With a number of shocking nameplate-engineering jobs on deck (who’s ready for a Chrysler 200-based Lancia Flavia?), Fiat’s easing into things with one of the more innocuous moves on the to-do list: rebadging Dodges Journey as a Fiat. In Europe, the Freemont will slip into obscurity between Fiat’s Qubo and Doblò, much as the real Fremont struggles to serve as more than a unnecessary and unwanted distraction between Oakland and San Jose. And even though European buyers don’t buy many midsized crossovers, and don’t come to Fiat when they do, the Journey has been reworked to live up to the refined tastes of the European soccer mom. From retuned steering and suspension, to diesel engines, a new instrument panel and more soft-touch materials, The Freemont is a Dodge Journey for people who aren’t willing to buy shockingly poor-quality vehicles on the strength of inane advertising alone. And since they’re not calling it the Multipla, there’s no tip-toeing around comparisons to storied predecessors. But the fact that Fiat isn’t used to selling vehicles like the Journey is already showing up in its marketing literature, which enigmatically refers to the Freemont as a
“factotum vehicle” which has been “designed to meet the diverse needs of families and those seeking a spacious, comfortable and versatile vehicle to cater for the frenetic pace of everyday life or weekend leisure time”
Fiat’s badge engineering is making GM’s years of doing this look like child’s play.
This is not badge engineering. A proper rebadge is when you make two vehicles for sale in the same market with no other changes but grill and headlights/taillights. This vehicle will not be sold in NA but in Europe. Although there are some Journey’s over there, market penetration is so small it won’t matter. Most likely Journey sales will cease.
What’s really wrong with this picture? Why are we not getting the small diesel in our cars?
What’s wrong with it is that it in no way resembles other FIATs.
And why misspell “Fremont?” What’s next, the “Deetroit?”
@ windswords Tomayto, tomahto. You can tiptoe around what constitutes a rebadge all you want. If they’re making one basic vehicle and putting multiple emblems on it, no matter how many markets it’s in, it constitutes a rebadge. Example: the Pontiac G8 is a Holden rebadge, even though we didn’t get the Commodore in the states (it was also a Vauxhall too).
I’m with windswords.
@jrlombard, and Potayto, Potahto. Regardless of how you personally feel, that IS the definition of a rebadge. If we use your definition, then most Lexus cars (Lexi?), especially the early ones sold in NA were rebadges of Toyotas sold in Japan. And so are the Scions. A Chevy Celebrity and a Pontiac 6000 are rebadges. A G8 and a Commodore are not. Not here in NA. I heard they sold some in OZ with the G8 nose, in which case THAT is a rebadge.
Wow, that’s a bad rebadging job. There are rumors that Fiat is planning to rebadge the Journey in South America as well, to boost sales in Brazil. I hope they only rebadge this in Brazil, because over here in Argentina it’s one of Chrysler’s best selling models, but sales would drop instantly if it were rebadged as a Fiat.
I don’t agree / No estoy tan de acuerdo, Magnusmaster
Competitive pricing is what make Fiats roll in South America, price this well and it will be a hit for Mercosur families as well. Don’t forget there is a Fiat dealer in every corner of both countries, unlike Chrysler (for now).
Here in Venezuela there are more Chrysler dealers than Fiat’s. And Fiat only get Sienas because of political rubbish.
A diesel Journey? Why better quality materials? Why not?
Even without being a commercial success, it could help reducing Chrysler production costs due to economies of scale.
And it won’t cannibalize Fiat sales since they don’t currently sale a similar vehicle.
Why not?
Better interior with a diesel? I see nothing wrong with that. Really, why not sell that vehicle here?
I don’t really care for the grill, but the idea is great. I really like the way the Fiat designers have massaged the look of the Journey. A turbodiesel in one of these would be a capital idea, and would be a great option in the US for people who need to haul.
I see absolutely nothing wrong with that picture. I always liked the concept of the Journey, just not the execution based on Chysler’s reputation since the “Ultradrive” debacle started it all. That’s the main reason I won’t buy one, but I sure like ’em, though. It could very well be the “world’s best/most perfect vehicle” if the quality was up to par. In today’s world of commerce and economic realities, re-badging appears to be the order of the day. It ain’t the ’60’s anymore. I’m well over that and am glad that at least Fiat’s trying to make the Chrysler marriage work.
Please see my reply to Mr. Walton above.
Dude, the Ultradrive is sooo early 90’s. Should I not drive a new Jaguar because of Lucas electronics?
Understood, windswords, but the tranny problems didn’t fully go away for years. Chrysler kept renaming the tranny, but problems persisted. No, I don’t know about now, ’cause after being a Chrysler fan for 20 years, I just gave up and went back to Chevy. After the Ultradrive issues, the 2.7L sludge began with the 1998 models. That lasted for 5 or 6 model years. As far as what you want to drive now, I don’t know. I researched my Impala for quite a while before I bought mine and so far, so good. Jaguar? I love ’em, but don’t know enough to make a judgment one way or another. I’m not in the market, so I’m not digging deep into anything at the moment, just taking into consideration of what I read on here and other sources. Anyway, I hope the Fiat/Chrysler thing really does work and the quality measures up to the majority of the market now.
I can only tell you of my experience. I read that the problems with the Ultradrive units were solved early on (unlike Honda). Since ALL car makers have new trannys that fail, ANY Chrysler failures were chalked up to the original issues not being fixed. Fact is there is always a small percentage of tranny’s that go south, but it should be very small. At its worst, the Ultradrive failure rate was 17%. The way the media reported it, you would be forgiven for thinking it was 75%. We just saw a similar situation with Toyota. The actual percentage of UA was small but the media made it seem big. As for me, we purchased a new 94 Grand Caravan (they actually had 2 sizes back then) with the 3.3 and Ultradrive. Even though it was pulling the heavier minivan model it was fine. Knowing what I know now I would not have bought a heavy vehicle like the Grand for this tranny. This was also Honda’s problem with their automatics.
My only other experience with Ultradrive was a 1990 LeBaron convertible with the smoking Mitsu V6 (something Mitsu also fixed on later models – but go ahead and say you are thinking of buying a V6 Mitsu powered vehicle from the middle or late 90’s and watch everyone tell you not to do it because the engine smokes). This was an early Ultradrive tranny model that failed on me while driving thru southeastern PA. But by that time the car had 135,000 miles on it. And I bought it used so I don’t know how good or bad the original driver treated it.
As for the 2.7 engine sludge, that problem was also solved early on and later 2.7’s are racking up 2 and 300,000 miles with good care. From what I have observed Toyota not only had a more widespread sludge problem, it was also longer lived because they did not want to admit they had a problem and blamed it on the owners, even refusing warranty claims.
windswords: Once again, I pretty much agree with you. When I said I “gave up” on Chrysler, that wasn’t accurate. We just went in a different car direction as my wife wanted a small SUV (CUV) back in 2002. We had a 1999 Stratus we literally drove off the showroom floor that was a superior car in all respects (2.4L auto). I drove a 1996 Ranger. We sold the Dodge and bought a CR-V for a number of reasons (PT Cruiser – too small, Ford Escape – 4 cyl not powerful enough, V6 too thirsty) – although I’m not that thrilled at the CR-V’s mpg either, maybe no better than the Escape, but my wife loved it, and that was that! I always look at Chrysler at the auto shows and maybe one is in my future again.
The problems with the Ultradrive are severely overblown anyways. The majority of Ultradrive “failures” are caused by smaller issues that could be fixed without a total tranny overhaul. However, whenever any of these components go bad, it causes the transmission to go into “limp” mode – shift into second gear and stay there. The Ultradrive is one of the, if not the, first transmission to have this feature. Many mechanics would then swindle the customer and/or Chrysler (if it was still under warranty) just by claiming that the transmission itself it shot. I wouldn’t have been surprised if they just replaced whatever minor part triggered the “limp” mode and then just charged the customer or Chrysler for a complete transmission replacement. Sounds like something that a dishonest dealer/mechanic would do.
Lets also not forget any Ultradrives that have gone down because the owner/mechanics who didn’t know any better, ran them on Dexron. You can only run a Chrysler automatic on ATF-4 fluid.
I’ll take mine in tan/brown and call it Rudolph!
@Blue +1. Hey, that’s funny! I wish I had thought of that…
Maybe I can get mine in Tuxedo Black and call it “Rodney”…
The Freemont err I mean Journey is more on par with the European minivans – bigger than the Ford C Max class. I believe one of the issues Chrysler has was marketing it as a cross over when it was really a compact (by US terms) minivan. 4 things i feel would have improved it
Fit sliding doors
Update interior (done)
Replace horrible engines (sort of done)
Improved ride (done – in Europe at least)
Does this remind anybody of the Saab 9-7X? How is it different?
The 9-7x was based on the GMT 360 body on frame chassis, like the Trailblazer. This is based on the unibody Avenger (I think) chassis. More like a Ford Edge than a Trailblazer. I’d had a similar thought when I first saw the photos, then I realized the lower ride height and the ten spoke wheels is what made it look like an old Saab.
Please see my reply to Mr. Walton above. The 9-7X was for sale in the same market as the trailblazer. This is not.
Yes it reminds me of a Saab, but I was thinking the Saabaru not the Saablazer.
I’m aware of the technical differences, I was referring more to the philosophical ones. Although granted, not being in the same market is significant.
But it does look very Saab-y, esp the front clip.
As a diesel here, it could have a market all to itself. Especially in AWD form.
Ed the review you link to is the old Journey that is no longer made. The new one is supposed to be much better. New engine, new interior, new suspension tuning.
Speaking of Fiat and rebadging, has anyone else seen any significant Fiat branding/marketing yet in the US? There’s a Chrysler/Dodge/Jeep dealer near downtown LA that has added a Fiat logo to the outside of the building, and there’s a Fiat 500 billboard nearby–although I have yet to see any TV advertising for either the brand or the specific vehicle. (This is not far from the LA convention center/Staples center area, so maybe these are leftovers from the LA Auto Show, particularly the billboard.)
I am happy to see what Sergio is doing to Chrysler, I hope same TD version could be sold in North America as well. It would become a valid option to my Mazda 5 replacement along with 2012 Mazda 5 and C-Max.
I used to think Fiat was propping up Chrysler, but now I’m beginning to think it’s the other way around. First it was the Lancia badged 300 “prototype”, now it’s a Journey based Fiat. The Euro-market big car lineup Fiat lacked is being filled with Chrysler platforms. When will we see Fiat-based A and B segment Dodges? Where’s the next Neon/PT Cruiser?
Even with a new diesel engine, tweaked suspension, a revamped instrument panel and interior – it will still be a re-badge of North American Dodge Journey, just like many Chevys are rebadged Daewoos. In short, that ain’t no FIAT.
The Freemont is a Dodge Journey for people who aren’t willing to buy shockingly poor-quality vehicles on the strength of inane advertising alone.
2009 Dodge Journey Review
By Michael Karesh on February 22, 2008
Shockingly poor quality? Based on a review done two years ago of a vehicle born of Daimler and Cerberus? … that company has long been bankrupt!
The vehicle above has new interiors, new engines, better driving dynamics.
https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2010/10/whats-wrong-with-this-picture-the-long-journey/
As far as the rebadge. It doesn’t look overdone. I think it will sell enough to pay the electrical bill.
I tell you what’s wrong. The Europeans get the “better” vehicle and you gringos don’t.
The upside of this is that you get the properly powered version (V6) and they get the underpowered one (as usual).
being sold through the 2nd largest network in the country, and using the brand (and being backed by that brand), i1m sure the obsucre Journey will imorove sales 10-fold. From less than 100 a month to around 500 to 700 a month. Be happy boys , it’ll send money to Italy and America!
WIll be best selling Chrysler since the 70s. Though Chrysler no more. Here the diesel versin will outsell the flex fuel version from 8 to 10 – 1.
And to commentator above, don’t worry. Neon is in the works. Doubt is if it will be based on Bravo or Linea (heard that story today in the morning – breaking news – or hearsay – but the guy I talked to ususally is in the know).
Neon getting back is FTW.
Ed,
Nasty job of trolling in your own blog! Threatening desecration of the Flavia legend in the first line of your piece. What’s next, trashing of the memories of the Fulvia or the Flaminia? Lets hope the cross pollination of the Lancia and Chrysler brands improves both.