Whenever you buy a performance car, there’s generally an intent to test its limits. There’s a winding country road by your house, but you likely will have to avoid cyclists, motorcyclists, residents mad about the broken speed limits and loud engine noise, as well as police officers ready to write a ticket. Highways are much rougher than they used to be (at least in California), so verifying the top speed of your Porsche down a freeway late at night might be a hairy proposition with the uneven road surfaces and random potholes. Consequently, your new performance car will be sitting in the garage most of the time, only taken out on days when the sun is shining and traffic is at a minimum. Eventually, a performance car owner will resolve to take his or her car to a track day and see what the car can do.
When you do attend a track day, there’s always a few procedures to go through, the first of which usually involves paying a third-party company hundreds of dollars for organizing the track day. Then, when the day to test your car’s limits comes, since the track is an hour away and the track instruction meeting is at 7:30 AM, you’ll have to wake up early. You might even have to spend two or three laps in a different car with a track instructor if it’s your first time at the track. There might be two or three track sessions during the day with a half-hour to an hour gap between them. You’ll have to be careful not to shatter the sound regulations (at Laguna Seca, it’s typically 92 dBa), which is shockingly easy to do in any V-8-powered Chrysler vehicle, or otherwise you’ll be forced to remove your car from the track.
Meanwhile across America, thousands of people have bought off-road ready vehicles with 4WD like the Land Cruiser, 4Runner, Xterra, LX570, GX460, G-Wagen, and any Land Rover vehicle which are capable of driving through some tough trails and tricky obstacles. Many of their owners probably bought them as prestige vehicles, or as a family, or for towing a boat or trailer. They’ll talk about the off-road prowess of their SUVs at parties, but their vehicles likely won’t see a dedicated off-road trail. Four-wheel-drive is most necessary to them for the winter skiing trips. Many of them are oblivious to the fact their state offers them the facilities to actually test out the capabilities of their 4WD vehicle.
And these parks with both off-road trails and off-road obstacles are very simple to access. There’s no dedicated classroom instruction. You can come into the park anytime you want, which means you can sleep in. The fee for entering the off-road park (in California) is $5. You’ll have photos on your phone to show what your “family vehicle” is capable of. There’s no such thing as a session where you can drive. The most instruction you’ll get around the park is following what the Jeep in front of you is doing and whatever off-roading tips are in the owners’ manual. Though there are sound ordinances at the SVRA, they’re not readily enforced. There is little to no supervision in the park. Most importantly, your 4×4 won’t be sitting in some shopping center’s parking lot during the weekend. You’ll be out having fun away from the sounds of cash registers and people complaining about Abercrombie and Fitch.
My experience with off-roading parks comes from California’s State Vehicular Recreation Areas where you can take your four-wheel-drive vehicles and “play” with them by driving on off-road trails and seeing if they can clear obstacles specifically built for those vehicles. The best part is all these activities are sanctioned by California, a state that has the most intense car emissions rules in the nation. Amazingly, California, a state where one has to go through a fairly comprehensive background check to buy a gun, thinks that anyone with a driver’s license is capable of climbing a 50 degree hill or driving through a pile of rocks in a four-wheel-drive vehicle with no ambulances or tow trucks in sight.
When I had a 4Runner TRD Pro as a test vehicle, taking it to my local SVRA would be one of the few ways I could test the truck’s capabilities. The park I took the 4Runner to, Hollister Hills, provided enough different obstacles that I could play with all the settings of the 4Runner’s Multi-Terrain Select and Crawl Control systems. I was able to go there on a weekday and a weekend without any problems. All the trails were clearly marked and contained their difficulty level. If I compare it to getting a Chevrolet SS as a test vehicle and taking it to Sonoma Raceway to test its capabilities, I have to take it strictly on a weekend through a third-party that has booked the track, and I will have to ensure I don’t break any local sound ordinances, which I know the SS is very much able to do.
At California SVRAs (though I’ve found it also corresponds to a few off-road parks in other states), the trail difficulty level more or less corresponds with ski slope difficulty level, with the green circle for easy trails, a blue square for more difficult trails, and a black diamond denoting the most difficult trails. Green trails can be traversed by most all-wheel-drive crossovers while blue trails can be driven on by any novice in a Jeep. Black diamonds are generally very steep and not much else. Hollister Hills had double and triple black diamond trails too, but those are strictly for dedicated off-road vehicles such as rock crawlers and very highly-modified Jeeps.
Though I’m most familiar with California, many other states have their own off-road vehicle parks. While some of them are privately-owned, their prices tend to be fairly reasonable (I’ve seen rates of $20 online), while many state parks have dedicated four-wheeling trails within them for whatever it costs to enter the park. Some parks may require a special sticker that allows a 4×4 into the park. Most of these states have similar policies to California’s off-road parks. Visiting and posting onto one of the many off-roading forums will give you an idea of the best local off-road parks to take your 4×4 to.
When it comes to safety at off-road parks, it helps to go with someone else who has a 4×4 so he or she can pull you out if you become stuck in an obstacle. If it’s your first time off-roading, check out your model-specific forum to see if any members are planning an off-road meetup. It also helps to have the number of a tow truck driver who can recover your vehicle from a trail if anything goes awry. As for speeds traveled around the park, unless the trail is fairly smooth and/or is a “green,” the highest speed you should go might be less than 15 mph. Since low range 4WD will likely be engaged, high speeds shouldn’t be an issue. Furthermore, since most modern SUVs come with hill descent control and some with hill ascent control, you should learn how to engage those systems and safely drive up or drive down some steep trails. Additionally, learn how and when to use the locking differentials if your vehicle comes with them. They can save you in slippery situations.
At the Hollister Hills SVRA, one aspect that astonished me was how few people there were with their four-wheel-drive vehicles on a Saturday. Though I went in February, it was just me, a small meetup of the local Nissan Xterra club, and a few people trying out their rock crawlers. Closer to the summer, there are generally more people, but somehow driving around the park is manageable and good etiquette between drivers actually exists. Compare this to a track day, where sometimes there’s that one car that won’t point you by, or the drivers who think they’re Ayrton Senna and attempt to pass you in the corners though they aren’t supposed to.
In the end, get anyone you possibly can to take advantage of where their taxes go, drive their 4×4 off-road, and explore multiple places across America where rental cars can’t go. Considering automakers are making and selling less 4×4 SUVs these days, with the Nissan Pathfinder and Ford Explorer becoming Honda Pilot competitors and the focus on fuel economy, there might not be as many vehicles in the future that can go off the beaten path in the Rockies or Death Valley. Going four-wheeling is incredibly cheap compared to a track day, while being much more memorable because of the vistas you’ll come across. And best of all, you’ll definitely know you pushed the limits of your vehicle.
Satish Kondapavulur is a writer for Clunkerture, where about a fifth of the articles are about old cars and where his one-time LeMons racing dreams came to an end once he realized it was impossible to run a Ferrari Mondial. He recently renewed his search for a P38 Range Rover in decent condition and currently feels Christopher Columbus probably had an easier time finding America.
It’s a shame we don’t have many, if any, off road parks in iowa. Usually we just shoot across wet corn feilds or someone’s farm or private property, note we know the owners of the feilds and land so we have permission.
Bless you Satish. Totally agree.
I always shake my head when people rationalize their SUV as needed to go skiing. They usually run m+s stock tires but view AWD as safer. All it does is make the driver oblivious to terrible conditions. The highway patrol here in BC often issues special road condition advisories to SUVs because so many end up in the ditch.
Every car has 4 wheel brakes and 2 wheel steering and proper winter tires with 2wd is much safer than crappy tires and AWD. Besides, if you truly need AWD to get to the ski hill, you are not going to get there because the road will be closed or blocked until the sanding snowplow gets through.
Hear, hear!
I do more than shake my head at idiots who regularly venture into ski country (read: snow & ice) with AWD + no-season tires.
In winter driving it’s not so much the going that conerns me, it’s the stoppng and turning, i.e., not crashing into anything and not letting anything crash into me. This comes down to using proper winter rubber.
As somebody who figured this out many years ago ,I have off roaded a Suburban z71 and Ford Raptor all over the Rockies. In the Western US there is plenty of national Forrest and BLM land that you can drive around in your 4×4 in the Great Basin Region, a 4×4 really allows you to get out and explore areas that are far away and have no large groups of people or ATVs.
Carilloskis – Many do not know what lies beyond freeways and main highways. Even if one never does any hard offroading one should at least try and venture off the main path. life is much more interesting that way.
In some areas one has no choice but go to an off-road park. I am fortunate to live in a region that is 600,000 square kilometers with 300,000 inhabitants. I can easily spend a day completely on gravel roads and trails.
“… Which is shockingly easy to do in any V-8-powered Chrysler vehicle”
Just take your Challenger to a drag strip like a normal person.
What if you want to see what it’ll do through corners?
Then you bought the wrong car.
Wrong answer. Try again.
I plan on taking doing both with my Challenger soon. I’ll let you know how it goes. So far the cornering ability of the Super Track Pack is impressive versus previous iterations of Lx cars.
Hypothetically, how long are the brakes on a Charger RT good for on a track?
“Hypothetically, how long are the brakes on a Charger RT good for on a track?”
With stock DOT 4 fluid? Not long, fade sets in quickly. Read this: http://www.caranddriver.com/features/z-meets-wall-we-investigate-why-the-nismo-zs-brakes-failed-at-lightning-lap
Totally agree on getting out and testing the capabilities of your vehicle but all the digs against track days sound like a zany infomercial (Are you tired of using screw drivers??? *cut to shot of frustrated man with screwdriver stuck up his nose*). Yes I’ve been stuck behind a car for a few laps but what happens when someone breaks an axle on the obstacle right in front of you? And do you really think off roaders are inherently less of a jerk than a track driver? You are trying to convince drivers of “prestige vehicles” to come to the woods after all….
Unless off road parks are in danger of being shut down due to track day popularity I think you can easily make your case without resorting to “track days suck – go offroad”. Just take out all the references to the worst parts of a track day in this article and you’ve already done it!
Track days suck… (actually I’m just saying that so people stay away and then I can enjoy them MORE).
The only ding against track days to me are the costs. It’s $300 but I can drive as FAST as I can! Around corners too. Plus the events take place at tracks you have all seen on TV. I get plenty of laps, normally 5 sessions of 8 to 12 laps each. And the 20-30 minute wait in between? No problem the car needs to cool down and I need some rest time too. Turns out driving your car at the limit is hard work. The group I drive with provides a catered breakfast and lunch which is nice. This gives everyone a chance to meet up and chat about racing, modifications and general car BS. Anyway… I live in South FL so going “off road” means you gotta fire up the airboat since its all swampland.
There’s a 2 mile road course about 2 hours from my place that does afternoon sessions (at least three 20 min seesion) over 4 hours or so for $50. Heck of a deal. That’s about as much abuse as I want to put on my driver on a given day without bringing a support vehicle and extra tires etc.
Which road course is this? And why can’t it be in California?!
Grand Bend raceway. It’s a pretty flat track, nothing fancy, but it lets you get it out of your system and see what the car can do.
Danio-
Have you ever been to Waterford Hills in Clarkston, MI?
Just as a spectator. Haven’t made it to any open track days yet. Maybe this year.
I’m going to have a Mustang GT during one of the open track days and I am tempted.
Agreed. I try to hit 3-4 a year, because once you factor in consumables and other extra maintenance it begins to be more like $400. You get a discount for doing a whole weekend, but add in my hotel and travel costs and I’m generally out a grand. That’s all my budget allows for and the S2000 is a relatively low maintenance, low consumable cost vehicle.
All that doesn’t keep me away though – going flat through the famous climbing esses at VIR is worth the price of admission. Being in the mid-Atlantic works out well for me too – I have 2 good motorsports facilities within 2 hours from me (Summit Point and VIR), and two world class facilities within 5 or so (VIR and Watkins Glenn). Most of the groups I run with give you 4 runs a day, with 2 hours including lunch break being the most downtime you generally get.
The big thing is, comparing it to autocross the $/minut of seat time is so much better, even given the much higher cost of entry. At the same time, the cost to be competitive in autocross gets so high as you near the podium ($10k Penske shocks and Hoosiers to be competitive in “stock” class), it really makes the case for spending a couple hundred on track days more appealing.
Can you please tell me where I can track my car in South florida? Plus do I need to know how to drive manual? Or can I take my fwd dsg vw cc and track it all day long?
http://performancedrivinggroup.com/
I run Homestead. No problem with FWD – Mini Coopers, Ford Fiestas and other FWD creatures all running around out there.
You drive it to the track, you drive it on the track. It’s that simple. If you are new an instructor rides with you until you learn the course.
Just swap out your brake fluid for racing fluid – DOT 4 will boil and your brakes will be fade very quickly.
Thanks jmii. The swap of the brake fluid – considering I am not mechanically inclined, is that something that can be done at tire kingdom or the like?
You can take your DSG VW CC to the track, no problem. It works really well in Sport mode too. But all day?? Probably not. After the first half the day, the DSG on my GTI overheated and went into “limp home mode”.
That’s when I made the final decision to get rid of the car. It’s a $4k mistake if it breaks. If you go, my recommendation is to take it easy.
Your local shop can swap the fluid out. Stop by and ask them… then get some Motul 660. Might take more then one bottle to do a full flush.
Also check the thickness on your pads, if they are past 1/2 way worn you might want to get new ones. Racing destroys brakes.
Since you have a VW hit up the forums.vwvortex.com and see what others say about tracking a CC with DSG.
I agree; the digs against track days sound like someone who’s either never been to a track, or has an ax to grind.
The local track I go to offers 20 minute sessions for $20 every Monday night, free instruction for newbs, and I’ve never had anyone be less than professional and friendly.
If the offroad trails are as challenging as claimed, I wonder about how enthusiastic I’d be about taking my $50k “prestige” vehicle on them without any instruction or supervision. From what I’ve seen of real offroading, doing major damage to your rig is fairly easy to do. On the other hand, if the trails aren’t challenging, it’s not exactly analogous to a race track, is it?
This article would’ve been great if it would’ve focused more on the, “Hey, here’s a great resource for people who want to drive their trucks offroad,” and less on the preachy SUV-in-malls and anti-trackday propaganda.
I was tracking some cars at Laguna Seca last week! It’s the fun to price ratio that puts me in favor of four-wheeling though. And the fact I’ll get to see places I couldn’t before.
I actually do enjoy track days, but when it comes down to the price to fun ratio, I found four-wheeling much, much better. And if someone breaks an axle, there’ll always be another obstacle, unless they break down in the narrowest part of a trail.
I enjoy testing the limits of my daily drivers. When I have a performance oriented car, I take it to track days. When I’ve had SUVs and 4×4 trucks, I take them off road. While sometimes it’s tough to find the time, it’s fun and worth it to try out your vehicle in conditions other than the mundane.
Michigan has some pretty good off-road parks. Silver Lakes is a good time.
Great article Satish, I like the fact that TTAC features some articles towards the 4×4/offroad side of things, I wouldn’t mind some more! You should probably mention that some basic recovery gear and knowledge of how to use it is probably a good idea to have for these excursions.
I’ve been trying to organize some of the local 4Runner forum members to do a trip to one of our several offroad parks, I myself have never actually gone to a dedicated park with marked trail systems with ratings, etc. The benefit of going with a group like this is that there are some seasoned folks along that can guide and assist the newbies.
I generally prefer to go offroading as a means to get to where I want to go, a remote trail head or camp site. Bashing on my truck for the sake of bashing on it, especially on really technical trails hasn’t had that much appeal so far. I just got back from a trip to visit my parents in NY, drove on some very fun un-maintained forest access roads while I was there. That’s my favorite kind of offroading. The trails are rough enough that they can’t be traversed by any old crossover (not without pretty serious risk of damage), but they’re mild enough that I can bounce along in my 4Runner and not really worry about denting up my rocker panels or other trail damage. The truck really comes alive on these trails, the wallowy yet stiff suspension and vague steering make a lot of sense all of a sudden as I’m flexing through washouts and driving over fallen logs. As shallow as it may sound, but it is immensely satisfying to drive around town in the truck when it is covered in mud afterwards.
Thanks and please ask the TTAC editorial staff to run more off-road and parks features! I’m always willing to do it but I don’t have any off-road press vehicles coming anytime soon. I’m currently looking to get a 4Runner like the one in your photo, but I just replaced the cooling system in my 530i so I’ll probably have to buy the car in Q4.
Cool! The 3rd gen 4Runner is a solid rig, but I’ll be the first to admit they’re a bit pricey for what you get. A Montero Sport or Trooper will get you down the trail just as far at a lower entry point price-wise. The benefit of the Toyota is the immense knowledge base (T4R, YotaTech, IH8MUD, etc), a huge aftermarket, and cheap and easy to find replacement parts at every local Autozone/NAPA. It doesn’t hurt that they’re total tanks build quality wise, but like any vehicle, they have a few weak spots that need to be monitored (internal trans cooler in radiator, lower ball joints, rear axle seals). Engine and transmission are both 300k+ mile units, even when somewhat neglected. I’ve been spoiled by the lowering rear tailgate glass as well, both people and dogs love it.
Do this fairly frequently in BC. Not so much at offroad parks, but we’re spoiled here for awesome offroading trails and (legal) backwoods camping sites pretty much everywhere you look. We run an LX570 with a swapped set of Landcruiser 18″ wheels and it is unstoppable for anything you would take a stock vehicle through. It get’s some WTF looks, but realistically, your’e paying for the truck’s offroad ability in both cash and in relatively horrible road manners 99% of the time, so you’d be kind of stupid not to get your money’s worth.
That’s awesome. It’s my goal to get my hands on a LC200 platform truck within the next 10 years or so, I’d definitely prefer the Land Cruiser, the spindle grille they tacked onto all of the Lexus truck makes me queasy, not to mention the detriment to approach angle. I wish we got the global 4.5L twin turbo diesel here, the 5.7 gas motor is a gem, but a fairly thirsty one.
Yeah, the LC200 trucks are sweet. The Cruiser’s KDSS is better than the Lexus AHC for rock crawling. High mode on the AHC is great for approach angles, but the active swaybars on the LC give you way more axle articulation. Real world gas mileage with the 5.7 is even worse than advertised — you’re at 28-3500rpm from a standstill just to accelerate with normal traffic and we get around 10-11MPG city. My biggest wish is that they built these trucks with shiftable transfer cases instead of full time 4×4 with lockable center diff.
These guys make some awesome LC200 stuff:
http://www.sleeoffroad.com/project_vehicles/200URJ100/URJ200_main.htm
It was always funny seeing those. People would look at my 80 series as huge but then you’d on occasion see a 200 series on the trail and it would make my 80 look like a jeep by comparison. They were capable though. I think the hardest part was physically fitting them down the trail.
I got to roll some of the more third world configured 200 series rigs in Afghanistan. Diesel, stick shift, and vinyl interior. Different beast.
Same here in Maine. We just go out in the woods, almost half the state is uninhabited forest land. Just the “road” (I use that term VERY loosely) to my family’s hunting cabin is pretty decent test of a 4×4 truck, especially in mud season. Since I have had my Rover, I have gone up a few times in the summer, nice to be in the middle of nowhere on a lake now and again, though I am not exactly the outdoorsy type.
Good article, though I think it’s OK if people don’t want to take their $70K Land Cruiser off road, and I think it’s a little silly to go off road just to brag about it.
When I had my Z I wanted to track it, but the fear of totalling my daily talked me out of it. I dont know what the market for old off road rigs are but I imagine they are pretty cheap. Just like getting an old Miata to track with instead of your brand new Carrera 2S, I feel like off roading in an old built up 4×4 beater would probably be more enjoyable too.
Absolutely. Cosmetically challenged old XJ cherokees, old Troopers and pathfinders, rodeos, Monteros, S10 blazers, trackers, can all be found for chump change. And you’re totally right that having a cheap old rig lets you get away with a lot more in terms of the kinds of trails you’re willing to go down. In fact the best option might be to just trailer an old Samurai to the trails, that way trail damage doesn’t mean you’re not going home at the end of the day, and those old Zooks are just plain incredible on the trail. I was visiting a friend whose family owns land near lake Patoka, we went zipping around in his old Samurai on narrow tractor tires. Scrambled up an ungodly steep embankment and ended up smacking a tree, hard enough to bend the bumper into the tire, immobilizing us. We weren’t able to straighten it out with a come along (the entire truck would just end up getting dragged by the winch). So we hoofed it back to the cabin and he later sawzall-ed off that part of the bumper, problem solved. It’s so liberating to drive a vehicle that is so far gone cosmetically that you can just saw part of the bumper off to fix problems :)
I don’t know man…In my experience anything with a solid front axle is priced silly. If I were just building something for offroad though I’d probably go with an early FJ80 (91-92). They had the old motor still and though they lacked some of the beefy mechanicals the 93-97 got they are typically way less. I have seen them sitting around 3 grand. I like the first gen Xterra too and have a real soft spot for the Bronco II.
Just looked at the local craigslist, beat up Cherokees are a dime a dozen, in the $1000-3000 range, many with already cut up fenders and lifted (for better or for worse). The LC80s are definitely out of that bottom feeder category, as they are definitely sought after cult vehicles, even the less desirable early model trucks with OHV engines. If I had a limited budget and wanted a rock solid truck to beat on, I’d try to find a non-rusty 1st gen Nissan Pathfinder. Sturdy BOF, unkillable torsion bar IFS, parts wouldn’t be expensive or hard to find. A Montero Sport would be a strong contender for something a bit more modern and commute friendly, with some more space to do longer expedition type trips.
I’m kind of talking out of my rear here due to lack of practical experience, but I don’t see any need for a solid front axle for an expedition type rig. Most (99%) of the driving will be on rough roads but not the type of boulders and obstacles where the superior articulation of a solid front axle is absolutely necessary. However for endless miles of gravel and dirt roads, the smoother ride and better control of an independent front suspension is appreciated. And durability wise, the torsion bar front end on the LC100, or 2nd gen Montero, or Trooper, older 4Runners and Pickups can last well into the 200k+ mile range without needing a rebuild.
I bought a rusty but trusty ’90 XJ a few years ago for $140 to use as a plow. Needed a brake line, but otherwise worked fine. When it’s not hooked up to a plow, it makes a great bush vehicle.
Satish a very good article, and interesting.
We have off road parks here in Australia as well, but I think these are privately owned.
It’s a pity the US is heavily populated as this reduces the opportunities to explore the great outdoors for weeks on end and never encountering another vehicle/person.
From what I can see off roading is more popular here in Australia, hence the range of real SUVs (that are competent off roaders) and pickups with 4hi and lo available to us.
I unfortunately foresee the day when the greenie’s win out and close our national parks off to recreational use. Greenie’s suck sh!t and are a cancerous anti progressive group.
Some CUVs with all wheel drive can also take a family to places that are inaccessible to a 2WD vehicle.
Another relatively large pastime here is expeditionary off roading.
It’s great to be able to drive into a secluded spot, set up camp, fish and drink beer, whilst BBQ’ing.
That’s relaxation.
I’m not certain, but I’d venture to say our population density is fairly low for the country as a whole. The United States is much larger than New York and LA. I have never had an issue finding a place to wheel and I have spend most of my time on the East Coast. When you get out West there are some truly great offroading opportunities.
Yeah, but we don’t have anything like the Vast Wastes of Central or Western Australia.
Large areas of that make Nevada [the parts outside of Reno and Vegas!] look densely populated…
@mkirk,
Here you can off road from north to south or almost east to west. Like going from NY to Vegas or Miami to Chicago and no one lives there.
In the Outback they talk time not distance when describing and giving direction.
Even on a gazette road it can be up to 1 000km between service stations and diesel rules in the Outback. Gasoline is no where as efficient in FE.
All the pickups with 4wd sold in the US for the last 4 decades came with Low Range. There were a few Scouts and International pickups in the 70’s that had the IH made single speed transfer case. They were not very popular and were dropped.
@Scoutdude,
Really? Don’t forget we do have all of your full size pickups and most are 4×4 here. I think 3/4 of our midsizers are 4×4 and 82% are diesel.
You won’t see many US pickups off road here. They are limited in endurance, load, capability. Jeep Grand Cherokee’s and a few Wranglers are used for a weekend outing for a couple near the coast.
Endurance is the biggest killer, then limited load capacity.
The only time the US pickups are limited in an off road situation is when it’s tight and ramp over is critical.
We do see quite a few towing a caravan or a HD sometime with a 5th wheel RV trailer on the black top.
Yes really, 1975 or 1976 was the last year you could by a 4×4 pickup with a single speed transfer case in the US. You make it sound like the 4×4 trucks sold in the US are like the CUVs with electronically controlled 4wd. Yes a full size pickup particularly a long bed and/or crew cab will not get into as tight of spaces as a smaller vehicle. That is why I use Scouts the best of both worlds, small like a Wrangler/CJ but with drive train shared with the full size trucks, and a 1 ton payload.
There is a simpler way to truly test these vehicles. At least for those in NYC area. From Verazzano Bridge, take Belt Parkway east. This stretch will test your steering capacity, holding lane and absorbing nasty bumps. From Belt take Van Wick north to Whitestone Bridge. Along the way you will pass a 15-year long highway intersection project as you turn left to North, and then have the pleasure of tacking Grand Central parkway and all of its potholes. For extra bonus points exit onto Northern Boulevard and drive through Willet’s Point where all the junk yards and car shops are. No pavement on those “streets.” Then get back on Van Wick and go full speed to Whitestone to test your suspension. After that you are in Westchester County and truly are on your own in the land of scary MDX and GLX vehicles driven by stay-at-home mommies or worse, the stay-at-home-but-dabble-in-Real-Estate mommies.
Good luck!
Lmao! I’m very familiar with your 4×4 proving grounds. On the Van Wyck North, as you approach the GCP exit ramp, I had to slow from 70mph to a 5mph crawl or risk having my car implode. I cannot believe how unsafe that section of road is! If a driver is not vigilant, he/she can easily end up hitting the wall or worse.
Great read Satish, thank you.
I wonder what the percentage of offroad oriented SUV types that take their vehicles to offroad areas versus performance car owners that hit a track or autocross event. Most of the FJ80 owners I know wheeled their rigs, but they were all older and built as was the case with the Jeep owners I knew. Of the cars I owned the Land Cruiser was second to my first gen Miata when it came to owners going to some sort of area or event other than public roadways to test their vehicle. Ironically the owners of older Japanese performance cars were more likely to go than the folks I knew when I went through my big domestic V8 phase, but this is all anecdotal of course.
Point being that the Best and The Brightest are quick to call out 4×4 drivers as posers but in my experience they are no more likely to be a poser than your average driver of a performance car with the possible exception of the often derided as a chick car Miata.
This is true, and I think SUV owners almost deserve more of a pass on this to a certain extent. For a track day, assuming you don’t crash, you’re showing up and eating a set of brakes and tires at most. For offroading, most vehicles need at least some changes to make any sort of trail riding possible. You see so many new SUVs with low front and rear valences, fiberglass integrated running boards and 20+ inch wheels. Going out stock with all this stuff, I mean you’re really just going to end up with body damage and blown sidewalls if you attempt any moderate obstacles or trails. I think there was a bit of a positive feedback cycle between owners never going offroad and the vehicles being built more for onroad. Just look at Range Rover P38, high approach angles, normal sized wheels, no running boards; now look at a 2015 Range Rover that you probably wouldn’t take up a logging road.
As I like to say about my P38 Rover (2nd generation ’95-’02 for the code haters) – it will do 90% of what an S-class will do, plus 90% of what a Jeep can do. Comfortable enough to do TX-ME in four days without beating you up, capable enough to go up a pretty rough woods trail. The new ones are more like 99% S-class and 10% Jeep, at best.
This is the problem with TTAC, I’m now finding myself cruising craigslist and cars.com for a clean P38 truck… I much prefer the looks of these to their replacements. How did yours treat you krhodes1?
Oceano Dunes is very nice.
Another less well known California area is Panoche. It’s a bit of a drive from Bay Area, but it’s quite worth it, even though a big part of it blanketed by a study area where you must remain on a trail.
Of course the SoCal folks have a ton of places in the Inland Desert where they even have off-road races.
I loved off-roading with my 98′ 4Runner but it did suck to beat on my daily driver at the time. Now I have an ATV that is much more capable and fun without the worries of damaging my truck. I now have a Highlander which is much more refined for daily use which works well during winter here in Canada. I do miss the ability to spontaneously enjoy off-roading and exploring when in interesting trail or area presents itself.
Do not encourage this too widely. You do not want 99.9997% of the people who own AWD/4WD vehicles with you in an off-road park.
Good article, people out west really have it made with all the BLM land. That said I’m not baller enough to take a new vehicle out wheeling for fun but trail riding can be a good time too, most vehicles are more capable than you realize…. particularly if you have a casual attitudes towards body damage. 😁
The real problem is the same as tracking your DD, if you drive it and then play with it, if you break or disable it and don’t have an alternate ride….. Well it really takes the fun out of it!
That means you need a beater to play with, a trailer to haul it and another vehicle to tow it… Adds up pretty fast.
That said, I think your self preservation instinct off road kicks in sooner and more progressively than on a track, mainly due to the lower speeds and longer time to contemplate your predicament.
I have a moderately modified Cherokee XJ (lifted, locked, geared, armored, on 33s) that I trailer to Hot Springs ORV park and there are some grade 3 trails (4 being “you WILL rub metal on a tree or rock and 5 being only for heavily modified jeeps or custom buggies) there that I’ll only run with a group. I can’t imagine a new stock vehicle doing most of the grade 2s but that’s just me.
Same with tracks really, I’d spend the money on a Kart and just go nuts before I’d routinely track my DD.
Glad you got out and got to play around outdoors though, keep em coming.