Porsche’s greatest strength may well be that, in this era of automotive homogenization, it maintains its unique technical traditions. Until Subaru brought out a rarely-optioned 3.6 unit to market, Porsche was the only automaker who offered a flat-six engine, a powerplant that was both unique and traditional. But now, it seems that Porsche may have to give up its unique engines in the name of corporate strategy and its goal of remaining the world’s most profitable automaker [sub]. When asked by EVO magazine if, in the future, Audis could use Porsche’s brand-defining boxer-six engine, Porsche’s R&D boss Wolfgang Dürheimer responded
I think so, especially for the V8 side, but I can also see some applications for the Porsche flat-six and future flat-four engines across the VW group. I think it cannot hurt Audi to have a Porsche powerplant in its cars.
Yes, but what about Porsche? We’d heard a version of this rumor before, but this latest revelation seems to indicate that plans to share Porsche’s greasy bits are moving forward. Given that we’re moving towards the last hurrah of the internal-cumbustion engine, we’d hope that Porsche would hold onto its tradition of unique engines a bit longer. Apparently not.
Given that we’re moving towards the last hurrah of the internal-cumbustion engine,
If I had a nickel for every time I’ve heard that during my 33 years on this planet, I’d be the guy who asked about $200,000 cars in one of this weeks, “New or Used.”
internal-cumbustion
That sounds like a pun Baruth would make. I think Ed meant internal-combustion. I wonder if Porsche will pull out at the last second? Out of the agreement of course :).
Don’t think it will happen, at least not the flat-6. The flat-4…yes, maybe, in the new ‘914’ roadster, but not in an A4 or Passat.
The flat-6…I don’t think so. Don’t see why they would bother adapting that engine to VAG’s usual FWD based platforms when they have a couple of perfectly adequate V6 engines available to them already.
the flat6 doesnt sound logical to fit into an audi, unless they wanna a new brand as Ausche or Pordi.
a flat 6 needs more flat room, maybe the other way around fitting more Audi eng into a Porsche.
why dont they just leave the well enuf alone. when u start farting around brands u end up with nobody happy, cant be all things to all people.
The R8 did benefited from the Lambo’s v10.
Unless they start making a front engined flat 6 FWD or AWD audi, then who pays for the development costs? a tight saturated market already.
Porsche already has its own V8, it doesnt need an Audi V8 to go into a Rear or front engine Porsche.
So whats the benefit of mix & match? This aint one of the Wal Mart’s bikini swim suit sale, one size fits.
“The R8 benefited from the Lambo’s v10.”
That “Lambo V10” was developed by Audi; not Lamborghini.
so if VW isn’t making the same change, i don’t see what this is going to save the VW/Audi/Porche group? If VW is still using V engines they will still be developing them, so why not leave it alone and keep the status quo and let Porche keep the boxer to differentiate itself? Not sure the point? It’s not like Porche or Audi/VW have a great rep for enginer reliability you are trying to build off of.
I always liked the 914 VolksPorsche. Flat 4, OK, but as blowfish says how are you going to rearrange the VW/Audi platforms to accommodate a flat 6? Needs a bit of real estate. Are you going to put it up in the air like Subies? With the corresponding increased CG height? Also, used to be a Beetle-era VW flat 4 and a Porsche flat 4 could share components, but the Porsche stuff was more expensive and geared to higher performance. Will they do that today, or just go with a compromise across the car lines, to the detriment of Porsche?
A rear end shunt on this car looks like it would cause a lot of damage.
How did they get their federal bumpers through the test?
“Until Subaru brought out a rarely-optioned 3.6 unit to market, Porsche was the only automaker who offered a flat-six engine”
Not exactly. Subaru has offered flat-six options on and off in the US market since the XT Coupe of the late 1980s (2.7 liter), SVX (3.3 liter) and continuously since 2001 in the Outback (3.0 liter to 2009, 3.6 liter from 2010 onward – the same units were also used in the Tribeca).
Also, Chevrolet had a flat-six before Porsche did… in the 1960-69 Corvair.
Forgot about the Corvair.
And if one wants to go really far back, the Tucker (which was a commercial failure but very advanced for the late 1940s) used a flat-6.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Tucker_Sedan#Engine
What about the BMW 6-cylinder?
“I think so, especially for the V8 side”
what utter BS. What I’ve seen in the last few weeks has been Porsche planning to use an Audi V-6 as a hybrid alternative to the V-8 in the Panamera, just like VW is doing with the Touareg. I think the quote was meant to be misleading, and we’ll see a lot more Audi in Porsche drivetrains instead.
I’ll need to be convinced that’s a bad thing by the way. I might not be a fan of AWD “performance” cars in general, but am definitely an admirer of the higher end VAG drivetrains. Flat 6’s taken past the point of reliable performance really don’t factor into that.
The vast majority of auto buyers could care less about things like unique engines. They care how the vehicle makes them look and feel. Only a very small number of lunatic fringe enthusiasts get all hot and bothered about the provenance of an engine, transmission or platform.
Smart auto makers ignore the enthusiast press/blog world.
In general, I’m sure you’re right, but P considerers are often amongst the exception. For one, there are a good number of Lunatic Fringe enthusiasts drawn to Porsches. For another, and this is not relegated to cars, people in the economic brackets P is catering to, are exactly those for whom appeals to anachronistic features spinnable as improvements, are a most effective sales strategy.
For the legions of P intenders who fancy themselves as being in a position to indulge their fancy for mandarin, “meritocratic” reasons; simply looking and feeling good, pales in comparison to being able to do so, while in addition being able to “explain” why what they splurged on makes them look and feel that way, to all those who care to listen. Take away such specialness, and they would be very hard pressed justifying not getting a Vette or a GTR.
+1 John Horner.
I would bet that in the near future this would mean that Porsche designed engines will make it into Audis, but not the other way around for the key Porsche models. This is due to the nature of the rabid fan base that you’ll find on the Porsche side of things.
For models like the Panamera, the Cayenne, and maybe even the Boxster, I don’t think having Audi engines would matter all that much. 911…well, that’s a different story.
Wait… why is this a problem? This article is written as if Porsche had decided to stop building their traditional flat-sixes. But the point is only that they’ll let another carmaker use them. Why is that lamentable?
Exactaly, it’s engines “trickling down” from Porsche, not “trickling up” from lesser automakers.