Ever wonder what they call Canadian geese in Canada? Me too. I asked a Canadian, but she didn’t speak much English, she was facing away from me during the dance, and I couldn’t hear her over the DJ anyway.
This is the new “Grand C-Max” by Ford. In Europe, the C-Max is a “tall wagon” five-seater that competes with both the “Golf Plus” and the 1987 Honda “Wagovan”. VW sued on that. Said it was too close to the Vanagon. Anyway, there’s a bit of a fetish in Europe for hatchbacks that are just like regular hatchbacks only taller. I have no idea why. They aren’t any more useful. Think of it as our mini-SUV fetish. It’s just that stupid.
Back to this Grand C-Max, which is a small seven-seat minivan. Here in Sarah Palin’s America, there’s no regular C-Max, so the Grand C-Max is now the C-Max. You can have a turbocharged engine with it and a panoramic roof. Remember when you were trying to impress someone else on your favorite web forum and you said that, and I quote, “the only thing keeping me from buying a new car is the COMPLETE LACK of European turbo minivans?” Oops!
It’s 178 inches long on a 109.7 inch wheelbase. The original 1984 Chrysler minivan, to put this in perspective, was 175.9 inches long on a 112-inch wheelbase, and the 2011 Toyota Sienna is 200.2 inches long on a 119.3-inch wheelbase.
The base engine is the 2.5L Duratec we know from the current Focus, and there’s an optional 1.6L EcoBoost turbo. As with the Chevrolet Cruze, the purpose of the turbo is to deliver increased fuel economy at the same power level as the larger, naturally-aspirated mill. Both engines twist the traditional Ford six-speed auto.
The C-Max can park itself and there’s a fun little gadget called a “hands-free liftgate”. Just wave a foot at the bumper with the keyfob in your pocket, and the cargo door will magically open. This is great for young mothers or aging kidnappers. There will be some sort of SYNC/myFordTouch interactivity, and a full-length panorama roof is available.
The press release does not mention AWD, but in this market Ford would be wise to eventually make than an option. We’ll be showing you more on the C-Max when it officially debuts at the Detroit Auto Show in mid-January.
Many people, including Canadians, Americans, and other English speakers, actually call them “Canada Goose” the proper name for Branta canadensis.
I thought I’d be the first persnickety one to point that out, but you beat me to it! Brings back memories of a lecture by one of NY’s finest during a hunter’s safety course. Hilarious guy, but you didn’t want to say “Canadian geese” in front of him. It was almost as bad as when one guy said “deer horns.”
I hate Canadian geese.
A typical gaggle can drop 5 gallons of feces on a residental property in an hour.
Worst part about the geese is that you can’t fit more than two of them in a contractor garbage bag.
Canadian geese are like big rats with wings near me. No one will take my advice, which is hunt the geese and feed their meat to the homeless. 2 problems solved!
When I used to live in Toronto, I used to bike to work (down the Humber river valley, across the Martin Goodman trail on the Lakeshore, up University Ave). I bought full fenders for my bike not for mud or water, but to keep goose-sh*t that got stuck on the tires from splattering me in the face.
Never mind that the sheer volume of goose excrement makes the beaches unusable, let alone swimmable.
If someone decided to go open-season on the geese and use the results for a huge community Thanksgiving,** I wouldn’t have shed a tear, and I was brushing with veganism at the time.
** you know, if you can get past their diet of old hot dogs, chewing gum and dog crap.
Is there any other noun which is properly preceded by ‘Canada’ and not ‘Canadian’ ?
The reason so many people call it ‘Canadian’ Goose is that they are following a basic English rule which seems to apply to every noun except for this one particular bird.
Russia caviar, America spotted owl, Mexico chocolate…all sound like utterances of someone not familiar with English as it is commonly spoken.
Does the Canada Dry ginger ale in my refrigerator count?
Canada Goose is a name, and the mistake in this case lies in treating ‘Canada’ as if it were an adjective for characterizing geese associated with Canada. The same goes for Canada Dry.
Many people believe that the Canada Goose is protected, but there is an open season for them along with duck and other migratory birds.
Canada Goose tastes quite good too.
In western Canada, Snow Geese (thanks to warming temperatures in the arctic, where they breed) have become so numerous that there is now no limit to how many you can bag.
“I hate Canadian geese.
A typical gaggle can drop 5 gallons of feces on a residental property in an hour.
Worst part about the geese is that you can’t fit more than two of them in a contractor garbage bag.”
We here in Chicago have an innovative method for dealing with Canada Geese. Nature.
This is why the fire department does things like this:
http://www.chicagobreakingnews.com/2010/12/coyote-rescued-from-floating-ice-in-lake-michigan.html
Like so many fashions, this just seems like the original minivan come full cycle (at least in terms of size). We’ve seen the same thing in terms of cars (where the Fit now fills the original niche that the Civic once occupied, which now fills the niche that the Accord once occupied…), as well as SUVs (the new compact SUV/Crossovers filling the niche left by the original Rav4 and so on). It’s interesting that the expansion of these vehicles to their current size seems to have coincided with the ‘need’ for everyone to have 5,000 sq ft. homes. I’m not sure if there’s any real connection there or not, but maybe the recent need to be conspicuous is being tempered, at least in part, by a more frugal mentality.
I think the minivan is a great idea, and it will likely do well in Canada at least, where the Mazda 5 sells quite well.
Oh, and by the way it’s ‘Canada’ Geese up here, not Canadian Geese (perhaps a little confused by Canadian Whiskey?).
The only thing stopping me from buying a station wagon is that they’re too far away from me. But I’d like mine with a V8, manual and RWD. And yes, those exist.
A Saab 9-3 with 2.8T and XWD would be tasty as well.
You ALMOST had me with the turbo minivan……BUT, there’s no stick shift. Too bad, try again. LOL.
Jack,
You misheard me. I said a turbo diesel AWD compact minivan with that does a 12 second 1/4 mile and gets 40 MPG.
For less than $15K new.
Why is this so hard for automakers to get?
+1
You forgot it has to fly as well. Preferably can do vertical takeoff and landing and go from flight to freeway and vice versa seamlessly, without stopping. Now *that* would leave no more excuses!
If I had use for such a vehicle I wouldn’t hesitate to buy one.
The challenges will be cargo space (the 5 and Rondo suffer for this if the third row is up, and even folded flat the high load floor chews space) and fuel economy (real-world. the Sienna can approach the 5 and Rondo on the highway and does better than you’d think in the city).
Me, I’d have been happy with the 5 had Mazda added about 2″ of seat track travel.
Agree on the 5, the third row (which just has 2 seats on the Mazda5) has not enough legroom, just for small kids, not even a teenager fits comfortably on them.
Why not to add those 2 inches? anyway, the cargo space on the back is almost not usable with the 3rd row.
Salu2!
Our Rondo has been great, but the gas mileage with the smallish V-6 is only 21-22mpg overall, which is disappointing given that most of our miles are highway speed. It doesn’t seem right that I gave up lots of cubic inches to bigger minivans but get no better mileage. The load floor is a bit high, but the middle seats also load flat for lots of room in the back. Recently the Rondo was rated an ideal car for older folks, and I can see why. It’s easy to get in and out of, and the load floor is just about mid-thigh height. We have 68K on our Rondo with nary a problem except the cloth seats staining if you look at them wrong. Would we buy another one? Not if I can get the C-Max with a stick!
My wife has a 5, and I think we both agree that if it was 4-6 inches wider and longer (not taller), it would be perfect. It would still be substantially smaller than the Odyseey/Sienna/Caravn, but would answer our problems with knee and elbow room.
Style it sporty (like the current 5) and not like an SUV or a soccer van, toss in a v6 (or good turbo 4), add a little sound deadening, and we’d trade up in a heartbeat.
I’m surprised we haven’t already seen a hybrid Sienna that blows the compact minivans away in the MPG department.
No stick — no sale.
I know the Ojibwe word for Canada Goose is “Wawa”…which is where the Wawa chain of stores (based in Wawa, PA) gets its name and logo. Oddly enough, there don’t seem to be any sizable Ojibwe reservations in PA, but they’re all over Northern America/Southern Canada.
Aside from being horribly ugly (stats quo for new Fords) this one perplexes me.
After stating that the minivan market was dead, Ford introduced their QUOTE “minivan replacement”, the Flex…a mediocre vehicle that does not have the cargo room or utility of a minivan. Now, after stating the minivan market was dead…Ford is introducing a minivan.
This is why you can NEVER trust what Ford says…because they could say something one day, and say the complete opposite the next. They are the most dishonest, greedy, hypocritical company on the face of this planet.
It seems we can’t have any article on Ford without negative comments from this troll. Can someone please ban him?
Z71_Silvy has got a point. GM and Chrysler would never, NEVER spew any marketing baloney. I just can’t think of a single time either one has said something that favors their product line up. GM and Chrylser are always, ALWAYS, truthful, honest and objective. GM and Chrylser would -never- say one thing today then say the exact opposite a few months or years later when the situation is different.
We know we can trust GM and Chrylser because both were taken over by politicians and everyone with even one-half a brain know politicians always tell the truth and never change their position. Z71_Silvy has identified a problem unique to Ford that can only be resolved with a government takeover. I’m writing a letter to the President right now.
It seems we can’t have any article on Ford without negative comments from this troll. Can someone please ban him?
It’s not negative…it’s the truth. Why does the truth bother you so much?
————————————
Z71_Silvy has got a point. GM and Chrysler would never, NEVER spew any marketing baloney. I just can’t think of a single time either one has said something that favors their product line up. GM and Chrylser are always, ALWAYS, truthful, honest and objective. GM and Chrylser would -never- say one thing today then say the exact opposite a few months or years later when the situation is different.
We know we can trust GM and Chrylser because both were taken over by politicians and everyone with even one-half a brain know politicians always tell the truth and never change their position. Z71_Silvy has identified a problem unique to Ford that can only be resolved with a government takeover. I’m writing a letter to the President right now.
Once again…completely wrong. NO ONE ever said any of that. Try again at being witty.
“They are the most dishonest, greedy, hypocritical company on the face of this planet.”
Hmmm, there is a lot of competition for that prize. Google, AT&T, Verizon, Comcast, BP and any number of banks would all be in the running IMO.
I’d buy a subcompact tall wagon if the mileage was worth it. Don’t see a need for a turbo, though.
“She was facing away from me during the dance…”
Laughed out loud, Jack!
House of Lancaster, Toronto, perchance?
Oh God….the memories. Had to stop supporting this local dance ensemble when they installed an ATM. Lack of control on my part….but still was good times eh!
No, no, Jack! I said it had to be badged as an Oldsmobile!
Unfortunately for you ‘Mericans though, the previous C-Max was actually quite ok looking, while this new one, is not (IMO). Same goes for the previous Euro Focus and the new (global) Focus in hatchback trim.
Now the S-Max, based on the Euro Mondeo, that is still (even some years after it was launched and after a facelift that uglied it up considerably) the most attractive minivan you can buy (IMO). Nice interior too and available with the same 1.6 160HP ecoboost with MT or a 2.0 ecoboost with 203/240HP and flappy panels.
http://www.ford.nl/Personenautos/SMAX/FotosEnVideos
But I’m guessing that, again, it isn’t and won’t be sold in the US.
I kind of agree with you. All new Fords coming out of Europe are a bit too over-styled for my subtle tastes. The previous gen Mondeo, Euro Focus, Fiesta, C-Max, S-Max, and Galaxy were all better-looking than their successors. Only the Ka looks better than its predecessor, but it’s really a Fiat 500, so go figure.
I don’t know, both Ka’s don’t appeal to me, but the old one did at least have something special. It was a huge chick car of course, IIRC more than 70% were sold to women, but for what it was, the design worked quite well for well over a decade. The new one seems like a Fiesta mini-me (and it looks really, really tiny on the road). There’s just not much that sets it apart from other offerings in that market anymore and even within the Ford line-up, the Fiesta is only marginally more expensive while you get a lot more car.
2 friends of mine have old Ka driving GFs. I don’t think they’d recognise a new Ka if they came across one and I don’t think that’s a good thing for Ford.
I think Ford is starting to run into price resistance with their new products, and the success of the C-Max will depend on the pricing. If it’s going to be priced in the same range as the Dodge Grand Caravan, there could be significant issues. $20,000 Fiestas, future $24,000 Focuses and $26,000 C-Maxes might find it tough rowing. The much ballyhooed Fiesta, which must have had the most pre-production hype ever, is barely moving 3,500 units per month, and I’m betting dollars to donuts it’s because of the high price. Americans have clamored for Euro-spec small cars forever, but we still equate small with cheap.
People are used to being able to buy Fords dirt cheap. Changing the brand perception will take time. The real cheapskates won’t see the value and will migrate to other distressed brands.
I see the same thing at Hyundai. People come in all the time looking for $5000 off a new Tucson – which carries no rebates or dealer cash. They are politely thrown out.
Send them to Toyota…they have plenty of cash on the hood.
There are two sure signs that a car is going to do badly in the overall marketplace:
1) People on web forums assert that they would buy the car if it were made available to the public. The only Americans clamoring for Euro-Spec family haulers are the ones who end up buying the Honda Odyssey anyway when their wives throw in their two cents.
2) The vehicle has many more pragmatic and boring alternatives.
I’d rather see Ford spend some money upgrading a few of their manufacturing facilities in North America rather than commit whatever millions they’re about to dump into advertising, sales/service training, and incentives to dump these things into a marketplace that doesn’t want them.
I had to LOL at your point #1 because we just did this very thing. We were *this* close to buying a new Mazda5 sport late last month but hesitated because the only auto thus configured in the region had dealer-installed aftermarket leather kit the dealer was quite too proud of for our budget on said vehicle. Then my wife realized a family trip we had planned would have been impossible in that car (taking a total of three adults and three kids plus luggage for 3-4 days at a resort) due to unusable cargo space. We ended up buying a used 2006 Odyssey.
“The only Americans clamoring for Euro-Spec family haulers are the ones who end up buying the Honda Odyssey anyway when their wives throw in their two cents.”
Sad but true. Only single men really get to buy what they want and they don’t want or need a family hauler. If women don’t like a family hauler, it doesn’t sell very well.
Ditto here. I was pushing the wife to buy a Mazda 5 as our family truckster. She said it was too small to take the kids, other stay at home Moms, and their kids in one vehicle.
The front seats are too cramped, and the real world gas mileage is not that much better. Plus, a new set of tires are outrageous due to their oddball wheel size.
We’re going large minivan – especially since little crackerbox cars like the C-Max will be available forever. A larger car – maybe buy now, as maybe not available in the future.
I’m pretty sure I requested the S-Max, not the C-Max, in that forum post. The turbo engine was supposed to be the five-cylinder from Volvo, and the transmission a manual.
Oh, and the 2-3-2 seating you cannot get here in the Mazda5. But maybe the C-Max has this.
The S-Max used to have the turbocharged I5 from Volvo that was also available in the Focus ST and served as a starting point for the engine in the Focus RS. The C-max never had that engine so you’d be right then.
With the refresh however, Ford replaced the I5 in the S-Max with a 2.0 ecoboost (I4) in 203/240HP varieties (DIN).
2-3-2 seating in something this narrow isn’t all that helpful: either you squish people like sardines in a can, or you use an forward-offset “jump” seat that’s too narrow for a human being over five years of age.
We’re on our second Mazda5 and find it to be the perfect vehicle for our needs (two kids, 7 and 2) and the occasional use for the third row. Fuel economy, frankly, is far from a reason to choose this smaller van over a Sienna or Odyssey, we average about 25 mpg in mixed driving. This isn’t bad, but I don’t think the extra noise on the freeway and smaller cargo capacity is an equitable trade-off for a couple of MPGs for most families.
For us, the easy to handle size of the vehicle and pleasant way it goes about its business are key. We also got a loaded grand-touring model (leather, moonroof, no nav) for under $20k brand new. In comparison, a similarly loaded “full-sized minivan” would have been $10k more to buy and they feel like a school bus when trying to park in close quarters. I also just don’t believe in hauling around the extra mass because I might need the third row a couple of times per year. Also, as many new parents will attest, the amount of junk you carry around simply accumulates in proportion to the amount of space you have to carry it in. The Mazda5 is enough.
The Ford does offer the middle-row center seat which the Mazda5 only offers in Europe. Nice feature even if I’ll never use it. Our first 5 had a manual transmission and we loved it. On the second one, we just couldn’t find a manual transmission in stock anywhere and they no longer made it available with any trim levels above the base model. I know my wife is a rare and special woman, but she would have insisted in a manual transmission if it were available. She says it makes the car more fun to drive and less like a mom-taxi.
I’ve had adults (including myself) sit in the third row of our Mazda5 for some trips and it did just fine. The middle row seats can be moved forward to make more leg room. I was perfectly comfortable back there for an hour… seriously, how much room do you need?
My Father insists on buying a full-sized car so that the back seat is comfortable, but he only carried people back there perhaps 3 times in the 6 years he owned his last car.
Ford’s whole small car strategy is based on the assumption of higher gas prices pushing people to smaller cars. If that doesn’t happen, the small cars aren’t going to take off like Ford hopes. Luckily, Ford isn’t pinning ALL of its hopes on small cars and has competitive mid and full size cars also. The One Ford plan lets them field competitive cars in all sizes while minimizing development costs, so they can sell lower volumes of any of these cars and still make money.
We have three kids under 4 and would consider this if the 5 person config had more cargo space. We have a Passat Wagon which has 39 cu ft behind the rear seat – bigger than many much larger and less efficient vehicles. Three car seats fit across the width with about 1 inch to spare. We would like to carry more persons sometimes (au pair, cousins) but need to step up to a large vehicle or sacrifice a lot of cargo space in five person mode to carry the extra one or two people. We both like the handling and low entry height of cars.
If the C-Max were about 18 inches longer, it would have the needed cargo space. We also don’t want features like the auto rear gate due to complexity and weight. I’m really tired of seeing my needs fall in the gaping chasm left by the existing vehicle sizes that all manufacturers seem to adhere to. The Mazda 5, while able to carry 6, has little luggage space in 5 person mode and does not get very good mileage – like most Mazdas in every class.
The “tall hatchback” and “small SUV” phenomena are indeed very much the same thing. People want a higher road view, headroom to put the baby in his baby seat and to help the kids on board, room for >5, decent mpg, and an exterior package compatible with short driveways and small garages. There are already several vehicles with 3 rows and a similar length as the C-Max, some more successful than others: RAV4 with the 3rd row, Kia Rondo, and of course the Mazda5. Add a foot and you get to the Dodge Journey (currently the topic of the latest post), which may really be the sweet spot in the trade-off between too big and too small, but it seems everybody else is building for 200+ inches.
So close, Ford. But it looks like you forgot the diesel option and you’re missing a pedal. So I guess the Golf wagon will have to do in North America. (It’s not a Jetta).
Actually, Jack, I believe the official TTAC-commenter-desired vehicle is a RWD diesel wagon with a stick.
The original Colt Vista seated seven in under 175″ length. http://www.productioncars.com/vintage-ads.php/Dodge/Colt+Vista With 88 carbureted horsepower, it was ready for high-efficiency people hauling. Crash results would probably not be impressive by today’s standards. The curb weight was significantly less than a current Cobalt.
My folks had one of those when I was growing up. Decent vehicle, if I remember correctly.
If VW doesn’t make good on their promise to develop a new Microbus, then this might be my people-hauler of choice.
I’m SOOOO close to wanting. So close.
But what’s the deal with the 2.5L vs. 1.6t substitution? There should at least be an sportier version…2.0t, for example. That’s an existing Ecoboost engine that could serve as the top-end engine choice. Maybe even pair it with an optional stick…
I’m kinda thinking about business use for this one. Unfortunately, Ford makes Transit Connect which is even better for the mission.