While we await clarification on how the plug-in electric – gas Chevy Volt’s battery/generator/engine interface works, the stakes just got a lot higher. Automotive News [sub] reports that GM has asked the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) to classify the Volt as an electric vehicle. “Normally, a vehicle is run on an EPA test loop, consisting of both city and highway driving, to measure tailpipe pollutants and provide data for calculating fuel economy. But for electrics, which have no emissions, the government uses a Department of Energy mathematical formula to translate energy use into some equivalent of miles per gallon of gasoline.” And here’s the kicker: the EPA loop is longer than 40 miles. So how do you test a vehicle that– in theory– runs for 40 miles on battery power and then does, uh, something else with its gas engine? While they sort that out– good luck using politics to sway the EPA– the California Air Resources Board has given the Volt “preliminary certification” as an electric. While the prestigious Society of Automotive Engineers considers the Volt a hybrid (imagine that). If the EPA classifies the Volt an EV, GM would have an enormous marketing advantage over the market-leading (owning?) Toyota Prius, AND receive a HUGE boost to the automaker’s federally-mandated Corporate Average Fuel Economy (CAFE) standards. [TTAC’s Michael Karesh has a proposal for a third EPA standard here.]
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Did anyone note Autoblog’s 2011 Chevy Volt one step closer to being rated at 100+ mpg today?
I think the next question is going to be: How will the government TAX a car that goes 40 on public roads miles without paying fuel taxes?
I think the next question is going to be: How will the government TAX a car that goes 40 on public roads miles without paying fuel taxes?
Well, if the US had a sales tax system that wasn’t completely insane…
How do they calculate this 80% of the US only travel 40 miles a thing? Can someone give me a link to this research because I am a tad skeptical of how it could really be 80% of the driving public. Except for where I live right now I have never had a commute 40 miles back and forth to work and running to the store if I had to on the way home. I lived in Savannah, Atlanta, Richmond, and Northern Kentucky working in Cincinnati and they were all more than that 40 mile magic number and from the looks of traffic I wasn’t doing anything out of the norm.
My commute is 5 miles, round trip. 10 if you count that I go home for lunch. Lots of people live in the same city that they work in. I imagine the vast majority of people do. 80% sounds just about right. Of course, a lot more than 20% of the people who work in downtown LA have more than a 40-mile daily commute, but you have to balance that out with people who take the subway from Brooklyn to Manhattan, farmers who’s commute is from the house to the barn, tele-commuters who’s commute is from the bedroom to the living room, and the millions upon millions of people who live in small towns to medium-sized cities who have commutes like I do.
Don’t forget, it’s 40 miles under ideal conditions. What happens if you run the air conditioner? What’s the range if you live in a hilly or mountainous region? What if you live in Alaska or Canada where winter temps drop to battery unfriendly levels? What about car pooling, the effect of driving with 5 adults in it? What if? What if? We know how the Prius handles all this but how will the Volt perform in less than ideal conditions.
I suspect a lot of the 40-milers–and nowhere does it say they’re “commuters”–are the stay-at-home parent, whichever one it might be. Yeah, soccer moms make a lot of noise about how they drive-here/drive-there, but I doubt that it ultimately is more than 40 miles to Britney’s dance class and Jared’s lacrosse game and retrace the trip and home again.
They’re the ones putting up the number 40. And of course there are a lot of commuters who do have to just drive to the firehouse, or the Home Depot where they work, or the local high school where they teach. Outside of the major metropolitan areas where commuters have to do multi-miles, the 40-mile number might well cover a lot of people in Boone, Iowa and Moab, Utah and Los Altos Hills, California…
Oh, and another thing that occurs…I suspect they’re saying that the average _round trip_ is 40 miles, not that the average day is 40 miles of driving. Could be wrong. (Who, ME?)
It is ridiculous that they have the gaul to try and get the definition & requirements changed just because they can not produce what they wanted and decide it’s their right to re-write a term just to meet an acceptance. Absolute bullshit.
There’s a thing in the auto industry called cycle beating, which is basically using a different vehicle configuration, e.g. software calibration, than the one you intend to sell. For example, you can send a truck to the certification dyno with a calibration that gives you perfect tailpipe emissions, but the one you’re going to sell is calibrated for more power (see also: cheating). Honda and Toyota came up with some brilliant ways to do this in the past. Fortunately, they were busted.
GM is basically asking the EPA to allow cycle beating. By virtue of the fact that it has an IC engine, the Volt will have to run an EPA dyno certification cycle. GM says, “Hey, we’re going to run most of this cycle in electric-only mode anyway. That makes it an EV, right?!” It’s a ridiculous request, but what the hell, you might as well ask. The EPA has made dumber calls than this before.
Maybe it is 80% I just want someone to point me to where this study and number come from.
I saw some news post on here a few days ago that was talking about the 80% driving under 40 miles per day and then said something about the average person driving 14,000 miles in a year. Divide 14,000 by 365 and you get 38.35 miles. If this is the way they come up with that number then it is flawed. We all know people don’t drive the exact same number of miles 7 days a week.
All I want to see is how that number was calculated and where does that 14,000 mile number come from. I thought it had passed 15,000 per year. We do 17,000 in this tiny town of 20 mile commuting with all the long trips to see family several times a year.
The majority of jobs in the US are in major metropolitan areas, and in those areas a great number of people live more than 20 miles from their work. In fact, post war planning (zoning) doctrines have pushed housing and workplaces farther apart then they typically were in the bad old days of no zoning restrictions.
Redbarchetta :
How do they calculate this 80% of the US only travel 40 miles a (trip)?
Forty miles a day sound pretty close to a typical workday commute. 40 times five days times 52 weeks equals 10,400 miles, a significant total.
I believe the typical yearly mileage is currently in the 12K-15K range. If the average driver covers 10,400 miles on weekdays, that only leaves two to five thousand miles for weekend and vacation trips, which for me would be a bit on the light side.
I want to know what type of mileage I would get with a Volt running on gas — which means what mileage would be achieved once the battery has run low enough that the engine kicks in. Gas mileage outside that scenario will vary (a lot) depending on how much charge is in the battery versus how far I drive before that charge runs low and the gas engine kicks in.
Dave Skinner : But trips are often done in company. That would lead to an average lower for weekend/vacation trips
This car really only amounts to a plaything for the rich. You end up pay $20,000 more than an equivalent hybrid and for that massive upfront cost you save less than $1000/year on operating expenses.
It shouldn’t take a financial genius to notice that not only is there no payback EVER, you actually fall further behind as time goes on.
As a plaything for the wealthy, who cares what they rate it as. As long as it doesn’t dupe people who shouldn’t be spending $40K on an economy car into thinking this will save them money.
But it will save you money when your wealth because it allows you yo buy a “GREEN” economy box instead of a big Benz.
EPA where in the constituion does it say anything about the EPA.
Why do the people of US give any credibility to a government createdf organization that is not defined within the constitution.
The EPA overrides major parts of the constitution bill of rights. Property rights is big one.
Why? Get rid of it!
blindfaith
The constitution doesn’t say a lot of things. That’s why there’s something called Congress.
And, pray tell, how does the existence of the EPA violate the bill of rights?
Where in the Constitution does it say anything about the FAA, or the NHTSA?
When your shooting B.S. the first ammendment right the EPA will shut you down for violating the clean air act enforced and created buy the EPA.
”
When your shooting B.S. the first ammendment right the EPA will shut you down for violating the clean air act enforced and created buy the EPA.”
Somewhere in that Jumble is the impression that we should be free to pollute the air as much as we like, so we end up with air quality like Calcutta.
No thanks.
…what? The Clean Air Act violates the freedom of speech, religion, assembly, and press? Are you about to argue that pollution is a form of speech?
In any case, Congress is given by the constitution the right to regulate commerce, which the EPA is clearly an exercise of.
“In any case, Congress is given by the constitution the right to regulate commerce, which the EPA is clearly an exercise of.”
Thats how congress legally controled the slave trade as well.
Congress also protected the companies rights to shoot unarmed women and men that formed unions for a living wage.
Thats why juries responsibilites is to evaluate the law, evaluate the application of law and vote you conscience. This is to control congress.
blindfaith
Your argument: “Congress has in the past done questionable things, therefore the existence of the EPA is unconstitutional.”
Nevermind that slavery was an entirely legal affair right up until the constitution was amended, or that assault and murder are legislated by the states, and are not the domain of Congress, or that there’s no jury with authority over Congress. None of that has anything to do with the EPA or the Bill of Rights, or indeed the Commerce Clause.