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Ten-speed transmissions not enough? Ford is turning it up to 11 with an 11-speed automatic waiting in the wings.
AutoGuide reports the patent application for the 11-speed was filed with the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office in early October of 2013, with schematics like the one above showing various combinations of clutches, brakes and gearing.
As for when such a thing will arrive to direct power for an F-150 or a GT, representative Paul Seredynski wouldn’t give confirmation, stating that Ford submits ideas to the patent office “as a normal course of business” in protecting new ideas, and is not an indication of any future plans or products. Until then, consumers will have to settle for the 10-speed unit set for the 2017 Raptor.
50 Comments on “Published Ford Patent Reveals 11-Speed Automatic Transmission...”
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This would be fantastic if I didn’t already know they were going to link it to a boring EGOboost engine.
How bout that Lncoln Continental Concept gets a PROPER naturally aspirated V8 option?
Or THE BOSS?
Maybe then I can look at your cars again without thinking that “the HYUNDAI and KIA are better”.
For real: Hyundai’s Genesis and Kia’s K900 are the cars GM and Ford should be building.
Especially the Genesis with AWD V6 and optional V8.
And then there’s the Equus…
With the engines that Ford uses they may as well just use CVTs, boring engines going to boring transmissions. On the other hand they may be trying to make their engines appear less problematic, what better way to lose attention on those duds than a Ford-typical under engineered major component.
With this many gears aren’t you approximating a CVT? When does it become simpler and cheaper just to build a CVT?
A CVT has greater friction loss, but 10 gears kinda makes you wonder, doesn’t it?
Bigtruck
what is with the hate on the ecoboost engines?
Its not like turbo or supercharging was a recent Ford thing.
Were this this hot on the Euro turbos all these years?
I love my 3.5 in the MKS. It is the least of the issues.
Boring engines? There are things I have heard the Ford model line being criticized for (overrated fuel economy in real life, questionable long term durability etc.) but having boring engines is not one of them. I’d buy a sedan or coupe with a 3.5TT or 2.7TT EB any day of the week. Heck, the 2.7 F150, being as aerodynamic as a brick, is as fast as my 2.0T CC through the quarter—a fact that makes me more depressed as I type this, LOL.
Boring probably because they don’t displace 6+ liters, can’t imagine the 5.0 and upcoming 5.2 in the GT350 can be seen as boring.
Although I can understand if somebody is used to the big V8’s from GM and FCA, you just stomp the gas and go, with Ford’s Coyote engines and older MOD engines require a bit more effort.
hahaha … oh your being serious ?? aaaahahahahahahahahhaah
“For real: Hyundai’s Genesis and Kia’s K900 are the cars GM and Ford should be building”
So they should be building cars people don’t buy?
““For real: Hyundai’s Genesis and Kia’s K900 are the cars GM and Ford should be building”
So they should be building cars people don’t buy?”
I still have no idea why the K900 exists—yeah, its cheap, but dynamically it falls far short of the Germans its trying to compete with, plus, thats not even considering the complete lack of badge prestige that comes with a $60K Kia.
This is getting to be like the automotive version of the Spishak Mach 20! (It was a MADTV skit about the razor blade arms race.)
The MADTV skit went all the way, but when the twin blade came out, Saturday Night Live came up with the “Tri-Blade” with the catch line, “…because you’ll believe anything”.
But seriously, folks… I remember the chairman of ZF claiming you can’t go past 9 speeds without paying a weight penalty that virtually negates the economy of the extra gears. I suspect Honda is going in the right direction with its 8-speed DCT that uses a torque converter, making the DCT more user friendly at lower speeds while getting quicker, smoother shifts with better acceleration AND fuel economy.
This getting to be like Spinal Tap! Instead of volume numbers…its all about trans gears!
We can turn volume up to 11!!!
Guess we were already imitating the movies/rock icons with 4 exhaust pipes! Sort of like having a salami stuffed into the pants of the lead rock singer…all show.
Look, right across the dashboard, eleven, eleven, eleven…
Whats the point when they are releasing new vehicles with the same old six from the last 7 years. The F150 should have had a 9 speed with the new intro as well as the Fusion and MKC/X, Edge and others.
I would be happy, ecstatic even!, if the new 2016 Tundra 5.7L trucks will have that magnificent Lexus LS460 8-speed automatic transmission in it.
The current six-speed in my 2011 Tundra was a trend-setter in 2007, way ahead of anything F150, Silverado or RAM had to offer at that time, but an eight-speed would be even better now.
Yeah the LS combo of 8 speed and V8 are bullet proof. No wonder Maserati wanted to borrow it. Of Course Toyota said no.
You’ve never paid attention to a Ford launch then. Typically, engines and/or transmissions are carried over and new engines/transmissions come the following MY. Some of the recent launches have had new engines debut, but only the Focus didn’t have a holdover engine (although I’d argue that the 2.0L is just the same Duratec mill with DI). Let’s look at the last major launches:
F150 – 1 new engine (3.5L instead of 3.7L doesn’t count), same transmission
Edge – 1 new, lower volume engine, same transmission
Fusion – 2 new engines, same transmission
Escape – 2 new engines, same transmission
Focus – same engine but with DI, new tranmission
Mustang – 1 new engine, same transmissions
The F150 will get the 10-speed next year. The Mustang will get it too. The Edge/MKX will get the 9-speed soon along with the refreshed Fusion/MKZ.
I think Tresmodes talked about this awhile ago, Ford (and I’m sure other OEM’s) stagger the launch of new powertrains and new models to avoid a glut of issues on new tech. You don’t want to drop a new generation of vehicle with a brand new engine and trans.
Yes, tres and I have talked about it a few times. Ford is big on staggering launches and tech.
I’m not saying this is necessarily a bad thing, but I get the feeling that it’s going to turn into a contest of more and more gears, much like the proliferation of multi-bladed disposable razors that don’t really give any closer of a shave than a single-bladed safety razor.
“…and the 27th blade polishes the jawbone.”
Yes…agree 1000%. Wasn’t upset with the quest, just having fun with it…a little.
If this were 1980 again the six gear would be weird.
Thinkin 8 is plenty, however.
Sooner or later the CVT should be fixed and make the ONE gear more thoughtful than as many gears as possible quest.
Or, if we could just fix the problem of the engine not having a wide enough rpm band with sufficient torque, then we’d be able to get rid of transmissions entirely.
That’s one of the true advantages of electric motors.
A CVT has greater friction loss, but 10 gears kinda makes you wonder, doesn’t it?
Gears add torque multiplication, so even if you have a perfectly flat torque curve, gears help acceleration.
Agreed. This fellow seems to give a good explanation:
Torque and Horsepower – A Primer
http://www.zhome.com/ZCMnL/tech/torqueHP.htm
An electric motor doesn’t have a wide rpm band with sufficient torque across the entire band. A motor makes peak torque at zero rpm and zero torque at max rpm. The torque “curve” is a straight line between those two points. The power peak lies at the rpm midway between those two points and is basically the positive section of a sine wave with the zero points corresponding to 0 rpm and max rpm. The other part of that equation is where the motor is most efficient and that falls at around 30% of the max rpm. Strap a transmission on that motor so that when you want peak acceleration the motor can operate at that point where it makes peak power and when you are cruising it can operate at peak efficiency. You’ll get better acceleration and lower KWh per mile.
The fact that a motor makes peak torque at zero rpm which is when you need it to accelerate from a stop is why they can get away with a single speed transmission.
Eventually however we will see multispeed transmissions in EVs.
Eventually = today.
The Tesla Roadster was originally a two speed tranny but they couldn’t make it work.
The BMW i8 (Which can do 20 miles on electric) has a 2 speed trans for the electric drive.
Whenever transmission gear count talk comes up, it always goes to razors. I have come here to declare that the Gillette Fusion Pro Glide is MUCH better than a single blade safety razor.
And it’s been my experience that the opposite is true.
I’m not saying that more gears=bad, though.
That’s because the single blade doesn’t have the lubricating strip to match the Fusion. Prepare your beard with the right lubricant and use good shaving technique, and a single blade will do as well. A straight razor handled by an expert does the best job of shaving, and it’s just one blade. The preparation and the technique make a world of difference.
“That’s because the single blade doesn’t have the lubricating strip to match the Fusion.”
Gillette salesman detected. :P
I go through 8-12 Fusion ProGlide razors a year. I didn’t like the original Fusion, but they sent me this razor free in the mail so I tried it out. I’m not in a hurry to switch because it isn’t that expensive and I am happy with the shave. (I sound like a kinja sponsored ad. Yuck)
I used to have the barber do a straight razor shave once in awhile, but I don’t go to the barber anymore. My wife cuts my hair on the porch with a Wahl clipper and a #1/2 guard. No use paying $12+ a haircut when I have no hair. I am not giving her a straight razor around my head.
And here I am still using my Sensor Excel…
“I have come here to declare that the Gillette Fusion Pro Glide is MUCH better than a single blade safety razor.”
As the user of a single blade safety razor I call BS. Takes me a little longer to shave but it is no less close or comfortable once I got the hang of it and as a free bonus I don’t need a second mortgage to buy new blades.
A 16 pack of Fusion ProGlide blades costs around $40 when on sale at Costco. The last time I got a 16 pack of blades was in my Christmas stocking in 2013.
I’m aware that single safety razor blades cost $0.20 or something cheap.
Yikes, that’s way past the 8th blade, which automatically donates a pint of blood to the local blood bank!
Yikes, that’s way past the 8th blade, which automatically donates a pint to the local blood bank!
I think I read the schematic wrong, I just ended up with 11 soft tacos.
Did you go to Taco Bell and get the 10 taco box and add 1?
Taco math is the best kind of math.
Yeah, it let me choose the Taco Bell on 68th or 70th street. If I got up to 72nd I had to yield and turn around.
It would make sense if this is for a huge, heavy duty application where a giant ratio spread is necessary. But for regular trucks, I doubt it. IMO, it seems to be bouncing off the limit of diminishing returns.
Think SuperDuty.
As usual, everyone confuses “patent application filed” with “new product introduction imminent”.
If Ford engineers have devised a way to make the 11-speed auto transmission, or more likely, have devised a variant that could be helpful in the future, a patent application will be filed. Ford may be trying to lock out competitors, or simply trying, by publishing in the form of a patent application, to protect a right to practice. Further, unless you read the application, and you are familiar with patent language, and you are familiar with the IP in the particular field of automatic transmissions, you don’t even know whether it is the fact of having 11 speeds that is being claimed, or some other detail that is being claimed and the 11 speeds are incidental to what is being claimed.
“The future” in this case could range from a few years to never. Don’t get too excited over filings of automotive patent applications.
This would be amusing to experience. Rather than a CVT constantly and smoothly changing motor speed in variable conditions, I can imagine all sorts of step by step shifting hijinks constantly taking place. I wonder if it would capable of skipping five or more gears for a sudden downshift, or if it will sequence through all the gears ratios?
I imagine sequencing through the gears more quickly would be smoother and more fuel efficient with better acceleration (if that’s the reason for the downshift). Skipping five gears might rattle your teeth when it slams into the lower gear.
Even if you’re cruising along running 700 rpm at 30 mph in 11th gear and you stomp on it, any decent transmission will be able to find 2nd by the time your foot reaches the end of the pedal travel.
If it takes any longer than that, I’d prefer a pre-electronics GM 4-speed.
Dropping down through the gears might be marginally more fuel efficient but for maximum acceleration going directly to the gear that will put the engine where it makes peak power will give better acceleration, though that could rattle your teeth as you say.
I own an Audi A4 2.0T with an eight speed transmission and it makes good use of all eight speeds without being busy. So I don’t know, maybe nine or ten would be just great.
Just do it.