While we wait on the latest round of registration data from Europe (April 2013), a look at January-March 2013 data paints a bleak picture for Alfa Romeo.
Having moved 17,545 cars across 29 countries in that period, Alfa is being beaten by such storied nameplates as Mitsubishi, Smart and even struggling, Lancia/Chrysler. SEAT, VW’s ailing brand which gets its share of criticism for having no direction or identity, is crushing Alfa, having sold just under 70,000 units so far.
For such a strong brand, Alfa’s lineup is dismal, consisting of just two dated compact hatchbacks. New product cannot come soon enough. The 4C is a halo car, but Alfa is one brand that really doesn’t need anything to further boost its image. What it does need are mainstream products that are competitive with the Golfs, Mondeos and other mainstream nameplates across the world. Hopefully we’ll see something soon.
It’s ugly and not very fast. Just cause the makers of Quantum of Solace think these can keep up with a DBS’ V12, doesn’t mean they can.
I though the 159 was pretty damn good looking myself. Certainly the best 4-door done the in the last decade at least.
But it’s no longer in production, so your point isn’t particularly accurate.
I think the problem is that the Mito and Giulietta just aren’t good enough relative to the competition to overcome the tranditional Alfa baggage. And they suffer as a result from an especially accentuated version of the problem affecting Renault, Peugeot, Citroen, Opel, Fiat itself, and almost everyone does. Europeans cannot afford the traditional C and B class offerings at premium prices. Seat are value leaders, hence their success.
There are still many Europeans that can afford premium B and C class offerings. It’ just that they are buying A3s, 1 series BMWs, Minis and Golfs / Polos.
Yes some can, but the volumes are down the discounting is significant. Those who give up margin for volume can find it very difficult to get out of that trap if it affects the perceived value of the product.
It is a very interesting looking chart though. In terms of mainstream manufacturers, the biggest gainers (as a %) are Honda, Dacia, FIAT, Kia and Jaguar/Land Rover.
Fiat needs to make a decision about what Alfa is – the BMW/Audi competitor it could (and should) have been, or a seller of tarted-up Fiats.
It’s a tough decision to make with no money and no market. Plus Alfa’s reliability today makes an old Jag look like a new Toyota. They could potentially do well with a new platform, but you know what that would cost and how much volume they would need to justify it. It would pretty much be a “bet the house” hail mary.
The only way I could see them surviving is if they piggybacked on Fiat’s expansion here, and brought over a high fashion compact CUV to do battle with the likes of the Evoque, Q5, and X4. Outside of that there is nowhere to penetrate.
There is a market, even in Europe. Look at the sales of Audi, BMW, Mercedes, or even JLR.
But Alfa Romeo has been consistently starved of product since Fiat took over in 1986, and fundamentally nothing has changed since Marchionne took over the helm at Fiat.
Well put. The old Alfa Milano was a worthy competitor to the BMW 3 series. Perhaps the only worthy competitor to teh 3 series. That’s the type of RWD performance car they need to bring back.
Also-ran FWD econoboxes is not going to bring them back.
They do have a compact CUV like that — the C-SUV. They need a better name for it.
Not surprising at all. Just two cars in the range. 90% of sales from EU, TCT option only with certain engines, No other variants like wagons, Coupes etc.
Actually the Giulietta is still a very competitive product but the Mito is not. But you can’t hold onto market share with just that. They both get refreshes soon and next year will see the so called 169 sedan and 2015 the Duetto and Giulia. Hopefully entering the US will give them a much needed sales boost.
I think it might be too little too late. Their home market is looking poor for the foreseeable future, and it will be hard to re-establish themselves in North America (and establish themselves in Asia). They will need an absolutely killer product with very, very effective marketing behind it to get the impact they need. I don’t think that FIAT can deliver that, sadly.
MiTo and Giulietta facelifts are not due until 2016, the year after the Giulia and the Miata, err, roadster. The large sedan wasn’t on Marchionne’s latest roadmap so who knows when it will arrive.
You are a bit out of date I’m afraid or you are mistaking facelift with replacement. Both are due by September. There are already leaked pics of Mito changes on the net and the Twin Air will be upped to 105bhp. The QV will also get a power hike. Large sedan is based on the Maser Ghibli and since that’s already launched that would be one of the easiest models to be launched. Nothing official but if you go on to many forums and news pages you will see that it’s already in development. The SUV should also come out fast because the new Cherokee is launched and the so called Jeepster’s development is said to have been completed. (The rumour is that Alfa is debating about which segment of SUV they wish to be in)
I guess Internet forums are a more reliable source of information than Marchionne’s official product plans …
Definitely. Marchionne sells loads of dummies. Reasons – Confuse unions, Confuse vw, buy time, who knows. In my experience the “insiders” on various forums are the best source. They provide info that comes out months or even years later. Even the 4C news was spoken months before the Geneva unveiling of the show car.
Why is there no 159-replcement carving out a small niche of “not another 5-series clone?” Alfa’s are so pretty, and I know people who, 5 years ago, would buy them KNOWING they were going to have issues because it was not just another BMWercedAudi…
Not that they will, or that it will be submitted for US-cert, or will sell more than 3 here, ever.
/sigh.
That would have been me. Right around 2005-2007, I got excited every time there were rumors of Alfa reintroducing itself to the states because I wanted a 159. I would have been the first guy at the dealership, KNOWING that this car was going to be a headache.
But nope.
The best thing that could happen to Alfa Romeo is to be sold to Audi.
How about keeping the brand and let Mazda build all the cars?
As Alfa owner in Tokyo, that is my most convinient and satisfying scenario.
LDMAN and ccode, in a word, no!
+1.
There is also the issue that Alfa’s aren’t as pretty as they used to be. Every so often I see a Brera in person and my heart stops a little. So pretty.
The Brera, like the 159, was designed by Giugiaro’s ItalDesign Studio. That studio, of course, is now part of the Volkswagen Group, under the direction of Walter de Silva, who himself led the design of the 147 and 156.
156, one of the most beautiful sedans of all time, if you ask me.
There is no way one can compare Seat with Alfa. Vw has failed completely making Seat a sporty alternative. It is just a mainstream car competeing with European Ford, Renault and Peugeot and …
I can not believe the rumors saying VW is interested in Alfa, they have problems enough.
But Alfa has potential, but needs more and new models. Alfa is not unreliable any more, quite good actually. Most of the technology is from Fiat. Fiat is not Toyonda but I would prefer an Italian car any day before a French car (ok doesn’t say much!).
Alfa don’t need to go mainstream!!! There are enough Fiat, Opel, Golf, Huyndai, Kia and …
They should be drop dead georgeous and sporty, competing with BMW and Audi. It will be tough though and a lot of money are needed!
At this point in time, Alfa Romeo is pretty much just a dead brand with some good memories. Kind of like MG was in 2005.
Hopefully it still has a better future than what MG is today. Marchionne’s repeated promises have not turned into any actions.
Nice analogy.
I think Seat was mentioned because they managed to outsell Alfa. Which isn’t surprising, because Seat is VW’s low end value brand, much like Skoda, while Alfa is premium brand in mold of BMW and Audi. And frankly, even though I don’t see a reason for VW purchasing Alfa, seeing as they already have premium brand in Audi, this would be the best thing to ever happen to Alfa. Seems like whatever VW touches, turns to gold; see Lambo, Audi, Ducati, etc.
And i say all of that as Fiat owner, that wishes Alfa the best, as i am hoping one day to own one.
“And i say all of that as Fiat owner, that wishes Alfa the best [sic!], as i am hoping one day to own one.”
Just go ahead and buy that Audi already.
At last someone with some knowledge and sense. Totally agreed!
I think the only way they can survive is scale. They must compete in more segments, more markets. I would imagine it is difficult to find development money for a brand that is selling less than 100k units in Europe per year. I dont know what they sell abroad, but my guess is that Europe comprises most of their sales. Thus, they need to hit the market sweet spots. Small CUV, Midsized CUV, B-segment hatch, C segment hatch and midsized sedan, wagon variant. The roadster and 8C provide the halo. They should leverage Chrysler resources and engineering/platforms/parts to affect a turnaround. Hopefully this can be done without diluting the brand and the image. Automakers seem to have become quite adept at disguising cheap mass market underpinnings and incorporating them into upscale packages.
Personally, I think Alfa Romero has a lot of potential in the US simply because it is not a BMW, Merc, Audi, dam the reliability. It may not be the ultimate driving machine or the ultimate snob mobile but they are beautiful and that is certainly a reason to ditch the mainstays.
But I think they have to go all in with a full scale product assault and market expansion or the best alternative is simply to sell off the brand. I dont know if the money is there for the product assault unfortunately.
During the Geneva auto show a few months ago, Marchionne said that the US is the key to an Alfa revival, and that previous plans to revive the brand in the US were in fact never executed. However, he’s less certain about a European revival of Alfa:
http://www.edmunds.com/car-news/us-is-key-to-alfa-romeo-revival-says-marchionne.html
Let’s hope Marchionne is given the opportunity to execute his strategy, and that it’s not derailed by financial problems or by brand euthanasia (masquerading as a rebirth, no less) delivered by a certain Austrian auto executive.
I think Sergio’s strategy is the only way forward for Alfa. VAG cannot offer a future, and without North America there is no potential market. The EU offers no future. Asia (excluding Japan) has no previous exposure. It’s North America or bust.
I don’t think the 4C can function as the brand leader though. You need an excellent C-segment entry level premium car and matching cross-over to drive volume and create broad awareness and word of mouth.
Basically, without a 3-series killing Giulia and Evoque equivalent they’re screwed.
They should sell the 4C as a Chrysler Venom here. It might piss off Hennessy, but he’s a jerk anyway.
You mean SRT Venom, right?
They need to let Pininfarina design the sedans. Alfa’s inhouse sedans have been frequently ugly.
I get the feeling that many people have not have fully grasped what the 4C Halo car is all about. Most people think it’s a Boxter/Cayman rival. It’s much more than that. It’s got a weight to power ratio way better and more in 911S territory . It’s got a carbon tub that’s found only in hyper cars from Bugatti and Ferrari. It’s the first time such tech has been offered in such a low segment. It’s a class defining car filled with new tech. That’s just what Alfa used to be in their glory years. So in a way the 4C is the car that’s taken the brand back to its roots after decades of mismanagement and wandering.
I question how low they can get the price on that and still make money. More to the point, I don’t see how it helps revive Alfa as it’s so low volume. I think they need something a bit more mainstream to really make progress as seeing these cars on the street will really make a difference for awareness.
Agreed … especially so on the second point.
FYI the launch edition is sold out in Europe. We tried to get a car from UK to Asia and there is no way. Even though the regular production versions’ price is not out the UK dealers we are in contact with have already taken lots of deposits.
“I don’t see how it helps revive Alfa as it’s so low volume”
I see it humiliating the class best and scaring the class above. If that will not grab headlines nothing will. Think of it as a 4 cylinder Ferrari (Scuderia). It’s Italian, it’s mid-engined, it’s built in a Maserati factory, it’s made of exotic material, The engine was developed buy a Ferrari F1 engineer, it’s ultra light-weight and promises to be very quick. Apart from setting Alfisti hearts on fire it’s the stuff of dreams for most petrol heads .
How could it go wrong??
Unfortunately Alfa Romeo has always had a regional hold in Europe and that is disappearing fast.
After spending a couple weeks in Europe this April, I was impressed by the beauty of a couple of Alfas, the 159 and the 147. Unfortunately, I don’t believe that they are current models…and I didn’t see many other new Alfas.
Looking at the other sales numbers for Europe is eye-opening after recently traveling those roads. Europe is a very different market than North America. Example: Where are the Japanese makers? They seem to barely exist…Hondas and Toyotas are rare sights. Nissans are more popular (we had a rental Nissan Note which wasn’t really worthy of noting) but still not strong. Audis, VWs, BMWs, Minis, and Fords seem to be everywhere. The French seem to have a fairly strong presence, too. The Hyundai-Kia numbers are worthy of analysis. What average American would believe that they’d outsell Toyota and Honda combined?
“I was impressed by the beauty of a couple of Alfas, the 159 and the 147. Unfortunately, I don’t believe that they are current models”
You’re right – both models have been discontinued (the 147 has been replaced by the Giulietta, but the 159 has not been replaced yet). The 159 and 147 were designed by Giorgetto Giugiaro and Walter de Silva, respectively, who both have since been poached by VW, where they now work as Xerox operators, which seemingly provides great job security, but which means they cannot use their now dormant design talents for the benefit of other carmakers (perhaps that was the point of recruiting them?).
Wait till 2015. Any comments about Alfa in 2013 make no sense.
They are at starting point of new era: US market, E class based on Maserati Ghibli, SUV for the first time, , D-segment sedan + SW, new compact + subcompact, Spider in cooperation with Mazda (MX-5).
1-st step = Alfa Romeo 4C, fantastic car at Porsche price and they are selling it.
Now just wait for next entries and comment after that, not now.
Ah yes, the “just wait two more years” argument.
Fiat has used that one for more than a decade.
It’s also not an argument. Yes, pls wait 2 years.
Recent years Fiat was almost absent in Europe if we talk about new models investments. Same Fiat, same Alfa, same Lancia. Fiat was very busy consuming Chrysler and investing in Brazil + China.
Now Fiat is back in Europe. And how it works ? They promised Fiat 500L, Alfa 4C, Maserati Quattroporte, Maserati Ghibli. Any disappointment ?
Now we wait for next Alfas, Maserati Levante, Fiat 500X, Jeep B and you will see them as well. Same as Alfa’s return to USA with new model range.
Pls don’t speak about past, now we talk about Fiat investment plan they showed last time, so far all in order.
Yes, I think new models will probably come mañana … that’s what Marchionne has been saying for almost 10 years, so must be true this time, right?
Sorry but I remember quite a lot Alfa models last 10 years.
OK, let’s do a complete list of new mass-market Alfa Romeo models developed under Marchionne’s watch (not ones already done and just launched):
1. MiTo (2008)
2. Giulietta (2010)
That’s it. The 159, Brera and Spider were already developed when Marchionne took over, and the 4C and 8C are basically handbuilt limited-production cars.
But maybe two new models in 9 years is a lot for you?
You said 10 years, then 159, Brera and Spider counts. Why Marchionne should have developed another 159 ?
Yes, only MiTo plus Giulietta. Already explained that Fiat left Europe last years.
And now they are back.
4C is important model. Same as new Maserati models. Fiat is back and you talk about past again.
ps. Fiat signed a deal with Mazda for new Spider production (2015)
I didn’t count 159, Brera or Spider because Marchionne inherited those projects. He has only authorized and brought to market two new mass-market Alfa Romeo models in nine years.
hey th009!
Automaniak has a point. Being in the position they were, Fiat had to prioritize. Gaining a foothold in China, developing and widening their lead in Brazil (they are building that second plant in Brazil that rumor has it will produce a small CUV under both Jeep and Fiat brands, for isnstance – all for 2015 or 16!). Alfa was probably deemed a lost cause in Europe with the current line and the general weakness of Europe.
However, the 4c and the adamant refusal to sell to VW means they still have plans for the brand. Now, with Chrysler making money in the US, Fiat in Brazil, a hopeful start in China, some gains in Europe with the new Fiat cars, maybe Alfa will become more prevalent. They just might have something in 15 or 16!
Also, you made a comment trust internet buzz more than official plans…well that’s just it pretty much. Lots and lots of crap on the internet, but most of the time official planning of Fiat is just that. Things can turn on a dime there. With Alfa, my guess is that Marchionne was buying time and going through the motions. I suspect Alfa could well be pushed back more than 2 yrs by the way. In Europe they are concentrating on the Fiat cars and Jeeps.
Marcelo, I agree that there have been financial constraints at Fiat. Should they have completely prevented product development at Alfa Romeo? I don’t know.
But in my eyes Marchionne’s credibility is very low, given that he announces goals, plans and new models — and then often none of them happen. (The 2010 plans are far from the only example.) I can’t think of any other major auto manufacturer that has such a poor track record on following through on announced plans.
Yes, I expect there will be some models sometime in a few years. Will they be what was promised, and will Alfa Romeo sell 300,000 cars in 2016? I have much less confidence in that. But of course each of us can choose what to believe; the facts will be seen only in two or three years’ time.
Agree with you totally on Marchionne and on Alfa should not have stopped altogether. But, it’s the Italian style, or if I may be so bold, the Latin style… It’s like we say in Brazil, “paper accepts anything”. By that we mean that sometimes words on paper are just that, words, not any real indication of anything. I know it’s infuriating to Northern Europeans, but that’s how it is.
As I believe Alfa will lose any reason for being should they join VW, I prefer to believe (and it’s just like you said, nothing more than a feeling) that the refusal to sell and 4c have just got to mean something. I know you like your German cars, and that’s great, but an Alfa would be the only top brand I’d ever “aspire” to. And I put that word between “” ’cause I have trouble with it. Especially as pertains to cars!
Marcelo, it’s not only German cars, but I’m an engineer at heart still, so engineering, racing and design that follows function (Giugiaro!) are near and dear to me. And those do tend to be the kinds of things German car companies focus on.
I do remember Alfa in F1, and Lancia in both Group C and WRC … but sadly those days are long gone, and now motorsport within the Fiat empire is restricted to Ferrari only.
th009. The 159/Brera/Spider were developed with GM and the rights to that platform was held by both companies. You know how the GM alliance ended…… No major updates were possible after that without both parties’ consent. Besides we all know that the premium platform (that’s what it’s called) was overweight and expensive to build. It was supposed to be shared by Saab and Opel which did not happen. The most sensible thing to do was to kill the thing. The GT was the final iteration of the aging Tipo platform and all other Tipo based cars had been replaced. It would be very expensive to keep a single low volume model in production especially when the brand was hemorrhaging cash at an alarming rate. So – cut loss strategy. Then comes the Chrysler opportunity. An opportunity that could save the entire group. Obviously all resources had to be focused there. There also was the tiny matter of the EU (and especially the Italian) market crash looming. What would you do? Throw in billions at a crashing market where the brand’s exposure was over 90%?? Definite suicide IMHO. They would have had to forget about Chrysler (their current fattening cash cow). It’s easy for arm chair CEO’s to aim criticism but most often they have not got all the info and not considered all the facts.
Let’s do a rewind to 2010. Financial crisis under way, Chrysler purchase done, so no changes there.
Marchionne plans US entry in 2012, six new models by 2013 (159 replacement sedan/wagon, two SUVs, roadster and 5-door MiTo). Sales increasing from 130K then to 300K in 2013 and 500K in 2014.
Actual outcome? No US entry. No new models at all by 2013 (bar the 4C). Sales in 2013 will likely be half of what they were in 2010.
My question is, why will it all be different this time?
You don’t belive or you don’t want it ?
Yes, previous plan is dead. Present plan is executed – that’s a difference.
@automaniak: th009 is a VAG fan, not an Alfa fan – keep that in mind when you read his comments.
I do have to admit he does have a point, and that he’s right when he says that Alfa has only launched 2 mass-market models since Marchionne became Fiat CEO.
I think what one has to keep in mind is that Marchionne (and Fiat) is operating from a position of weakness, hence the many false starts and improvised revisions to Fiat’s plans. (VAG, on the other hand, has so much money on its hands that it doesn’t know what to do with it all, and can therefore allow Ferdinand Piëch to make vanity purchases like Bentley, Bugatti and Ducati, and now he wants to ruin Alfa Romeo with the same megalomania, seemingly with the blessing of VAG fans like th009, and to the horror of Alfa fans.)
@Lampredi
Yes, financial weakness of Fiat is key point and present Euro crisis only made it worse.
What is promising – new models are market success and bring cash to Fiat (500, Panda,Freemont, 500L, Quattroporte, 4C). I have no doubts Ghibli will be cash cow for Fiat as well.
Of course Fiat Brazil is still strong point, same as LCV and industrial leg. Not mention Ferrari.
Lampredi, I didn’t realize that one needed to be a Fiat fan to comment on this story …
For the record, I was a fan of Alfa Romeo and Lancia when I was younger (Junior, Alfetta GTV, Montecarlo, Delta Integrale etc), and spotting a pristing Delta Integrale 16V on the streets of Tokyo is still an exciting moment for me. And I even enjoyed driving the 159 rental car we had in Italy about five years ago.
But I find it hard to be interested in their current models, and I am definitely not a fan of what Fiat has done to these two brands. 27 years of decline!
@th009: “I didn’t realize that one needed to be a Fiat fan to comment on this story…”
I wasn’t suggesting that, I just provided some context to automaniak.
As for “27 years of decline”, that’s a bit hyperbolic (although not entirely without merit) – after a slow start, with the 156, 147 and GT it seemed Fiat finally gained some momentum with Alfa Romeo, but it didn’t manage to sustain it (obviously, a near-bankruptcy, a union with GM and its subsequent dissolution contributed to that, and then the Europe crisis and the Chrysler marriage caused further disruptions). At present, Alfa is obviously in a transitional phase.
It’s amazing how many changes occur at Fiat between each generation of cars (not thinking of any specific brand), it’s a miracle that the cars end up on the market at all. But at the end of the day, the automotive landscape would be a lot more mundane without the contribution of the Italians.
Marchionne has repeated on several occasions* that Alfa will not get resources until Maserati is fixed. Specifically, that the engineers working on Maserati will transition to Alfa when Maserati is at full speed. Yet Maserati has a way to go, shipping only 6288 cars worldwide in 2012 (compared to Ferrari at 7318).
*most recently on Apr 29, 2013 during the Fiat Q1 results conference call
Fiat should sell Alfa to VW and focus on Lancia.
No. Fiat owns Chrysler now (RWD, SUVs, big sedans) – such technology helps.
No. Alfa will offer new E class based on Maserati Ghibli. Maserati is ready.
No. Alfa will have SUV, it’s important.
No. Alfa 4C is perfect HALO car.
No. Fiat is back in USA.
No. Fiat is back in China.
No. Alfa has great potential, it can’t be sold to competitor.
Speaking as someone who grew up in the US, from my early youth and Hollywood I know what an Alfa Romeo is and what is represents… I haven’t a clue what a Lancia is and I doubt anyone outside of Europe does either. If your going to sell semi-premium or small sports car product in North America, it would be wise to sell it as an Alfa vs a Lancia or Fiat.
I drive new Lancia Delta but must admit you are right.
“I haven’t a clue what a Lancia is ..”
One of the mysteries of my childhood…
When I was 12 my oldest brother married a nice Sicilian girl (trans: Five Feet of Fury). During their courtship phase, her older brother Giorgio made a bee-line from the old country to check-out my brother.
He was a froot loop; a hyper-energetic, arm-waving Hollywood stereotype of Italian males. And he was crazy about some cars called “LAN-chas”.
just a shame such a big name wasted on orrible cars. i drove an alfa 33 for some times in the past and loved it even if it wasn’t bulletproof.
more recently i used the giulietta…. hopeless, i won’t buy and alfa even if it were the only car in the world.
both lancia and alfa names litteraly wasted.
By the way. VW brand – 15%, Fiat brand + 8%.
If we add VW weak progress in USA and downward trend in Latin America this year plus DSG massive recalls in Asia, I think VW has bigger problems than Alfa take over.
I’ve just been told that to the end of April, total Guiletta sales in Ireland in 2013 are…. 1. Their core vehicle, no less.
Strange, last year they sold 120 units in Ireland (Giulietta + MiTo).
Anyway, Alfa is very weak in this country.
Luckily for Alfa, UK is much better market for them. Ireland is small.
But this example maybe show why Marchionne say Alfa need USA so badly and Fiat even consider USA as Alfa main market in the future.
Here in Ireland sales are down 92% vs 2012 (YTD) to just … 4 units
Chrysler (Lancia) hasn’t even registed any ‘lancia’ so far, just a handful of US sourced SUVs.
And Dacia who entered the Irish market in January is already outselling Fiat who is at -62% YTD (and not by few units, Dacia sold over twice as many cars, with just 2 models for sale vs 7 Fiats).
Europe isn’t even a safe place for this brand/group and that’s quite sad really