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Bill Owen from Carport Confidential shares a graph comparing September 2008 with September 2009 sales.
25 Comments on “September Sales Snapshot: 08-09 Comparison...”
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Looks like value and quality is taking a lead over subsidized and over hyped. Clearly Hyundai/Kia has become the car of choice for people who want a good warranty, good build quality, and nice styling. I predict the resale of the Korean cars will be better as time goes on and the cars prove themselves.
Ford is emerging as the domestic maker most likely to remain in business, in fact they may ever challenge the Japanese a bit.
GM and Cry-sler are toast. It would be a “who cares” if it wasn’t for tax money being so heavily involved.
I predict the resale of the Korean cars will be better as time goes on and the cars prove themselves.
I think that will be true once the 10 year warranty is transferable to the new owner. then it would be a good sales pitch and keep resale value up. the way they do it now, only giving the first owner the warranty, doesn’t help resale value.
It’s Hyundai’s to lose, now. They are out Japanesing the Japanese. Just a few years ago no one really heard of them. I wonder how much of this is “word of mouth?” Kudos to them. I don’t know about Kia at all. The fact that VW can even hold it’s own given their meager and unusual US presence, less than stellar past reliability (although this appears to be changing), and the German price premium is also pretty amazing. I’m guessing it’s Jedi diesels from Mexico keeping them afloat (I presume the diesels are dropped in at the Peubla plant?).
A 1 month trend is useless to comment on because there are too many factors that can influence either positive or negatively.
A chart based on a 6 month or 1 year period would be a more accurate representation of what is going on.
I was a Saturn guy forever and would never buy imported. I put up with the eastern bloc interiors and 60,000 mile smokescreen because by and large, if you kept them full of oil they ran forever.
I in fact just sold my last one, a 1995 SW1 with 253,000 miles on the clock. My wife’s 2002 Vue was the nail in the coffin. 750.00 for a thermostat. When I protested, they offered to “hook me up on a trade in”. I sucked it up and did it myself (required removal of the intake manifold) only to have the ECU die 2 weeks later, followed by the electronic throttle (500 bucks and another “I’ll hook you up on a trade in” offer.
I did trade it in…on a leftover 2007 Tucson 4 cylinder auto. My wife loves it. As a transportation appliance it is flawless and is comfortable. My dealer experience has reminded me of the early Saturn days. The 95 was replaced with a garage queen 90 Miata. Personally, I got tired of transportation appliances. If Hyundai would drop that sweet 2.0 turbo in a car like my Miata there would be 2 Hyundais in my driveway.
In short, they are very reliable and solid cars. The warranty and price make them a solid choice.
again, the calender year up-to-today numbers would be more appropriate than the monthly numbers that easily get obscured by seasons and one time events, as C4C or truck months etc. Especially niche producers, like VW and Porsche have big % swings… what , selling 3 more VW Jetta gives me 1% sales increase? :-)
One also could do a 12-month period comparison. So no we’d see the 10/08-9/09 period compared to the 10/07-9/08 period and the increases/decreased for each make. this 1-month statistics is what brought the car makers into trouble… no long term plan, just focus on this month’s sales while destroying brand equity, resale, quality… with meaningless rebates.
Clearly this doesn’t mean squat when you compare the top 20 vehicles sold in September:
https://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/september-sales-snapshot-the-top-20-vehicles-by-volume/?cp=all#comments
Notice there isn’t a Hyundai or Kia model in the top 20 for the month? It’s just a year to year comparison that someone is using to make the Koreans look good if you want my honest opinion.
I just bought my first Hyundai in September, an 8-year-old Elantra. But I guess that doesn’t count towards the sales figures in that gory image.
@Orian: Hyundai has been cleaning up throughout 2008 and 2009. What about the numbers could make GM look good, for instance, whose September numbers of 2008 were already much lower than those for September 2007?
Anyone gaining ground in a recession is doing something right. You can’t even say it’s all about price or economy, when even Porsche and BMW managed gains.
I noticed the list of top 20 vehicles. Is there a place where I can see the entire list of vehicles sold? Which vehicle was the worst performing seller?
I think Orian actually brings up something worth food for thought. If it’s true that no Hyundai/Kia (i.e. Hyundai group) branded car made it into the top 20, it just shows that the Hyundai still has yet to make it to the top in terms of total market share. I don’t think this was a case of someone trying to make the Korean automakers look pretty. I think in general people these days are more interested in larger trends rather than actual numbers which we all know tend to change over time. In this case the larger trend is Hyundai’s growth during the recession amidst other automakers’ decline. These numbers for September despite the C4C party hangover fit into the trend. All we can conclude is that until Hyundai’s marketshare hits roughly 10-15%, we shouldn’t be surprised if none of their cars make it onto the list.
On the other hand, there’s no need to discredit this list. I’ve noticed on other websites that UAW workers, particularly those from GM, tend to get really touchy when an article gets published either about their company doing horribly in sales figures or some other foreign company outperforming them. To that, I say there’s no need to get angry.
I agree that we need a longer sample period to determine real trends in sales.
I think that Americans are sending a message to Washington that they do not like bailouts of the auto industry. I sure don’t. Seems the only language that Washington understands in $$$$$$$. What is going to happen a year from now at the mid term elections if GM and Chrysler arent paying back thair loans?
I think one thing we all forget is that Hyundai Group makes some of the largest Ocean going ships in the World and they have the Market for them too, so I can see why there Vehicles would be aiming for the Top too, its a new world out there isn’t it?
Good graph, but I would suggest combining Hyundai and Kia.
One area that needs clarification on this graph is the actual numbers of sales. BMW, Porsche, VW, and especially Subaru are relatively low volume sales numbers in comparison GM or Toyota, so it doesn’t take as much of an increase to show a marked improvement when compared to the previous year. Also it would be interesting to see how much Hyndai picked up vs. what GM lost.
As an ‘early adopter’ who switched to Hyundai just before the economic crisis began, let me say that price and value and warranty are only the icing on the cake. We chose our 2008 Santa Fe because it was one of the most appealing, solidly-built CUVs on the market regardless of price.
Hyundai has two models (the Sonata and Elantra) in the year to date top 20 in sales (a snapshot of 1 month can be highly misleading).
If anyone wants to see total volume and market share in both graphical and tabular format, that was posted already on TTAC.
Hyundai-Kia together are now up to 7.12% market share, closing in on Nissan’s 7.42% and Chrysler’s 8.34%. Hyundai-Kia has no Altima, but how much does that matter when they’re closing in on Nissan anyway?
Arguing that it has nothing to do with gaining or losing percentage sales, and nothing to do with profitability, just current total volume, so no one has to worry about the new competitors who keep growing, is the same kind of thinking that has killed the Detroit 3. Seeing their defenders (and other company defenders) try to rationalize away the Hyundai/Kia success simply indicates that nothing’s changed.
You can’t make a loss on every single car and make it up on volume, so the market share comparisons don’t move me. Not when sales are collapsing by 40% from Sept. 08, which was itself a terrible month for GM and Chrysler.
New Hyundai’s are too new to have proven themselves (2006+)
I don’t call a 2003 Elantra at 70,000 miles with a failed transmission a “good value”.
I don’t call a 2002 Sonata with suspension problems and a slipping transmission at 60,000 miles a “good value”.
If there isn’t one Hyundai vehicle in the top 20 September sales its obvious someone just wants Hyundai and its questionable cars to look good.
If there isn’t one Hyundai vehicle in the top 20 September sales its obvious someone just wants Hyundai and its questionable cars to look good.
All that matters is getting a car in the top 20?
The difference between Nissan and Kia/Hyundai sales was trivial. Nissan has the Altima in the top 20 for September (#10), Hyundai/Kia had none. Why exactly does that mean that Hyundai’s sales don’t count? Never mind that Hyundai has two cars in the top 20 for the year.
The GM backers want to use total year numbers when it might dull the pain, but then suddenly seize on details in the September-only numbers when it suits their purpose. I’m no Hyundai backer (or driver), but the GM and Chrysler backers talking about someone just wanting a certain car to look good and playing with the numbers are engaging in projection.
And if you want to start sharing anecdotes about problem cars, I have some stories about GM vehicles for sure.
Year to date sales look a little better for GM and Chrysler, but they’re still the biggest losers by far.
Sept 09 ‘08 YTD
GM 155679 -45% -36%
Toyota 126015 -19% -27%
Ford 114241 -5% -22%
Hyundai/Kia 53134 +25% +1.4%
johnthacker,
Orian has it right.
All i was referring is to the always pro Hyundai banter in the comments.
Yes Hyundai’s quality has improved but not much (new models too new to know for sure, look at my last post)
All this pro Hyundai talk and Hyundai has no vehicle in the top 20? THAT IS over hype.
I’m no GM or Chrysler backer, I’m a truth and fact backer. I have stories about GM vehicles as well but that is irrelevant in this post.
mpresley:
About the only thing saving VW right now is the TDI sales. Their gas engines are pretty thirsty, especially the 2.5 in the Jetta and Gabbit/Rolf. I think when the 2010 Golf TDIs start appearing, they’ll sell every one of them as well. There hasn’t been a Golf TDI in NA since 2006, so there will likely be some demand for them.
@SkiD666 and to others who are questioning the long term trend, here is a long term trend that’s already available. These stats were easy to find from the hyundainews.com
The Hyundai’s sale number
For year 2000, 244,391.
For year 2008, 401,742.
I see this trend continuing.