The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) has unveiled a new regulation mandating automatic reversal capability on power windows and panels with “express-up” or “one-touch closing” operation. The proposed reg [pdf here] extends the NHTSA’s power portal caveat, which currently directs manufacturers to fit their products with “recessed switches to minimize the likelihood of accidental activation.” The actual language of the public consultation doc is a bit, uh, misleading: “The amendment would require power windows and panels on motor vehicles to automatically reverse direction [through force-sensing technology] when such power windows and panels detect an obstruction to prevent children and others from being trapped, injured, or killed.” Anyway, according to the agency, “approximately 6 fatalities and 1,955 injuries result every year from the operation of vehicle power window systems.” The tales are as horrific as they are infrequent. Whilst welcoming the move, one wonders how many KSIs result from the “normal” operation of car doors.
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The vast majority of European and Japanese market vehicles already include these basic safety features.
You know, my Popeil Veg-o-matic is in the shop, and I’ve got to make thousands of julienne fries. Thanks for the tip.
Or how about we actually monitor our kids when they’re around the car? One incident in my area several years ago had a little girl in the car with keys, by herself with no supervision. She sat on a window switch, rolled her neck up in the window, and was suffocated. The cure for this problem is to supervise your kids. Period. That would solve a lot of problems in this country, quite frankly.
I thought all vehicles manufactured by popular OEMs had reversals when a blockage is encountered during the automatic-up/express-up feature. Go ahead and try it by sticking your arm (or hand) out the window and watch as the window reverses when it starts to pinch your arm. I know I’ve tried it with my head/neck on a budget-priced Detroit car with great results.
The auto-closing rear doors on SUVs also have resistance or blockage sensors… try standing under the open SUV rear liftgate and hit the auto-close button. When the door starts to close on your head/shoulder it’ll reverse.
Rod: Set it! And forget it!
On topic, my Chrysler already has force-sensing express up windows. Problem is, sometimes they reverse themselves on the way up when there is no obstruction. My guess is they set the threshold very low from fear of lawsuits.
Or how about we actually monitor our kids when they’re around the car?
It’s not really practical to monitor them 24/7 – even the most vigilant parent is going to be distracted at some point.
That being said – do we have a list of cars that don’t have this. Every car I’m familiar with already has it.
The cure for this problem is to supervise your kids. Period.
Agreed with jmo, so much easier said than done.
The Hardware Solution is having the button pushed down to put the window down and PULLED UP to put the window up. I can’t imagine why this is standard practice.
@1981.911.SC:
I think there’s a voluntary agreement among manufacturers to include this type of switch on new vehicles. That said, I love auto-up/down windows.
Your taxpayer dollars at work. It has only been 50 years since power windows started to appear in cars, but NTSHA is hard at work.
While I am sympathetic to the suffering caused by these incidents, I’m not sure such a mandate is warranted.
Accidents happen, and rarely for a single cause. These window accidents require:
1. Keys in ignition.
2. Missing parent.
3. Window switch working opposite of normal (‘down’ for ‘up’).
4. Window to be down initially.
5. Child to be unbelted.
6. Child’s neck to be in window opening.
7. Child to operate the switch.
8. Child to be unable to reverse the window action.
The remote possibility of all those conditions occurring is the reason relatively few accidents like this happen.
The article would have you believe that the 40-80 lbs force exerted by power windows is somehow irresponsible engineering. On the contrary – the force is high to enable the window to operate in icy conditions, or to operate with aged components such as weatherstripping or with motors whose lubricant is dried up.
Having said this, the medicine must not be worse than the disease. For instance, how many deaths might occur if the safety mechanism fails, stranding the window in a semi-open position?
“Hurt or killed hundreds…”
Oh please. There’s only so much stupidity you can compensate for;
there comes a point where you compensate for so much
stupidity that it starts to cause problems for the
people who actually think in a normal way.
–chuck
@jmo:
It’s not really practical to monitor them 24/7 – even the most vigilant parent is going to be distracted at some point.
And that’s why the window lockout switch exists. Failure of a parent to leave it in the locked position (so only the driver can control the windows) is prima facie evidence of careless neglect.
Hear that sausage fingers, recessed switches. Time to look for roll ups.
For once I agree with the civil servants. I will circle this date on my calender.
Didn’t realize the wife had her fingers out the top edge of the passenger side door glass. Put the window up the last couple of inches badly pinching her fingers.
jmo :
August 28th, 2009 at 12:10 pm
It’s not really practical to monitor them 24/7 – even the most vigilant parent is going to be distracted at some point.
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Not really. As someone else pointed out, for this to happen, the key must be in ignition and the child not seat belted.
Gardiner Westbound :
August 28th, 2009 at 1:37 pm
Didn’t realize the wife had her fingers out the top edge of the passenger side door glass. Put the window up the last couple of inches badly pinching her fingers.
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Sounds stupid to me. But why?
@wsn: No parent deserves to have their child killed. I hope you’ll retract the words and the tone.
the key must be in ignition and the child not seat belted.
You’ve never heard of remote start?
If you in the snow belt or sun belt you often have the car warming up or the AC on while you load kids, cars seats, diaper bags, etc into the car etc.
Question: You come home from grocery shopping – do you unload the car first or do you leave you kid in the house alone while you unload the car?
I was the guy who got the responsiblity of validating the prove-out testing of the auto-reverse window regulators in the test lab.
They work, but every new design made me worry as it started to squeeze my fist. =:-/
In the words of Jeremy Clarkson to the British Government:
LEAVE US ALONE!!
And when your car is ill-tempered this can happen:
wsn should be banned!!!
Perhaps they should bring back the ’79 Malibu. That had fixed rear windows.
The old British puppets-as-real-people parody show “Spitting Image” had a skit with a ditzy president Reagan in bed. On the wall were two red buttons, close together and identical except one had the word “Nurse” on it and other said “Nuke.”
That must have been the inspiration for those “push down to raise window” buttons. Idiotic, as if the intention was to make disaster more likely.
P.S. If you think the show was harsh on Reagan, you should see how they portrayed the Royal Family. I was ROFL.
@Robert Schwartz: “It has only been 50 years since power windows started to appear in cars…”
Actually, it’s been almost 70 years. Power windows were available in the early 1940s on Packards.
Which makes your point even stronger.
That momlogic website linked to in this story said three kids died that week (in 2008) from being left inside a hot car. At this rate of KSI (I picked up a new term) and NHTSA’s rate, how many decades before we see occupant distress sensors? Apparently all it takes for NHTSA to put pen to paper is some populist outrage like the Explorer-Firestone under-inflation rollovers and poof! there’s a new car nanny. How long before cell phone jammers? How about effectively teaching some road rules instead?
On the other hand, I’ll bet three orders of magnitude more people are KSI slipping in the tub or falling off ladders, but tubs and ladders are still sold to the (unwashed) masses. Accidents happen, and let’s take reasonable well-researched and proven steps to prevent them, instead of knee-jerk laws. I predict the unintended consequences of these power window force sensors will cause a large number of windows to just reverse themselves as soon as they close, never staying shut. I hope my current car lasts forever….
Man…
I know those switches are off of a Taurus.
But why Ford waited so long to get the standard down is beyond me..
My 92 Accord has the pull up / push down flush switches…
Really..
How old is this ad?