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After throwing enthusiasts a few wagon-shaped bones at the Los Angeles Auto Show, Volkswagen is set to debut the long-roof product that really matters for the auto maker’s American division: a crossover.
A concept version of a future Tennessee-built crossover is set to debut at the 2015 Detroit Auto Show. Unlike the high-end Touraeg and the compact Tiguan, the future CUV will be a traditional five and seven seat affair, like a Ford Explorer or a Honda Pilot.
A VW CUV may be anathema to the enthusiast idea of VW as a purveyor of Euro-diesels and GTI hatchbacks, but the CUV represents a way to fill a glaring hole in VW’s American lineup, which is not getting much traction in a constantly-growing American car market.
77 Comments on “VW Inches Closer To Badly Needed Crossover...”
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… and not a year or three too late
VW does not need a crossover. Saying VW needs a crossover is like saying a world wrestling champ needs to improve himself by taking college classes of graduate Mathematics. They need to do what they are best at: producing small near-luxury vehicles, and try make those the best in the world by as wide a margin as possible.
Aw, c’mon, so what’s your 2nd choice? We already have Honda/Toyota and Nissan and they can barely give their near-luxury sedans away. Maybe they should come out with a near-luxury division, they could even call it Audi
HEY, Audi is not near-luxury! Close the door on an A8 and you’ll have no doubt they make luxury cars.
A3, A4
I think you may have a chip on your shoulder. The A3, Q3 and TT are always based on whatever platform the Golf family is using at the time, and even *they* have a premium feeling. Certainly the A4 and especially the A8 are proper luxury cars.
I once tried to sit in both a Golf and an A3 at a new car show once (about the same time the 2nd gen A3 came out) just to see if there was any reason why the Audi cost 25% more with the same engine. Apparently there is, and then some. But, I had a Golf 7 rental this summer, and the build quality on that is at least on par with my ’94 Audi 100, so VW is improving quickly.
Wait, so you’re saying a new Golf is on par with a 20 year old Audi and that’s a good thing? No wonder the Germans think we’re stupid
A4 is a luxury car. My 2001 S4 is the size of a Honda civic, but everything is leather wrapped or nice rubberized plastics, innovative powertrain, an interior that looked like it was designed by adults/professionals (looking at Americans of the same era), mood lighting at night, and also the doors thunk more solid then most midsize cars. Its all about dat door thunk though.
A3 is built on the golf so it handles like a golf, but the car inside and outside is generally nicer than a golf. But sharing components for Audi/VW usually isnt bad because they are well made to begin with.
The A4 is definitely a luxury car. Even though my 2001 S4 is smaller than a new honda civic, everything is wrapped in leather or rubberized plastics, it has an innovative powertrain, mood lighting at night, an interior that was designed by adults/professionals and still looks somewhat modern (looking at americans of the same era), and has the required door thunk not seen on most midsize near luxury cars.
A3 will handle like a golf (is that a bad thing?) and the interior and exterior is nicer and one of the best for a 30k near luxury car.
Also it has 160k and is my hard driven DD. Audis get bad reps because Americans maintain vws/audis like chevy cavilers. You need torque wrenches in nm and french oil, well maintained Audis can see 200k easy.
Don’t dis the 100, that was a great car especially the C4 URS4 still one of the best highway cars I have ever driven and it is 20 years old.
They want to grow. Your formula is a recipe for sales stagnation, especially if one of the “small near-luxury vehicles” is not a crossover. All vehicle segments that are not crossovers or trucks are not growing anymore.
Um, no. The CUV is the hottest market segment in the US and the Tiguan is not competitive in pricing and interior volume and the Touareg is too expensive to compete with Highlander/Pilot/Pathfinder/Grand Cherokee/et al. VW of America desperately needs this vehicle to stem the decline of marketshare seen in the past three years.
It is not even the US. Crossovers, especially compact and now mini CUVs, are also on fire in Europe. The Nissan Qashqai is one of the UK’s 10 best selling cars so far this year. The Tiguan is getting old, outdated, and outclassed. Lets not even talk about the Touareg.
LeeK, agree! But how is VW going to get around their quality and dependability issues if they can’t even sell their bread&butter sedans?
For VW to get a CUV on par with a Highlander or a Grand Cherokee would take divine intervention. Trying to match the venerable Pilot would require even more divine guidance.
#fingerpoints
Ooooooo, no you did int! NO YOU DID INT!
Hiya HDC,
We have to stop listening to the horror stories posted on automotive fora and look at hard data. VW has slowly but steadily improved their overall quality in the past ten years. The latest manufacturer predicted reliability report from Consumer Reports lists VW as 17 out of 28 brands, with Audi at number 5 on the list. What is even more remarkable is that cars as a whole are getting more reliable, so the industry average is less and less defects per 100 cars. A brand on the bottom of CR’s list today would have been in the top 10 just a decade ago.
Michael Karesh has also posted on various fora that he sees an upward reliability trend for VW. They are getting better — that is fact backed up by objective data.
On a personal note, I have three Hondas and two VWs in my stable. There has been exactly one problem with one of the VWs over five years of daily service, a faulty door lock switch that was replaced under warranty. The other VW has been flawless over three years of ownership, with nothing but oil changes, free of charge. Of course, the Hondas have been good too, going six and eight years respectively before they encountered their first issues.
I would buy any car today from any manufacturer and feel pretty confident it would reliable. Lemons occur, of course, with any brand. But the most average of average cars will only see a repair perhaps once a year at the most. On average, that is.
LeeK, in today’s world we should expect any new car we buy to go at least 100K miles before encountering any kind of problem. Some of us luck out, some of us don’t, regardless of brand.
And while I agree that “we” should stop listening to horror stories posted on automotive fora, there often is a lot of truth in those horror stories posted by people the horror happened to.
After I came back from Germany in 1980, I made the automotive mistake of buying a brand new 1982 VW Quantum, believing that the popularity of the German Passat could be found in the US Quantum.
I was wrong, and I could have written a book about my horror stories.
I know that was a long time ago, but there are people today who have bought new VW products and have had to take them back to the dealer for warranty fixes.
Since we do not have a VW dealer in my area, this necessitates a trip to El Paso, TX, more than 120 miles away for those owners. A couple of them have asked me to provide transportation for them to get them to or from the dealer.
There’s no doubt that VW is on the move, or at least they hope they are. But I’m equally convinced that VW has not yet displaced Ford, GM, Fiatsler or Toyota as sales leader in the US.
I’m not convinced that America has forgiven VW for its sins of the past. And IMO, the UAW in its quest for more dues-paying members is not doing VW in America any favors, either.
VW deserved its poor reliabilty reputation brought on by the disastrous Mk IV Golf/Jetta, New Beetle, Touareg, and B5 Passat starting in the late 90s and stretching into the mid 00s. The people who got burned by this generation will never, ever buy another VW as long as they live. I understand that. The problem is that they continue to project this hatred of VW on automotive fora despite documented data that shows a discernable turnaround for the brand. I can’t stop people from believing what they want to, but I can at least point out that their vitriol should be tempered by an objective view of facts.
My 99 Honda CR-V (manual!) is going strong 16 years later, but it had the clutch master cylinder go at 50k, the central locking system quit, the radiator cracked, several hoses split, the hatch struts failed, there was a chronic Check Engine Light for a year, O2 sensors had to be replaced, and lug nuts froze in place. It’s what I expect of a car of this vintage and I wouldn’t hesitate buying another one if I was in that position in life. My 06 Honda Element (manual!) went 90k before the cam position sensor failed. At 110k it needed to have most of the suspension components replaced. I still love it and think of it as very reliable. Compared to my two VWs (and the three before these), the
Hondas have given me more problems. But that is a single sample of data. In aggregate at both True Delta and Consumer Reports, Honda still ranks above VW in reliability, but the gap is narrowing. I don’t believe VW will ever catch Toyota or Mazda, but I certainly expect VW to continue to slowly improve to the point where they get very close to the top 10. The question is whether anyone regularly involved in discussions here at TTAC and other automotive sites will ever believe that.
Leek, my 2001 Audi S4 is going strong at 160k and it has two turbos and 5 valves per cylinder.
VW jettas/beetles were throw away cars designed only for 200km which is 10 years of driving in germany. This issue was also compounded with the fact most americans poorly maintained them (autozone/jiffy lube service) and took them to midas etc for repairs who do not know how to work on german cars. Yes they could be more reliable however they were some of the nicest small cars at the time. Except for the Beetle, always was a sh*tbox.
LeeK, I used to keep my cars until the wheels fell off, or if someone offered me cash-money for it that I simply could not refuse because I was broke at that time.
So, I can relate to people keeping their cars as long as they can.
But in this day and age, the key to a great ownership experience is to buy a car with a sustained record for reliability and durability. “Problem-free” is the clincher.
I admit that I was pleasantly surprised by how trouble-free our 2012 Grand Cherokee has been, but as I understand it, now the recall notices are beginning to arrive in the mail, outlining possible life-endangering failures.
So, I cannot in good conscience recommend ANY VW product at this time. Maybe in five or ten years, after VW has build a sustained record of excellence.
Now, I will say this, ANY vehicle including VW is probably a safe bet for as long as the factory warranty lasts. But after that? It’s a crap shoot.
VW’s hope is the young, gullible buyers who will take in VW’s advertising prowess hook, line and sinker.
Like you said, the people that have trodden down the VW path in the past most likely will never come back to VW.
Ditto with GM.
And that’s why the Camry has been such a hot seller for so many years. It has a proven and sustained record of dependability, durability and reliability.
Like comfort food, the Camry is a comfort car. Kinda makes the buyer feel good.
I hope Toyota will continue that tradition in the 2015 Camry. But the jury is still out on that one.
HDC, you’re illustrating my point very nicely. :)
At the bottom of Consumer Reports latest reliability study is Jeep (number 27 out of 28 brands), and it has been that way for several years. Yet that didn’t stop you from buying a Grand Cherokee, a model that has a Worse than Average rating from CR and it has turned out to be very reliable for you. As I’ve tried to say ALL cars and trucks are pretty darn reliable nowadays. Of course there are lemons and outliers, but they are the exception to the rule.
Forty years ago you got burned by a VW Quantum. You can never forget it to the point that you’ll never recommend a VW to anyone ever again. This is the phenomenon I find fascinating and despite VW’s demonstrable gains in reliability over the past ten years, it doesn’t seem like they will ever get over this hatred of the brand by those who have been burned in the past.
The single most unreliable car I have ever owned was a 1978 Ford Fiesta. Second most troublesome vehicle I had was a 1998 Ford SVT Contour. But will I never consider a Ford again? Not at all. Times have changed and if Ford has a product that I think meets my needs the best.
LeeK, I understand your point of view. It may turn out that VW has indeed put a product on the market on par with Toyota and Honda. That is for the young and uninitiated to decide.
I’m skeptical because young people do not see new cars as a must-have item. The Chinese and Asians, yes. Americans, not so much.
But as far as me buying that Grand Cherokee for my wife. Hey, that wasn’t my choice. Women buy on styling and color, and this one caught her eye while I was barreling down I-10 through Phoenix, on our way home to NM. We turned back to look, and the rest is history.
The Grand Cherokee has been handed down to the 23-yo grand daughter, primarily because her dad has an SRT8 of the same year and he will be retiring from the banking business and moving back to this area before the end of this month. It seemed fitting.
My wife now drives a 2015 Sequoia Platinum 5.7 4×4, purchased for her as her company car by the family business.
I continue to chug along in my 2011 Tundra 5.7.
Our 2008 Highlander has been passed down to our 17-yo grand daughter in El Paso, TX.
Robbie,
That’s great, but not in concert with the goal of building US volume from ~300,000 this year to 800,000.
Fact is, CUVs and SUVs are the biggest volume drivers today. If you want to be competitive, you’ve got to be in this space.
In my opinion, that is not a good strategy for VW. Their natural strength is providing euro-style small cars for high taxation and for low GDP environments. I would suggest that they leave the US market aside and simply sell a few GTIs and Passats here. They can probably produce a mediocre CUV that is a Nissan equivalent and makes them minimal profits at the expense of brand dilution, but instead, I would focus the company on their strength. Quebec is becoming a high taxation environment in which a Golf or Passat makes a lot of sense; I suggest that VW attempts to be the most important player there.
That path was taking them onto the path of going out of business. If VW wants to be a volume player (and it does) it has to build vehicles that sell. As long as they don’t mess with the Golf/GTI/GSW they will be good. VW is like poor man’s Porsche and the Golf/GTI/GSW is their 911. Everything else exists to fund the core identifying marques.
I think VW should plan their expansion for Asia, not the US.
Of course Porsche doesn’t “need” a crossover either. (Unless you count the billions it earns from selling the things.)
I agree with Robbie. “Need” is such a strong term. People need oxygen to breathe. Plants need sunlight to grow. To say VeeDub “needs” to build a crossover is to say there is no way on God’s green polluted earth that they can survive without one. I will say that VW does have crossover vehicles screaming all over Europe. They’re modified Golfs under the guise of “Sportsvan” and “Alltrack”.
VW already showed us a concept for the CrossBlue SUV at the 2013 Detroit Auto Show and it was greenlit for production. Why yet another concept? This SUV needed to be on the market yesterday. At this point, another concept will just remind the media how ridiculously long VW is taking to get this thing into production.
Because its VW. God forbid they make a timely decision when it comes to the US market.
And then they whine about market share here.
GTFO.
This is one step, but only one step. Crossovers are where the growth is these days — competing for sedan or hatch marketshare is a bloody zero-sum game, as they are finding out with the Passat. In addition to this product they also need two smaller crossovers, one sort of like a Tiguan but actually suitable for the American market, and one even smaller. They can’t grow until they get these products.
Exactly – have 2 volume cars, 3 volume crossovers. Put on 5-year cycles which would allow a new model introduction each year. This is not rocket science.
Just jack up the Golf a couple of inches and add some cladding. Golf Adventure!!!
If we are using the Subaru Outback playbook don’t forget to add the ad campaign with a B list actor from the last decade as your pitchman.
Hasselhoff
He said “B” list, not “D” list. Unless, of course you’re selling Subarus in Germany
“Just jack up the Golf a couple of inches and add some cladding. Golf Adventure!!!”
As I’ve pointed out above, that is exactly what VW is doing in Europe. There’s the Golf Outback, oops, Alltrack, Crossvan and Sportvan. Pick your flavour of Rabbit, er, Golf.
You have to wonder when the market will become saturated with CUVs. Sooner or later that will happen.
Tiguan is perfectly suitable for the USDM, only its price is not. The one we have in town even tows a trailer once in a while.
Haha if he is towing with the 2.0T he is probably due for a turbo soon. Turbo waste gate fails around 80k on them due to piss poor design by IHI.
So VW decided they needed an everyday crossover and this concept will be ready for production for 2016 or 2017? Timely. Maybe they’ve have sport crossover (aka BMW X4, X6) ready in time for 2019.
An “everyday” crossover vs. a “sport” crossover……..please explain the difference to me. Because I see so many vehicles, pick up trucks, sedans, SUVs, CUVs with chintzy little “sport” nameplates tacked on, that I’m not really sure what “sport” means anymore. What “sport” are we talking about?
Every time I see the picture for that concept I end up thinking “Oh VW called Toyota and made them an offer they couldn’t refuse for the 2008-2013 Highlander tooling.”
With those blocky arches I’m reminded more of a LWB Terrain. In fact, fill in the headlamps in your mind with standard halogens, and replace the logo, and you’re there.
I agree. If you told me this came out of GM Ingersoll I’d totally believe it.
Well, they did try with the Routan.
Yes, the Chrysler Routon. What an effort from the company that practically invented the minivan
Other dealers I talked to routinely just called them “That VW Caravan.”
Techs must love them because they are probably the easiest car to work on in the bay plus they get paid at their VW rate plus dealer still charges for VW service. Win Win on dealer side, except selling them haha.
I shall call it the Crouton.
There you go talkin’ French again, you’re just asking for trouble, aren’t you?
Ha, didn’t even think of that being French. I associate croutons with being Italian.
Tutti boppi crutoni.
Crouton is French for crust
Garcon means “boy”.
Garcon means man. Petit garcon means little boy, or boy.
Garcon/femme are man/woman.
No, Corey, garcon means boy, not man. (And “waiter” — so OK, it kind of means “man” in the same sense that “boy” used to mean “[black] man” in American English.)
Homme/femme are man/woman.
Lift that fork, eat that snail, garcon summon up a new cocktail…
http://www.you tube.com/watch?v=l97DlSbph_0
I think, 8,9,10 Highlander is best looking, most properly formed CUV. And therefore I like this image here. Another question is, I probably will never again buy anything of this size.
Front looks like Isuzu Axiom, greenhouse like Grand Cherokee. I’m sure by this time it’s a tough job to invent exterior styling that does not accidentially copy something. You can only hope it’s not Atzek.
If the goal is incremental sales, and the thing starts at $35k with a hard plastic interior, it won’t help VW much.
If VW is serious about US market share – which they aren’t – then for the next product cycle, no more boutique models five people buy
3-Row Crossover + 2-Row Crossover NOT the Tiguan – Microbus incarnation. TDI options on all.
Where’s my check?
Cadillac called, they want to know more about this “boutique models” you speak of. It sounds kind of hipster Euro-snobby and just the direction they think they should go in
So let me know if you’ve heard this one before:
Have small CUV (Tiguan)
Have sales problem with said small CUV due to non-competitiveness
Instead of making small CUV better, come out with new platform, chasing market share to prop up quarterly numbers.
Yeah, so explain why VW hates crossovers yet they make some pretty nice ones over on the Audi s1de
This looks IDENTICAL to the Isuzu Axiom from 2001. They may have sold 1 or at the most 2.
Used to see a lot of them around Atlanta, they were cheap
I’ve seen very few here in NYC. I looked up U.S. Axiom sales, they sold a total of 19,379 units.
Because when you zoot up the interior to audi price points, they don’t suck quite so much? (until you get home and the CEL is lit that is…)
Looks like $40,000 worth of ugly boring box, I’m sure they’ll fly off the lot. 1 or 2 anyway.
I would think if they could reboot the MicroBus, they wouldn’t be able to build them fast enough.
I’ve seen a few concept photos, it seems like a pretty low risk play to get buyers that would want that sized vehicle.
I dunno if VW really needs a third CUV, on the plus side this one will at least be semi-square.
Kinda looks like a Journey rebadged by the Beastie Boys.
Seeing how this is a U.S.-only model, I’m a little concerned that they learned a wrong lesson with the whole Enworsened Passat for Fat and Stupid Americans program. If this vehicle is decontented all to heck and lasts 100 thousand miles before falling apart, it’s not going to help their image at all.
It sucks because the euro passat/jetta are noticeably better. It just attracts a car buyer who are only interested in a cheap car instead of a good car. Once again good does not mean reliable :P but depends on how often you service it.
I am mad at VW because they could have an unreliable car, which I am okay with and will accept, but they now also have a cheap feeling car, which I am not okay with. It basically eliminates buyers who are enthusiastic about the brand. MK5 jetta feels premium while MK6 Murica Spec feels like it was built buy toyota. So why not buy a toyota and have the perk of extra reliability?
Makes no sense.
“Makes no sense” seems to be VWofA’s M.O. The simplest thing for VW to do would have been to strive for Toyota-like reliability while keeping their current offerings as premium as possible without stepping on Audi’s impeccably-polished wingtips.
I suppose that would had shaken the myth of Germanic infallibility when it came to mechanics and engineering. German marques can be arrogant that way.
So instead, VW cheapened nearly every vehicle in its lineup in a bid to win over American customers on price. Because what image-conscious American doesn’t love the opportunity to own a German nameplate for pennies on the dollar?
I still dont understand why they did it because it costs money to redesign parts to decontent a model. I see plenty of mk5 jettas and B6 passats. People that should have bought a camry are now driving them and wont realized how screwed they will be when service time comes because they bought a cheap car made from not so cheap parts relative to the price point.