accomplish this task.
…anyone who hasn’t been “dumbed down”, that is…
JMII:
So I’d rather see progressive brake lights were you can tell a light tap of the pedal vs an “oh snap!” full-on, tire-smoking, panic-stop occurring by the clueless driver in front of me.
I’ve always wondered why brake lights don’t indicate the level of braking by intensity. And while we’re at it, if the driver tips the vehicle into antilock braking mode, the brake lights should strobe.
So I’d rather see progressive brake lights were you can tell a light tap of the pedal vs an “oh snap!” full-on, tire-smoking, panic-stop occurring by the clueless driver in front of me.
I’ve always wondered why brake lights don’t indicate the level of braking by intensity. And while we’re at it, if the driver tips the vehicle into antilock braking mode, the brake lights should strobe.
Or of course you could just leave enough room so you could stop no matter what they did instead of being so close you have to panic.
The European Union proposed mandatory DRLs.
This was opposed, succesfully, by the UK govenment.
The reason, it is usual in Europe for mororcycles to use dip beam in daylight. This makes it easier for car drivers to pick out an approching motorcycle, from both in front and behind. It was felt that if all vehicles had DRLs, it would be hard to pick out a motorcycle.
Or of course you could just leave enough room so you could stop no matter what they did instead of being so close you have to panic.
And that stops me from getting rear ended how?
And that stops me from getting rear ended how?
By allowing you to stop safely without drama and giving the moron tailgating you behind time to stop too.
@ Daniel Stern
Sorry for the late response. When I start the car, the DRLS come on. The yellow marker or taillights do not come on with them. I can still use turn signals, brake lights, etc. but they are not on like they would be when someone turns their lights on manually.
Also, when I start the car at night, the DRLs come on, then I switch the lights on (turning on the yellows and taillights). The DRLs do not brighten as if they were running on a lower beam, only the rest of the lights cut on to join the headlights.
Mine is a 2008 GTI.
@Daniel J. Stern
Fair enough, though a cynic may argue that 2 mediocre headlamps still provide better lighting than one working good one. =P
Now what’s VW’s excuse for today’s tail lights that are constantly burning out?
vento97:
As far as DRLs are concerned, when one goes out, I change both bulbs (should always be done in pairs) myself. Anyone with rudimentary mechanical skills (and who can read a manual) can accomplish this task.
Speaking of VWs, I see you’ve never been afflicted with a New Beetle. Pulling those headlight “cans” out of their sliding, rotating, often dirt/rust clogged mounts is not a minor task. Oh, and don’t forget to remove the battery first before even starting the fight with the L headlight. When you see a NB cruising with one eye out, now you’ll know why.
A common thread with DRL proponents is a sense of being threatened by other “morons”, and feeling reassured that subjecting them to headlight glare will do the trick.
It is an aggressive, condescending and simplistic attitude. Safety factors are always very complex and situational things.
There are studies and stats that show DRLs have a negligible effect.
So If I could communicate with you DRL proponents, say while in traffic. Say you were behind me at a stoplight, and your headlights were directly in my eyes in my rear view mirror, would you be kind and turn them off for me if there was a way I could communicate that request to you while you were behind me?
Personally I believe if some one is not mentally prescient enough to see an approaching vehicle in broad daylight, a set of head lights won’t matter.
ttacgreg:
Personally I believe if some one is not mentally prescient enough to see an approaching vehicle in broad daylight, a set of head lights won’t matter.
Since we’re fairly sidetracked anyway…
Many drivers may not be “prescient enough to see an approaching vehicle in broad daylight”, but what about the wide variety of lighting conditions other than daylight and complete darkness? A major complaint of DRL opponents has been addressed by modulating light output to 30% or so while operating in DRL mode. This solution (or using the forementioned LED solution) seems to address concerns on both sides of the debate.
There’s a problem with relying solely on statistical analysis to discuss the efficacy of DRLs, or any other safety measure. There are instances where a smart DRL system has been effective, and to those people that avoided accidents, DRLs had a meaningful impact, regardless of the statistical significance. If a smart DRL system is designed to minimize glare, fuel economy impact, production costs, etc., I see it as a net benefit, even if it only has “a negligible effect” on accident rates. There are good DRL systems, so rather than condemn all DRLs, we should support the good ones.
I had the same concerns as the OP for my MKV GTI so I used VAG-COM and use my fogs as DRLs. I could have disabled the DRLs entirely but I like the look of the fogs and they are cheap to replace (bought some Nokya yellows on ebay for 15 bucks).