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one of my dreamcars is a Jaguar XK coupe.
Sure didn’t take Mustang long to outsell Camaro with the new engines.
Z71 Silvy you’ve been trumpeting the Camaro outselling the Mustang for months of course totally ignoring the fact that Mustang buyers were waiting for the new drivetrains to be available. What do you think now?
Let’s see, the F150 handily outsold the Silverado/Sierra combined, Mustang outsold the Camaro, Fusion outsold the Malibu, the Fiesta will blow the doors off the Aveo and wait, come this fall the new Focus will positively trounce the Snooze er I mean Cruze. As Ricky famously told Lucy “you got some splainen to do”. I can’t wait.
He doesn’t ever have a single intelligent word to say.. about anything.
Why we / you / I would waste seconds to give a comment…
Humor, I laugh every time I read one of his posts!!
For future reference (when we look at June sales):
Camaro – No cash on hood, no super low financing
Mustang – 4,376/10,255 were 2010 models, $2,500 on the hood and financing between zero and 5.9 percent, 2011 models had $1,500 on the hood for returning lessees and conquests alike, plus financing as low as zero percent for 36 months
The Mustangs with the new powertrains aren’t on the lots en masse yet. The sales are the sea of remaining 2010s that Ford dealers are taking up to 10,000 off the MSRP of to get people to take them. The same cars that they were selling over MSRP last year when I looked. The Camaro still sells for MSRP and above, given that it’s sales strength is much more impressive.
Since they’re going to be priced about the same in the near future (if not already), it’d be interesting to see the results of a TTAC comparison between a 2010 4.6L V8 and the new, nearly as fast (and a whole lot more economical) 2011 3.7L V6, to see which is the better purchase.
Rudiger,
I’ve driven them both extensively. The new V6 is great but the old V8 is to be preferred, particularly if you’re ever doing to do so much as swap the cat-backs.
2011s have been available in numbers for most of May, and 2010 inventory is almost sold-through. No one is taking $10,000 off of 2010 Mustangs (at least no one around here). We are selling them easily with a $1,500 dealer discount combined with Ford’s $2,000 rebate or 0% finance.
2011s are so far selling at or very close to sticker (some dealers may be selling above sticker, but mine doesn’t do that out of policy)
I have a 2010 GT 4.6L 5spd manual, the base version that apparently nobody buys. I haven’t driven the new V6 but my biggest complaint with mine is the 5spd gearing, fifth is an overdrive period. Since I lease my cars I couldn’t wait for the 2011 models as I had to get a car in December. I’m thinking the new 6spd manual is highly preferable on the 2011 V6 or V8. If that’s the case I’d rather have the 2011 with either the V6 or V8. Since I lease I wouldn’t do any mechanical upgrades so that’s not a consideration. IMO the better mileage of the new V6 or the extra horsepower of the 5.0 combined with the 6spd trans makes it a no brainer to get the 2011.
@Nullomodo:
I’m about 200 miles north of you, and most 2010 Mustangs I’ve seen are listed at about $5K-$6K off MSRP.
Of course some of those dealers do have a $1100 dealer fee to make up for the lower price.
That can have a lot to do with it. Also, the ones we have left are for the most part base model V6s, so we don’t have much margin to play with. It’s probably just this area and the skewed demographics, but for everyone who says they only want a base GT with a stick and the performance package, those are always the ones ignored on the lot. Load up a V6 or a GT with leather, navigation, chrome wheels, and an automatic and we have people lining up to buy it.
It’s also interesting to see how people quantify a good deal. As you say, lots of dealers have huge dealer fees (ours is the lowest in town) and then add even more gross through charging $200 for a pin stripe, $500 for paint sealant, $100 for a nitrogen tire fill, and sticking that bump on every car on the lot. Sure they can afford to take more money off, they started off with close to $2,000 in fees and overpriced add-ons.
@ NulloMondo
the reason I would say the base GTs are ignored is because the GT is priced $3,800 more than a V6 premium, and $7,500 more than the base V6, $3,200 less than the GT premium. It is priced too high above the base V6, a V8 engine should not cost $7,500, plus I think it has comes standard with features that aren’t in the base V6 Like chrome tipped exhaust, 18 inch wheels, and body colored mirrors. For $3,800 less you can get leather seats for $3,200 more you can get a V8 and leather seats. To me it seems like a base V8 is a bad deal of a car. If I had to buy a mustang I would get a V6 premium with a glass roof(the only reason I would get the premium trim).
disclaimer: I got all my info at Fordvehicles.com and the prices are Ford’s sticker price without incentives or rebates.
Every time I see you writing things like “interesting how people quantify a good deal” or discussing dealer fees, I remember how back when I just started frequenting TTAC you expressed a strong disapproval of people who ask for the final amount. It was so maddening that I remember the injury vividly. And of course this is just what I do every time I visit a car dealer ever since. Fortunately I can afford to write a check right away so it’s entirely honest. Thanks for setting us straight here at TTAC, it was a valuable life lesson.
Pete –
Your memory is half right. I have no problem with people asking for an out the door or final amount price, especially when they are ready to do business.
The ones I have a problem with are the ones who take up hours of my time, get the pricing, then go off to the next dealer and say ‘so and so said this, what will you sell the car to me for’ and I lose the deal. Any deal will undercut any other dealer by a hundred bucks or so, and some people are so cheap that they will waste the salespersons time just to save a tiny bit on a huge purchase.
If I have a car you like, and you are ready to do business, it’s entirely fair to ask how much you can buy it for, but doing that ridiculous ‘one number one chance’ bull-dookie is childish. The dealer has to make a profit on the car, and you want a great deal, be willing to spend five minutes negotiating so you both come to a price you agree too and everyone leaves happy.
And actually, the more I think about it, the essence of my original comments back then was ‘don’t be an asshole and you’ll get better service’. There’s no point demanding pricing on a car until you’ve found the one you want, driven it, and had a chance to make sure it is one you would like to purchase. Similarly, when you walk into a car dealership sure, the dealer wants to make money off of you, but so does any other business you walk into, be it the grocery store or your favorite bar. Even your church wants your money, so you can’t say car dealers are out of place for being a business that would like to stay in business, which requires profit.
I will also say that my dealer does not play the games like what I posted above, we don’t have stickers charging hundreds of extras for dubious stuff. Some places do, and you can make your choice whether or not you want to patronize those establishments. If you see a charge for something you don’t agree with, use it in your negotiation. At the end of the day you will get the best price on your vehicle if you take a bit of time to talk with the salesperson rather than screaming and demanding and treating them like dirt. There have been plenty of times where we have bent over backwards to get something done for a customer who was nice and a pleasure to work with, whether it be calling the bank and seeing if they can score the person out for a better rate so we can hit the right payment, or getting that customer a discounted price from some supplier we use for something like window tinting or a stereo upgrade. Most dealerships aren’t playing the old games of hiding keys and having to talk to three managers before you get a real price, and that is a good thing. A few minutes worth of honest negotiation however isn’t a game, it’s just the best way to come to a price everyone agrees with. You deserve to get a good price for the car, and your salesperson deserves to earn a paycheck for taking the time to help you find the right vehicle, show you all of the features, and do all of the legwork that takes it transfer it from the dealer’s property into yours.
Sebring convertible sales are actually UP from last year? W.C. Fields was right.
VW Eos outsold the Miata this year and last… That’s surprising.
All of Mazda’s poor performance stats are surprising. Mazda makes great cars. From the Mazda3 to the CX-9, I would be happy to have any new Mazda in my driveway, and I think a lot of people who buy Toyotas, Hondas, or Nissans would choose the equivalent Mazda model over the big 3 Japanese brands if they ever gave it a shot.
Mazdas problem, as everyone has said, is in marketing. Mazdas are virtually invisible to most consumers, they don’t cross shop because they don’t know about them or don’t think about them. Suzuki is in a way in a similar position, Suzuki makes some genuinely good products, but when making the list of cars to check out for the next purchase, no one puts Suzuki on the list.
Doesn’t suprise me. Not when you green-light a grill for all model lines that looks like it was designed by the Joker.
Seems like a styling faux pas which ranks right up there with letting Chris Bangle design your cars.
It’s never surprised me. They’ve always been on the wrong side of the performance/comfort continuum for most Americans.
The abysmal sales of the Miata are an indictment of the American driving public.
I mean seriously, how many Avengers, Calibers and Nitros did people buy last month? OK, if you truly need a backseat regularly get a Mazda3, or even a 6, but a Sebring? Really? Come on!
OK, if you truly need a backseat regularly get a Mazda3, or even a 6, but a Sebring? Really? Come on!
Price sells. The Wal Mart shopping demographic is much stronger at Chrysler than Mazda. Also, I’m sure we taxpaying suckers are helping with financing for Chrysler’s customers with toe-tag credit ratings.
What’s shocks me: The Cayman/Boxster combo bests the RX-8 by a factor of 3!
Perhaps I should re-evaluate my possible RX-8 purchase and look at used Caymans… They’ll be around longer and might have a larger customer base.
Maybe the Miata customer already has one and will never replace it. That could describe me, I have a Miata I bought new in 1996. I still see a lot of the NA Miatas on the road. I toyed with buying a hardtop Miata a year or so ago but couldn’t justify paying that much to replace my long paid off fun car that is still fun and rock solid so instead I put a new soft top (tan, looks so much better than the stock black on my Montego blue car) and stereo system in mine and called it new.
Its interesting to categorize the nameplate in accordance with sticker…
The Camaro / Stang are newest.. with the Challenger in a distant 3rd (as Id thought.)
The rest are much higher price points.. and or older cars
Beetle is ancient
RX8 is going away
XLR I thought was gone
Eclipse had its fun 10yrs ago
tC needs a redo.. BADLY
Sebring should be beaten.. prob selling for a sweet – cheap song.
Miata is diff class..
But basicially old news.
Camaro / Mustang are the new toys.. to be trade in a yr or two off lease for the next new thing. . .
Sky is blue.. air is clear.
Old news.